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      09-21-2024, 10:35 PM   #1
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23 M3 Comp. X First Track Day

I recently took my brand new 2023 M3 Competition X Drive for its inaugural track day at Homestead in Miami, FL, exactly three weeks after purchasing it. Having previously owned an F80 M3 CS and a C63s, my anticipation to test this platform on the track was high. Despite being completely stock—still equipped with original OEM fluids, pads, and the less impressive factory-installed Pirellis—the car had been impressive on the street. However, its performance on the track told a different story.

During the track day, the car held up well initially, but by the fifth lap, the tires heated up to about 170°F, and I began to experience noticeable sliding, even with the X Drive's capabilities. Mid-turn, the car slid out completely, which was a bit unnerving. Given this, I'm considering upgrading to Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 tires, although I'm skeptical if the 4S tires would offer any significant improvement over the current Pirellis.

Although the M3 packs over 500 horsepower, which makes it a beast on public roads, it somehow didn’t translate as effectively on the track, especially compared to some seriously quick competitors like the Manthey GT3, GT3RS, GT4RS, and ZL1. This has led me to consider additional modifications to enhance its track performance. Specifically, I've been contemplating a CS flash—not for horsepower, as I'm aware it doesn’t add any, but to potentially refine the steering and differential. I'm curious if anyone has experienced noticeable improvements from these flashes?

I'd appreciate any feedback from the forum on tires, brakes, and the effectiveness of a CS flash. Moreover, considering this vehicle is also my daily driver, yet I plan to track it monthly, I’m keen to know what other modifications might be worth investing in to better balance its dual roles. Any recommendations or experiences shared would be greatly appreciated as I continue to fine-tune for both road and track use.
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      09-21-2024, 11:06 PM   #2
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It is great to hear another G80 being on track, well done!

Do you have prior track experience with other cars, or was this your first time?
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      09-22-2024, 08:20 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by BackOnBlack View Post
It is great to hear another G80 being on track, well done!

Do you have prior track experience with other cars, or was this your first time?

I do.
I tracked my '17 C63s around 8 times... and the M3cs 2 times.
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      09-22-2024, 08:22 AM   #4
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I had the car in my M2 preset...
Everything on the most aggressive setting, MDM Traction off 4WD Sport.

Starting to think I shouldn't have had MDM on and kept traction on as I'm reading other posts.
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      09-22-2024, 09:48 AM   #5
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Assuming you are an intermediate driver, the best place to start your modifications are tires and brakes.

There are several tire choices available for track purposes depending on what you are expecting from them, including Yoko AD09, GY SuperCar 3 and variants, Cup2/Cup2R, Nakang CSR, etc. One note: I don't have experience with Pirellis, but my experience is that the PS4S tires are their peak grip when temps are between 190-220 Fdeg and 38-42 psi on the G80 (many will comment differently).

As for brakes, track-oriented pads make world of difference in performance, along with high-temp brake fluid.

Then, comes camber plates, wheels, possibly coilovers, etc., the list will go on and on. There aren't any modifications you can make to the car that will make it hang with GT4RS, GT3/RS, Zl1, which are pretty much single purpose vehicles.

The only modification you can make until you are in advanced driver run groups that will allow you to run faster than those cars is the driver itself. One can drive better than those drivers in the beginner and intermediate driver groups and look good for sure
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      09-22-2024, 09:51 AM   #6
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I’d recommend upgraded monoballs that I believe are still suitable for daily driver + track vehicle. As long as you don’t mind increase in NVH.
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      09-22-2024, 10:42 AM   #7
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Tires and alignment.
Track time will be biggest improvement. From my tenth or so day to thousands in after decades of racing you will pick up seconds. That track especially is all about weight transfer in our heavy cars.
I ran MP tires and found above 200 temps times dropped off bad. 160 plus was good balance
Tires recommended would like be a 1-3 second a lap improvement off your zeros.
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      09-23-2024, 10:48 AM   #8
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You need more seat time with an instructor. Once they've signed off on accomplishing what you needed to improve, hire professional coaching.

