[Evinrude1975]

I had an M3 CS, and it was a fantastic car, easy to drive and to use as a daily vehicle. The M4 CSL requires a different skillset that I don’t have. With the M4 CS I think BMW gave an opportunity to enjoy the M4 top performances, without being a pro driver

[David Kunitz]

Originally Posted by M6-Coupe

Now I found it on their website.
So M4CS is almost 7 seconds faster than M3CS
https://www.bmw-m.com/en/all-models/overview-m-and-m-performance/bmw-m4-cs/2024/bmw-m4-cs.html

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by cfm56d7b

M4CS is the apex of car manufacturing. It does what it does at a price which can be difficult to match.

Congrats to all that took the plunge. If my garage had extra room, M4CS would be occupying it.

When I drove Tesla S Plaid, it reminded me of an aging Colt War interceptor. All speed - and little comfort. My next office chair will be hand built from M3 driver side seat.

I would have a CSL in my garage if I could afford to.

[M6-Coupe]

Originally Posted by / / / M3

What is surprising is that the CSL is so much master than the other models. I didn't expect that. I also would have thought that the difference between AWD and RWD versions of the Comp would be greater.

It's so faster because it's so lighter.
140kg is A LOT of weight for 1600 weight territory .
Actually this is exact example of a track car not 0-60 car.
Then put CSL next to CS in straight line and you can see CS leaves CSL behind in 0-60 and completes the quarter mile with a bus length difference because of proper launch/traction and then when you go to the track, the story will be changed.

[thebigcheese]

Originally Posted by Evinrude1975

I had an M3 CS, and it was a fantastic car, easy to drive and to use as a daily vehicle. The M4 CSL requires a different skillset that I don’t have. With the M4 CS I think BMW gave an opportunity to enjoy the M4 top performances, without being a pro driver

What did you replace the M3cs with?

[Evinrude1975]

Originally Posted by thebigcheese

What did you replace the M3cs with?

M5 CS

[thebigcheese]

Originally Posted by Evinrude1975

M5 CS

You like it more? Ive got the M3cs and M4cs coming. Never thought about getting the M5cs tho

[Evinrude1975]

Originally Posted by thebigcheese

You like it more? Ive got the M3cs and M4cs coming. Never thought about getting the M5cs tho

The M5CS is more suitable for a daily drive, and it’s better finished. The M3CS (mine had CCB on) is more sporty. Getting older and not being a good driver, the M5CS was the natural move. The M3CS was frozen white, and it looked very aggressive. The M5cs is frozen green and, unless you know the car, nobody really notices you. I’ve been looking to find an M2CS manual CCB, to have something more agile in the garage.

[bordins]

Originally Posted by E63M6_G42M240i

Was the m3cs on cup 2r tires? Hard for me to believe it was 6 seconds slower than the m4 cs on the same tire unless conditions were shitty.

In the official laptime the M3 CS was on "normal" CUP 2 tyres (not CUP 2 R) as reported in a lot of website:

https://www.bmwblog.com/2024/04/11/b...es-27-seconds/

https://www.motor1.com/news/684695/b...ing-lap-video/

[E63M6_G42M240i]

Originally Posted by bordins

In the official laptime the M3 CS was on "normal" CUP 2 tyres (not CUP 2 R) as reported in a lot of website:

https://www.bmwblog.com/2024/04/11/b...es-27-seconds/

https://www.motor1.com/news/684695/b...ing-lap-video/

Well there you go. Thanks

[willyp]

Originally Posted by E63M6_G42M240i

Well there you go. Thanks

Pretty much... With everything else equal I really cant see the times being that different between the two cars tbh. I am biased for sure though lol.

[THEROK]

Originally Posted by Evinrude1975

The M5CS is more suitable for a daily drive, and it’s better finished. The M3CS (mine had CCB on) is more sporty. Getting older and not being a good driver, the M5CS was the natural move. The M3CS was frozen white, and it looked very aggressive. The M5cs is frozen green and, unless you know the car, nobody really notices you. I’ve been looking to find an M2CS manual CCB, to have something more agile in the garage.

I enjoyed watching this vid.

[Evinrude1975]

Originally Posted by THEROK

https://youtu.be/KYjdbX2-TW4?si=uVJ17R1W31nZWKhr

I enjoyed watching this vid.

Me too. Unfortunately the M3 CS was with no CCB

[Sedan_Clan]

Love that IOMG/gold wheel combo.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by M6-Coupe

Amazing car in amazing color. Good job BMW
With respect to all M3CS owners (and congrats for owning this fantastic car) I believe we are missing the point for this car.
I see lots of posts / discussions regarding the 0-60 and 1/4 mile for M3CS but I believe the purpose of this car is not just 0-60.
I mean if 0-60 is that important thing in car performance world you can get a Tesla Plaid and smoke most of the supercars including Ferrari, Mclaren, Lambo , etc and still save 30-40k money over M3CS.
Plaid is over 30% faster than M3CS in 0-60 battle (2 seconds vs 3 seconds) ... but still this is not the point!

