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      11-20-2021, 11:36 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by BitchinManWheels View Post
I'm completely sold on the performance of this vehicle but I'm going to wait for the facelift (literally)….
When it was time to replace my F80 (which I adored) the new design pushed me into an X5M…
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      11-20-2021, 12:20 PM   #24
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Yes AWD makes sense.

Just not for those of us that genuinely enjoy driving 3 pedals.
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      11-20-2021, 12:56 PM   #25
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To me, this test does not represent a significant victory of the AWD over the RWD. I would still pick the RWD for the added fun, and leave the half second on the table.
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      11-20-2021, 01:00 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by adc View Post
To me, this test does not represent a significant victory of the AWD over the RWD. I would still pick the RWD for the added fun, and leave the half second on the table.
But that's the point. You don't have to pick. Just click a button and you have RWD for when you want it.
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      11-20-2021, 02:33 PM   #27
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Now time to compare M3CX 2WD mode vs M3C RWD
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      11-20-2021, 03:03 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kjx View Post
Link to the exact time he helps settle the AWD vs. RWD debate for on-track, perfect conditions performance:
https://bit.ly/3CyLN3i (had to convert to bit.ly since the forum removes the time marker and embeds the video in place)

"In the rear wheel drive car, you have to come away from the throttle.
I kept it absolutely nailed then.
Honestly, if you're gonna get yourself an M3, THIS is the one to have. It's the one I'd have.
Didn't think I'd say that once, but yeah, a four wheel drive M3 is DEFINITELY the M3 to have."


Also, the xDrive was faster around the track by half a second, compared to their other RWD G80 M3. Exact same conditions, same driver, same day. About 1% faster for that track in perfect conditions.
I see you comment on every thread, and I noticed on your signature you ordered an xdrive. It's a choice, and it's great you feel better about your choice, but for people that want a car that's fun to drive BMW didn't leave any choice.

There's only one variant, and it happens to be RWD. Unfortunately I suppose. It'd be nice to be able to choose between RWD and AWD.
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      11-20-2021, 03:50 PM   #29
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Quote:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adc View Post
To me, this test does not represent a significant victory of the AWD over the RWD. I would still pick the RWD for the added fun, and leave the half second on the table.
But that's the point. You don't have to pick. Just click a button and you have RWD for when you want it.
Do you get mdm with the rwd mode?
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      11-20-2021, 03:58 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Onesie View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by kjx View Post
Link to the exact time he helps settle the AWD vs. RWD debate for on-track, perfect conditions performance:
https://bit.ly/3CyLN3i (had to convert to bit.ly since the forum removes the time marker and embeds the video in place)

"In the rear wheel drive car, you have to come away from the throttle.
I kept it absolutely nailed then.
Honestly, if you're gonna get yourself an M3, THIS is the one to have. It's the one I'd have.
Didn't think I'd say that once, but yeah, a four wheel drive M3 is DEFINITELY the M3 to have."


Also, the xDrive was faster around the track by half a second, compared to their other RWD G80 M3. Exact same conditions, same driver, same day. About 1% faster for that track in perfect conditions.
I see you comment on every thread, and I noticed on your signature you ordered an xdrive. It's a choice, and it's great you feel better about your choice, but for people that want a car that's fun to drive BMW didn't leave any choice.

There's only one variant, and it happens to be RWD. Unfortunately I suppose. It'd be nice to be able to choose between RWD and AWD.
Agreed - they should have offered an AWD variant for people who want to drive Manual. I've driven manuals for 7 years before I gave them up, and I've also driven the manual G82. I get why people would want that and respect that. But given most supercars/hypercars are automatic, you can't say their owners are not having fun - a manual is not a prerequisite for fun for all people. Many people have more fun in automatics (including me despite my history with manuals).

There's no reason for anyone driving an automatic to get RWD though since the AWD can dynamically be switched to RWD. Except if they are getting the M Drivers package and are routinely over 155 mph (through 180 mph). Or $4k breaks the bank.