Throwing parts at this problem isn't going to solve it.
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      09-23-2024, 01:00 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zarov View Post
I recently took my brand new 2023 M3 Competition X Drive for its inaugural track day at Homestead in Miami, FL, exactly three weeks after purchasing it. Having previously owned an F80 M3 CS and a C63s, my anticipation to test this platform on the track was high. Despite being completely stock—still equipped with original OEM fluids, pads, and the less impressive factory-installed Pirellis—the car had been impressive on the street. However, its performance on the track told a different story.

During the track day, the car held up well initially, but by the fifth lap, the tires heated up to about 170°F, and I began to experience noticeable sliding, even with the X Drive's capabilities. Mid-turn, the car slid out completely, which was a bit unnerving. Given this, I'm considering upgrading to Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 tires, although I'm skeptical if the 4S tires would offer any significant improvement over the current Pirellis.

Although the M3 packs over 500 horsepower, which makes it a beast on public roads, it somehow didn’t translate as effectively on the track, especially compared to some seriously quick competitors like the Manthey GT3, GT3RS, GT4RS, and ZL1. This has led me to consider additional modifications to enhance its track performance. Specifically, I've been contemplating a CS flash—not for horsepower, as I'm aware it doesn’t add any, but to potentially refine the steering and differential. I'm curious if anyone has experienced noticeable improvements from these flashes?

I'd appreciate any feedback from the forum on tires, brakes, and the effectiveness of a CS flash. Moreover, considering this vehicle is also my daily driver, yet I plan to track it monthly, I’m keen to know what other modifications might be worth investing in to better balance its dual roles. Any recommendations or experiences shared would be greatly appreciated as I continue to fine-tune for both road and track use.
You sound like you are relatively new to track driving, and I have a very important piece of advice for you. Despite what you read here about what you absolutely need to add to your car to make it much faster on track don't do it. There are dozens of parts that can improve your time, but at this point the most important thing you need is instruction and more seat time. There are only three parts swaps that you will need for now. Better tires, better brake pads, and high temp brake fluid.. Actually, you will need these soon even if you never go on a track again.

Get familiar with the car first, and then start adding expensive parts. Keep in mind though that no matter what you do you will never keep up with or pass late model Porsches, Vetts, and top tier Camaros and Mustangs without adding lots of extra power (AKA Tunes). At this point it is better that you don't do that.

The next place to improve time, handling, and tire wear is the suspension (camber plates, and track focused suspension kit of your choice). At this point it starts to get expensive, and it only gets more so from there. Read and learn. You do not need every shiny bit out there to become the fastest kid on your block. Many of them do not provide a good return on investment anyway. Like I said, learn and practice. Without this the shiny bits will do very little for you.
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      09-23-2024, 01:52 PM   #10
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I'm no pro, by this wasn't my first time either... This was my 10th time out on track but I will say, this was my first time with this M3. Therefore, yes, I'm new to track driving in the M3.


I agree with you on all points. What pads and tires do you recommend? I've heard mixed reviews on PS4. I plan on keeping it stock tune wise until I really need additional power.

On a final note, you're correct. I'll improve with every event.
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      09-26-2024, 06:15 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BackOnBlack View Post
Assuming you are an intermediate driver, the best place to start your modifications are tires and brakes.

There are several tire choices available for track purposes depending on what you are expecting from them, including Yoko AD09, GY SuperCar 3 and variants, Cup2/Cup2R, Nakang CSR, etc. One note: I don't have experience with Pirellis, but my experience is that the PS4S tires are their peak grip when temps are between 190-220 Fdeg and 38-42 psi on the G80 (many will comment differently).

As for brakes, track-oriented pads make world of difference in performance, along with high-temp brake fluid.

Then, comes camber plates, wheels, possibly coilovers, etc., the list will go on and on. There aren't any modifications you can make to the car that will make it hang with GT4RS, GT3/RS, Zl1, which are pretty much single purpose vehicles.

The only modification you can make until you are in advanced driver run groups that will allow you to run faster than those cars is the driver itself. One can drive better than those drivers in the beginner and intermediate driver groups and look good for sure
when you are trying to hustle around 3550 pounds in corners it takes a different kind of finesse... I do 4 - 6 HPDEs and year (Saturday/Sunday) 4 sessions a day(30 minutes each about). Driver instructors that have equivalent cars (high hp and heavy yet capable) are hard to get paired up to. But if you do it is a great learning experience.

