12-28-2021, 02:56 AM | #23 | |
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even here in silicon valley, the center of the tech world the EV infrastructure is not quite developed enough to call them a practical family car day in and day out. Can a stock Tesla do many laps around a serious track to put down a respectable time? I am not an EV expert and don't really follow the latest but I have seen very few at the track and they were all highly modified, even so owners said they would overheat after a couple of laps and times were still not that great...
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2021 M3 Competition BG Last edited by speedmaster20d; 12-28-2021 at 03:04 AM.. |
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12-28-2021, 05:15 AM | #24 | ||
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12-28-2021, 05:42 AM | #25 | |
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12-28-2021, 09:01 AM | #26 | ||
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12-28-2021, 09:14 AM | #27 | |
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I don’t mean suspension or brake wise, I know components are out there with more being developed but there still isn’t a Tesla I don’t think which can do a 30min fast session (quick driver) in the middle of the summer. With my M3 at the track, the tires begin to fade before the car does. VIR in the middle of the summer is brutal. But I’m intrigued. I’m guessing there will soon be a next gen EV (Tesla or whatever, brand agnostic) who can do this dual duty and last on track. Race track owners in the US will rush to install fast chargers once that wave hits and probably that will be the beginning of the end for ICE on track. There is also that very interesting angle that people tend to buy track cars they see racing on TV. With no major manufacturer having announced any plans to race an EV in non-prototype form, the message they send is very muddled. Race a fire belching monster on Sunday, sell an EV on Monday?
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12-28-2021, 10:06 AM | #28 | |||||
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I easily know when just a 340i is leaving and entering my neighborhood when I'm 80-100 feet away from it deep inside my home with all windows closed. I only know when a Model 3 Perf is leaving when I'm literally standing in my driveway and I see it or hear the fake whine. Quote:
I find these issues resolve themselves when I'm in a louder car. It's pretty obvious when I drive my X5 in electric mode and get blocked. And then I switch to sport and downshift, and they realize there is someone behind them and move aside. To be transparent, sometimes I come across the truly driving-challenged and they don't get out of the passing lane like they are *legally required to*. I acknowledge I overtake them on the right at the first opportunity in a lower gear than I need to, accelerating faster than I need to. Often I see them then move aside for all the other people still stuck behind them.
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12-28-2021, 10:18 AM | #29 | ||||||
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I've long since stopped caring about left lane hogs. I just pass on the right and go about my way. And 50+% of times they do get the hint and move over to other people who are unaware of laws/play it safe. |
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12-28-2021, 12:49 PM | #30 |
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im gonna steer clear of the whole ICE vs electric part of the debate but i still just cant get into the M3P because of that interior. Everything is on that iPad that looks like its just crudely pasted onto the dashboard. the model s interior is miles better.
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12-28-2021, 12:53 PM | #31 | |
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I was in Switzerland before Covid and EV/charging was still pretty rare sighting from what I saw, maybe 10% at best. Where does all the electricity come form BTW? In America and Canada distances are much longer, e.g. there is no EV that can make a day trip from SF to SD with AC on cruising at 85mph, you have to plan your trip ahead of time around the very few charging stations and even then you may end up in a fist fight with others over a charging spot.... have to wait hours to get back on the road, ain't gonna happen with the wife and the kids...have had the experience and will never do it again. There was a study that showed the state of CA does not enough electricity if all the cars were to go electric, here many families have multiple large cars so unless they build more nuclear plants or start burring coal again the cost of electricity will go through the roof. in the suburbs of the US, especially the middle states EV is still pretty rare and a novelty. It will take a long time here.... I think also laws are different, we often see the tightening and then the relaxation of the environmental rules in the US depending on the admisntrations in charge, and also somethings you can never force or regulate in the US because of the rights given in our constitution....time will tell. sorry for diverging from the thread, I was just surprised if anyone would cross shop and M3 and Tesla, but I don't live in Europe perhaps it makes sense there. BTW I own Tesla too but only in the form of stocks and I love it.
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2021 M3 Competition BG Last edited by speedmaster20d; 12-28-2021 at 01:00 PM.. |
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12-28-2021, 12:54 PM | #32 | |
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12-28-2021, 01:12 PM | #33 | |
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Imagine you pull up at a light next to a tesla, you have 10 seconds to prime your car and launch it, rev'ing it up next to other drivers and pedestrians behind a light will not only raise a few eye brows it might even attract unwanted attention from the cops. will just sound weird as explained in this video. Honestly I don't get the point of launch control beyond an amusing gimmick for making comparison videos. useless on the track, useless on the street. meanwhile in the Tesla if you just simply floor it you can get pretty consistent 0-60 very close to what you see in the videos drama free.....so I don't get it how an ICE can be better if you care about light-to-light drag racing...