I do comment on this regularly not because of AWD vs RWD (my current 435i is RWD), but because I just feel compelled to state the objective truth when people seem to state, to reuse a phrase, "alternative facts".
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      11-20-2021, 04:59 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by Hedoniste View Post
I would personally go for the xDrive version. It makes sense in my area and you can always configure it like a RWD 👍
You're still carrying the xDrive weight around, so what's the point? If you want RWD, get RWD. If you want AWD, get it and leave it be. Getting AWD and putting it into some sort of RWD mode seems like the biggest compromise of all, and the ability to do that is pure marketing gimmick.
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      11-20-2021, 07:41 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BitchinManWheels View Post
I'm completely sold on the performance of this vehicle but I'm going to wait for the facelift (literally)….
You're going to be disappointed, there's no doubt in my mind that BMW had doubled down on the big grills
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      11-20-2021, 07:51 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenerbahce View Post
You're still carrying the xDrive weight around, so what's the point? If you want RWD, get RWD. If you want AWD, get it and leave it be. Getting AWD and putting it into some sort of RWD mode seems like the biggest compromise of all, and the ability to do that is pure marketing gimmick.
It isn't "some sort of RWD mode", it's pure RWD.

AWD and RWD both have their merits. The point is M xDrive customers don't have to choose.
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      11-20-2021, 08:00 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 02M3ForMe View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenerbahce View Post
You're still carrying the xDrive weight around, so what's the point? If you want RWD, get RWD. If you want AWD, get it and leave it be. Getting AWD and putting it into some sort of RWD mode seems like the biggest compromise of all, and the ability to do that is pure marketing gimmick.
It isn't "some sort of RWD mode", it's pure RWD.

AWD and RWD both have their merits. The point is M xDrive customers don't have to choose.
Not true. The xdrive still has 2 things the RWD doesn't: 1- weight, 2- front half shafts
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      11-20-2021, 08:07 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Onesie View Post
Not true. The xdrive still has 2 things the RWD doesn't: 1- weight, 2- front half shafts
Neither of those things changes the fact that it's true RWD.

Other than the 100-pound weight penalty, the car drives no different from a standard RWD model. I have yet to hear from anyone who's driven both that can tell the difference. It's real RWD, with 100% of the power being sent to the single axle in question.

A ~3% weight increase is a negligible price to pay for the flexibility of choosing between AWD and RWD on the fly with a simple double-tap on an M1/M2 button.
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      11-20-2021, 08:09 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 02M3ForMe View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Onesie View Post
Not true. The xdrive still has 2 things the RWD doesn't: 1- weight, 2- front half shafts
Neither of those things changes the fact that it's true RWD.

Other than the 100-pound weight penalty, the car drives no different from a standard RWD model. I have yet to hear from anyone who's driven both that can tell the difference. It's real RWD.

Negligible price to pay for the flexibility of choosing between AWD and RWD on the fly with a simple double-tap on an M1/M2 button.
I agree the dynamics may not be too different except for weight. Do we have info on turning radius for both cars? I believe the AWD will need more room to maneuver.
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      11-20-2021, 10:05 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sjokosaus View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BitchinManWheels View Post
I'm completely sold on the performance of this vehicle but I'm going to wait for the facelift (literally)….
You're going to be disappointed, there's no doubt in my mind that BMW had doubled down on the big grills
Yes CSL mule out and about like an angry beaver, just looking for a bigger tree to gnaw on…
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      11-20-2021, 10:06 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 02M3ForMe View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Onesie View Post
Not true. The xdrive still has 2 things the RWD doesn't: 1- weight, 2- front half shafts
Neither of those things changes the fact that it's true RWD.

Other than the 100-pound weight penalty, the car drives no different from a standard RWD model. I have yet to hear from anyone who's driven both that can tell the difference. It's real RWD, with 100% of the power being sent to the single axle in question.