I have BMW change fluid every year, never has been a problem for intermediate(+) driving. I drive Barber/VIR/Summit/CMP/Robeling .. EBC Blue stuff, not a full track pad, and gets some fade but manageable.
I drive the car to and from the track (3 - 8 hours) and road trips. I carry my track box and 4 mounted Goodyear Supercar 3 in the back seat, fits perfect. I agree with having gone through 3 sets of PS4S tires that their peak grip when temps are between 190-220 Fdeg and 38-42 psi A note from someone that used to drive track tires to the track... sucks when you've prepped the car, and run over the only screw in 300 miles and ruins your weekend on the track.

Glad you are on the track learning and enjoying the car. Just remember it is heavy, and even the CSL looses some weight, but it is heavy as a track car and takes a ton of hustling to get it around a challenging track. Have fun.
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      09-30-2024, 07:43 AM   #12
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You need better tires. I havent tracked on Homestead yet, but on Sebring, with the P4S you would be passing various Vette Z06 and GT3 or GT4 drivers, on novice and intermediate groups. As others pointed out, its very dependent on driver skills. So in a trackday, you will be passing cars that are theorically way faster, and be passed by others that are supposedly slower.
If you want to get a handle on how you are progressing, get a Garmin Catalyst and start measuring your lap times. There is also a leaderboard in the app, so you can check your times compared to others, if that is your thing.

I think we are able to make a M3 Comp xDrive as fast on track as a ***stock*** GT3, without sacrificing daily usage, considering the same driver and same tires. Actually, this is my objective (with my M3 CS), so I can stop dreaming about a GT3 (and dream only about the GT3 RS). Not sure if I ll get there, though.

But there is no way a person driving a M3 will be fasfer than the same person driving a GT3 RS, imho.

Btw, as far as I could see on the web, the stock 992 GT3 is faster than the stock GT4 RS.
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      09-30-2024, 11:20 AM   #13
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A good GT3 driver (992) should be faster in any case. You just don't get very many of those on track.
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      10-01-2024, 10:12 AM   #14
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The difference between your first to tenth time on track is big. However the difference between 10 and 100 is fairly large also.
I would do brake fluid, pads, and tires and an alignment and then go have fun
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      10-11-2024, 08:58 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zarov View Post
I'm no pro, by this wasn't my first time either... This was my 10th time out on track but I will say, this was my first time with this M3. Therefore, yes, I'm new to track driving in the M3.


I agree with you on all points. What pads and tires do you recommend? I've heard mixed reviews on PS4. I plan on keeping it stock tune wise until I really need additional power.

On a final note, you're correct. I'll improve with every event.
4WD is always faster for me than 4WD sport. The car rotates perfectly fine in 4WD and you don’t lose time from the additional slip angles you get from 4WD sport.

PS4’s will be faster than your current tires but I’d just focus on a brake fluid change, running in 4WD with DCS on (at first) and quality seat time with an instructor. If you’re serious about tracking and don’t want to quickly kill your tires put in camber plates and get a proper alignment.

There’s no scenario where I’ve found 4WD sport faster than 4WD. (DCS on, MDM or DSC fully off I’m always in 4WD)
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      12-09-2024, 06:29 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zarov View Post
I recently took my brand new 2023 M3 Competition X Drive for its inaugural track day at Homestead in Miami, FL, exactly three weeks after purchasing it. Having previously owned an F80 M3 CS and a C63s, my anticipation to test this platform on the track was high. Despite being completely stock—still equipped with original OEM fluids, pads, and the less impressive factory-installed Pirellis—the car had been impressive on the street. However, its performance on the track told a different story.

During the track day, the car held up well initially, but by the fifth lap, the tires heated up to about 170°F, and I began to experience noticeable sliding, even with the X Drive's capabilities. Mid-turn, the car slid out completely, which was a bit unnerving. Given this, I'm considering upgrading to Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 tires, although I'm skeptical if the 4S tires would offer any significant improvement over the current Pirellis.

Although the M3 packs over 500 horsepower, which makes it a beast on public roads, it somehow didn’t translate as effectively on the track, especially compared to some seriously quick competitors like the Manthey GT3, GT3RS, GT4RS, and ZL1. This has led me to consider additional modifications to enhance its track performance. Specifically, I've been contemplating a CS flash—not for horsepower, as I'm aware it doesn’t add any, but to potentially refine the steering and differential. I'm curious if anyone has experienced noticeable improvements from these flashes?