Per BMW claim, "low weight" M3CS is born and made for track (probably that's why it doesn't have cupholder and proper armrest ); however it can be perfect DD car.
All components including powertrain, suspension, body and even seats are tuned for track and not for straight line.
I would like to see more track related posts and comparison for M3CS but so far I have just seen these numbers:

Nurburgring lap times.
1. M4 CSL: 7:17.00 - 551 PS / 1619 Kg
2. M3 CS : 7:27..19 - 551 PS / 1760 Kg
3. M4 GTS : 7:27.88 - 500 PS / 1600 Kg
4. M4 Competition xDrive: 7:28.57 - 517 PS / 1772 Kg
5. M4 Competition: 7:30:79 - 510 PS / 1725 Kg

Conclusions:
1. G8x M3CS is 10 seconds slower than G8x M4CSL
2. G8x CS is 0.7 seconds faster than 6 years old F8x M4 GTS
3. G8x CS is 1.5 seconds faster than G8x M4 Competition xDrive!
4. G8x CS is 3.5 seconds faster than G8x M4 Competition
https://fastestlaps.com/tracks/nordschleife

My guess is 2025 M3 Competition xDrive with 20 hp pump in power and CF seats / brakes should be in pair with M3CS

Finally this is what BMW website has published for M3CS
https://www.bmw-m.com/en/topics/maga...dschleife.html

To make things confusing, there are two lap lengths being published. In the past, most manufacturers would post lap times for the Auto Motor & Sport Supertest lap length of 20.6km (that excludes the small straight between the GP track connections). Nowadays, most manufacturers publish lap times for the full 20.832km length track (some, as BMW, show times for both lap lengths). For reference, BMW test driver times:

CAR / 20.60km / 20.83km
M4GTS / 7:27.88 / NA
M4CSL / 7:13.50 / 7:18.14
M3CS / 7:23.98 / 7:28.76
M4CS / 7:17.21 / 7:21.99

Now, as to why the M4CS is that much faster than the M3CS, the answer is simple: the M3CS was shod with PSC2 while the M4CS was shod with the much grippier PSC2R (same as the M4CSL). See comments in the videos.

[M6-Coupe]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

To make things confusing, there are two lap lengths being published. In the past, most manufacturers would post lap times for the Auto Motor & Sport Supertest lap length of 20.6km (that excludes the small straight between the GP track connections). Nowadays, most manufacturers publish lap times for the full 20.832km length track (some, as BMW, show times for both lap lengths). For reference, BMW test driver times:

CAR / 20.60km / 20.83km
M4GTS / 7:27.88 / NA
M4CSL / 7:13.50 / 7:18.14
M3CS / 7:23.98 / 7:28.76
M4CS / 7:17.21 / 7:21.99

Now, as to why the M4CS is that much faster than the M3CS, the answer is simple: the M3CS was shod with PSC2 while the M4CS was shod with the much grippier PSC2R (same as the M4CSL). See comments in the videos.

Thanks for explanation.
So the following numbers now make sense.

Auto Motor & Sport lap( 20.6 km) with Cup 2 tire
M4 Competition:7:30.79
M4 Competition xDrive : 7:28.57
M3 CS:7:23.97

CS is 4.5 seconds faster than CX if M4CS and M3CS are identical over the ring.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by M6-Coupe

Thanks for explanation.
So the following numbers now make sense.

Auto Motor & Sport lap( 20.6 km) with Cup 2 tire
M4 Competition:7:30.79
M4 Competition xDrive : 7:28.57
M3 CS:7:23.97

CS is 4.5 seconds faster than CX if M4CS and M3CS are identical over the ring.

Unfortunately , you can’t do that direct comparison either, since this M3cs time was done by BMW own testing, while the M4C and M4Cx times are from the actual AM&S supertest done by the magazine. Times done by factory test drivers will always be better than times done by the magazine.

For a more representative comparison with the M4C and M4cx times you show, we need to compare with the AM&S time of 7:27.19 for the M3cs:

[M6-Coupe]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Unfortunately , you can’t do that direct comparison either, since this M3cs time was done by BMW own testing, while the M4C and M4Cx times are from the actual AM&S supertest done by the magazine. Times done by factory test drivers will always be better than times done by the magazine.

For a more representative comparison with the M4C and M4cx times you show, we need to compare with the AM&S time of 7:27.19 for the M3cs:

LOL.
I think I'm done here
So numbers that recorded for Nurburgring lap are meaningless in general because they all depend on driver/tires/magazines/factory...
All we can say is that CSL is faster than CS and CS is faster than CX and CX is faster than C
I'm wondering what would be M5CS lap time with Cup 2R.

[Hit_Apex]

Not meaningless, it's useful data but the context needs to be understood and interpreted accordingly.

[M6-Coupe]

Originally Posted by Hit_Apex

Not meaningless, it's useful data but the context needs to be understood and interpreted accordingly.

By meaningless I mean not accurate enough to judge about justifications which was my original discussion here.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by M6-Coupe

LOL.
I think I'm done here
So numbers that recorded for Nurburgring lap are meaningless in general because they all depend on driver/tires/magazines/factory...
All we can say is that CSL is faster than CS and CS is faster than CX and CX is faster than C
I'm wondering what would be M5CS lap time with Cup 2R.

Originally Posted by M6-Coupe

By meaningless I mean not accurate enough to judge about justifications which was my original discussion here.

Track times are not “meaningless”, quite the contrary. They just need to be taken in context for proper apples-to-apples comparisons. They are just one more input to understand the relative performance difference between different vehicles.

[M6-Coupe]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Track times are not “meaningless”, quite the contrary. They just need to be taken in context for proper apples-to-apples comparisons. They are just one more input to understand the relative performance difference between different vehicles.

Correct and that’s my point.
For example I can say adding xDrive to M4C for 3k will help around 2 seconds improvement regardless of extra weight.