A ~3% weight increase is a negligible price to pay for the flexibility of choosing between AWD and RWD on the fly with a simple double-tap on an M1/M2 button.
Question, in pure RWD mode TC is mandatory OFF correct like in the M5s?
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      11-21-2021, 12:06 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenerbahce View Post
You're still carrying the xDrive weight around, so what's the point? If you want RWD, get RWD. If you want AWD, get it and leave it be. Getting AWD and putting it into some sort of RWD mode seems like the biggest compromise of all, and the ability to do that is pure marketing gimmick.
Well how else am I gonna get 5 stars while grabbing a burrito
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      11-21-2021, 12:24 AM   #40
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Question, in pure RWD mode TC is mandatory OFF correct like in the M5s?
Iirc if you have the optional 10-stage TC you can use that in RWD, otherwise you’ll be on your own
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      11-21-2021, 12:48 AM   #41
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Worrying about an extra 100 lbs in a 4000 lb car and using that as an excuse to scoff at the added benefit of awd (and the ability to turn it off completely) is a bit mad to me.
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      11-21-2021, 01:03 AM   #42
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There is something pure feeling about steering a car when the front wheels aren't trying to do anything other than turn. I haven't driven a G80 yet, but I'd be curious to drive the xDrive back to back with the RWD to see how they really feel when sitting in the driver's seat and opening up the steering wheel while powering out of a turn. That special feeling (or lack thereof?) would be the deciding factor for me. The 1/2 second in this test just doesn't matter for a car like this. Where are people racing 4000 lbs luxury saloons against one another? Drag racers, maybe, but I cringe at the idea that someone buys this car only to put their foot down to go in a straight line. *yawn* You could buy a Tesla and be much happier if that's your goal.

Also, AWD does nothing to help a vehicle stop or turn better. The tires have whatever inherent grip they will have. Therefore, I don't accept the notion that AWD automatically makes for a better daily driver just because you can accelerate off the line faster in slippery road conditions. Big deal. It's not like you are towing or going off-roading where AWD actually has a purpose and a job to do.

I'm not hating on the AWD option by any means. If it sells and they still offer RWD, then everyone is winning. It's a great thing that more people can be happy. However, for me, the additional weight penalty on an already hefty car, a more forward-biased weight distribution, and a more complicated drivetrain in terms of maintenance and cost simply could never be worth the ability to take off from a dead stop a little bit quicker. Again, unless you're racing someone in your 4000 lbs road car, that is all you would be gaining by going AWD. Maybe I'm missing something!
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      11-21-2021, 01:56 AM   #43
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Shame he didn't show the RWD lap in his footage for comparison. I know that track really well and that lap would not have qualified for a an official timed lap at the circuit. He went really wide at exit turn 1 and turn 6. I doubt he'd have gone there in the RWD as it's off track and would cost time due to loss of traction (dirty and bumpy out there).
The AWD is fitted with carbon ceramics. I wonder if the RWD was?

Nevertheless a mighty impressive time and clear endorsement from Steve for the xD.
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      11-21-2021, 01:57 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CP911 View Post
There is something pure feeling about steering a car when the front wheels aren't trying to do anything other than turn. I haven't driven a G80 yet, but I'd be curious to drive the xDrive back to back with the RWD to see how they really feel when sitting in the driver's seat and opening up the steering wheel while powering out of a turn. That special feeling (or lack thereof?) would be the deciding factor for me. The 1/2 second in this test just doesn't matter for a car like this. Where are people racing 4000 lbs luxury saloons against one another? Drag racers, maybe, but I cringe at the idea that someone buys this car only to put their foot down to go in a straight line. *yawn* You could buy a Tesla and be much happier if that's your goal.

Also, AWD does nothing to help a vehicle stop or turn better. The tires have whatever inherent grip they will have. Therefore, I don't accept the notion that AWD automatically makes for a better daily driver just because you can accelerate off the line faster in slippery road conditions. Big deal. It's not like you are towing or going off-roading where AWD actually has a purpose and a job to do.

I'm not hating on the AWD option by any means. If it sells and they still offer RWD, then everyone is winning. It's a great thing that more people can be happy. However, for me, the additional weight penalty on an already hefty car, a more forward-biased weight distribution, and a more complicated drivetrain in terms of maintenance and cost simply could never be worth the ability to take off from a dead stop a little bit quicker. Again, unless you're racing someone in your 4000 lbs road car, that is all you would be gaining by going AWD. Maybe I'm missing something!
What part of 'you can turn it off completely and drive it in RWD mode' did you not understand?
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