I'd appreciate any feedback from the forum on tires, brakes, and the effectiveness of a CS flash. Moreover, considering this vehicle is also my daily driver, yet I plan to track it monthly, I’m keen to know what other modifications might be worth investing in to better balance its dual roles. Any recommendations or experiences shared would be greatly appreciated as I continue to fine-tune for both road and track use.
Couple of suggestions:
- Use 4WD mode and not 4WD sport
- Leave DSC enabled to start
- CS flash for suspension will not work for you, the shocks are physically different between the two models. You could do the trans and diff flash though.
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      12-09-2024, 07:05 PM   #17
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Honestly - If you want to keep up with the likes of a Manthey GT3, GT3RS, GT4RS, or ZL1, then you need to get one of those cars. Even if you were to dump serious money into your M3 Competition X Drive you will never hang with these cars, especially the Manthey GT3.
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      12-09-2024, 08:40 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markw10702 View Post
Honestly - If you want to keep up with the likes of a Manthey GT3, GT3RS, GT4RS, or ZL1, then you need to get one of those cars. Even if you were to dump serious money into your M3 Competition X Drive you will never hang with these cars, especially the Manthey GT3.
Porsches in another league, but still you can improve handling with some basic mods like track alignment, tyres, proper pads and of course bucket seat
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      12-09-2024, 10:22 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markw10702 View Post
Honestly - If you want to keep up with the likes of a Manthey GT3, GT3RS, GT4RS, or ZL1, then you need to get one of those cars. Even if you were to dump serious money into your M3 Competition X Drive you will never hang with these cars, especially the Manthey GT3.
I guess it depends on what you mean by "serious money". I suspect that with Cup 2Rs, coilovers, monoballs, track alignment, big brake kit and a tuned ECU a M3X would hang with these cars on a lot of tracks for maybe $10k. It obviously wouldn't be the same as a GT3 and probably wouldn't be faster. But it would be close, and you could buy at least 3 modified G80 M3X for the price of a single GT3.
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      12-10-2024, 10:49 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by user12464 View Post
I guess it depends on what you mean by "serious money". I suspect that with Cup 2Rs, coilovers, monoballs, track alignment, big brake kit and a tuned ECU a M3X would hang with these cars on a lot of tracks for maybe $10k. It obviously wouldn't be the same as a GT3 and probably wouldn't be faster. But it would be close, and you could buy at least 3 modified G80 M3X for the price of a single GT3.
You'd need a lot more grip than Cup 2Rs to hang with a good driver in one of those cars. (992/later gen)

The weight penalty is your biggest issue to overcome and front struts just don't work the way double wishbones do in the corners.

Realistically, you can keep up with most of those cars if you're a good driver because 90% of Porsche track guys aren't pushing those cars to their limit and are usually very careful.

You can probably hang with a 991.1 though a really good driver will probably get more out of it.
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      12-10-2024, 11:54 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by user12464 View Post
I guess it depends on what you mean by "serious money". I suspect that with Cup 2Rs, coilovers, monoballs, track alignment, big brake kit and a tuned ECU a M3X would hang with these cars on a lot of tracks for maybe $10k. It obviously wouldn't be the same as a GT3 and probably wouldn't be faster. But it would be close, and you could buy at least 3 modified G80 M3X for the price of a single GT3.
A front and rear BBK will run you $10k alone.

https://www.essexparts.com/ap-racing...8372mm-g80-g82

https://www.essexparts.com/ap-racing...-m2-g80-m3-epb

I am talking $30k+ and even then, you will still be 5 to 10 car lengths behind any of these cars.

The M3x is not a bad car by any means, but it is not on the same level (even with modifications) as the cars you cited.

Last edited by markw10702; 12-10-2024 at 12:03 PM..
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      12-10-2024, 11:59 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYG View Post
Realistically, you can keep up with most of those cars if you're a good driver because 90% of Porsche track guys aren't pushing those cars to their limit and are usually very careful.
The problem is . . . while they are not pushing their cars, you are pushing your car and most likely your limited driving abilities beyond what both are capable of to keep up with the guy in the track-focused Porsche who is driving at 7/10s.
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