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12-28-2021, 01:44 PM | #34 | ||
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12-28-2021, 01:47 PM | #35 | |
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12-28-2021, 02:14 PM | #36 | |
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Not for everyone I know and maybe I've just had 'too many' BMWs over time.
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12-28-2021, 02:33 PM | #37 | ||
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And if you want to use your own argument against yourself, ask when you're going to meet an electric car that's brand new and 100% charged all the time. By the time they go through some charging cycles the battery is already starting to lose its capacity, and if you meet a Model 3 with 50% battery on the road, who says they'll be quicker? |
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12-28-2021, 06:12 PM | #38 | |
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Technically they are suppose to move over but when you create a large speed differential between you and the flow of traffic, you put everyone in danger. Reving the engine, honking, or high beam the other person to get out of your way, on public roads, does sound like a douche, no?
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12-28-2021, 06:35 PM | #39 | |
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I agree with your point EV doesn't have the durability on track yet. At the same time it's hard to put practicality and putting up serious track time in the same sentence, so let's just separate the two. The practical side of EV does not come from relying on external infrastructure for daily drive but charging at home. If you have a solar/battery system that's even better because you're energy independent from the grid. The reliance on infrastructure only comes into play on drive greater 200 miles and most people don't do that on daily basis. I have not seen a gas station or waited in one for three years. I have not waste any time on maintenance at a dealership as well. Is EV perfect? Far from it, I still rent SUVs for road trips but as daily driver it's very convenient and dirt cheap to operate. I also wish Teslas are better engineered for quality than for production efficiency. For driving pleasure I am still on a hunt for GT4 or GT4RS, so I don't have to compromise. They will only go up in value at this point.
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12-28-2021, 10:40 PM | #40 | ||
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The Tesla has a very simple interior, but the ride is quiet and seats are comfortable with a lot of space. I suppose the Model 3 is similar. In any case, I doubt anyone is cross shopping a BMW M with a Tesla Model 3. Here is what cars people gave up for a Model 3 https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2...evolution.html |
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12-29-2021, 06:03 AM | #41 | |
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Actually there are lots of EV racecars in europe in rally, rallycross.... Opel, Stard , Kreisel...tech is more than developed . ice is basically dead just before burial. China dictates trends ( theyr market is few order of magnitude above all markets) . In US you still have pressure from Oil and legacy manufacturers but they wont be able to compete. I bought Model 3performance instead a 4 door m3 g82( if you check prices in Germany is about half price after goverment grant) , and many friends have done the same. I still got a 2021 X4m, as soon as the lease is over will be replaced by a Berlin made model y performance. So that bloomberg survey is irelevant in most markets, as soon as there will be a even more focused model 3 (rumors are that is around 700hp) even.posche will have problems here), just keep in mind next 2024 M5 will be electric...if they will build a proper m3/m4 electric not the i4 crap i will buy bmw again. At nurburing there are already many superchargers installed as many people track them..lots of upgrade parts for track available https://youtu.be/RVxLd8Uv4B8 https://youtu.be/ZbOIXB1L4co https://youtu.be/KimlCIqbw0k https://youtu.be/I-LI_jeytBI https://youtu.be/Q2GTJcUKHNk https://youtu.be/Jr4Gi-j2CfQ .... |
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12-29-2021, 10:17 AM | #42 | |
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What you are showing us proves my point, EVs are not there yet. I acknowledge the pace of R&D is high, but based on what I see it will not work with current battery technology which seems to be the limitation. Again, you haven’t shown anything to contradict this. They’re still in the novelty category, track wise.
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12-29-2021, 01:46 PM | #43 | |
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I do have solar but an average residential solar system isn't strong enough to charge an EV day in and day out year round. My property is lined by tall trees and doesn't get much sun anyway. The power has been out intermittently due to storms recently and on top of that my solar is totally useless now, it has been generating less than 10% past week. Imagine in an emergency in cold weather and a storm, what are you going to do if the battery is out... no thank you, I'll pass I'll go to the pump by my street corner and on be my way in less than a minute.
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2021 M3 Competition BG Last edited by speedmaster20d; 12-29-2021 at 02:20 PM.. |
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12-29-2021, 02:07 PM | #44 | |
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