[mbanck]

BMW Blog claims their sources told them the Z4 M40i will get a manual option (similar to the Supra) at least for the US market, likely along with the LCI (scheduled for late 2022) (https://www.bmwblog.com/2022/07/11/b...ransmission/):

According to sources, the BMW Z4 M40i is under active consideration to receive a six-speed manual transmission for the U.S. market.
[...]
The addition of the six-speed gearbox is technically feasible since we’ve seen that implementation in the Z4’s brother – Toyota Supra.
[...]
Naturally, not all markets will get the Z4 M40i with a six-speed manual. For now, it seems like only the U.S. market is fighting to keep the manuals alive.

[NickyC]

Wow! Some good news from BMW for a change!

[BMWGirlFL]

BMW Z4 M40i Manual Will be One of BMW’s Best Sports Cars

The BMW Z4 M40i is a bit of a hidden gem in BMW’s lineup. It’s all but forgotten at this point, with sales in the triple digits annually and nary a peep about it from automotive publications. Despite its obscurity, though, the Z4 M40i is actually a great car to drive. Is it as good as a Porsche Boxster? No but it’s different. It has a unique flavor, one that is fantastic in its own right. So the news that it will likely be getting the same six-speed manual transmission as the Toyota Supra is music to my ears.

As you likely already know, the BMW Z4 and Toyota Supra are mechanically almost identical. The main differences between the two cars are their bodies and interiors. So when Toyota announced it’d be putting a manual in both Supra models in North America, it suddenly made sense for BMW to do the same when it comes time to give the Z4 an LCI facelift. From what we’ve heard, just the addition of a six-speed manual turned the Supra from a good sports car to a great one. If it can work similar wonders for the Z4 M40i, BMW’s plucky little roadster will immediately become one of its best sports cars.

If I’m being honest, the Z4 M40i is better to drive than any non-M BMW. It’s far more fun than the M440i, M340i, and even the M240i. It’s all in the chassis, too. Rather than being built on the same modular CLAR architecture as ever other rear-wheel drive BMW, the Z4 uses a bespoke sports car chassis, designed from the ground up to be a lightweight, rigid, two-seat roadster. And you can tell. It feels far better connected to both the road and its driver than any other BMW product on sale. Sure, it’s steering is numb but it’s precise, its B58 engine has more power than its lightweight chassis needs, and its convertible top lets all the sensations of driving into your brain.

A six-speed manual to replace the Z4 M40i’s eight-speed auto will only add another level of driver engagement to an already criminally underrated sports car. At the moment, there’s no official word that a manual is coming but we’re confident it will. If and when it does, the BMW Z4 M40i manual will be the best non-M car in the brand’s lineup, potentially better than even many M cars, and almost certainly the last manual roadster in BMW’s history. I cannot wait to drive it.

https://www.bmwblog.com/2022/07/12/bmw-z4-m40i-manual/

[BMWCCA1]

"Numb but . . . precise".
I'd call that damning with faint praise. I'll keep my 128i Msport 6-speed, thanks.

[tracer bullet]

Originally Posted by BMWCCA1

"Numb but . . . precise"

Scares me as well. Wonder if a manual version could have the steering feedback dialed up. Seems these things would go together - if you want to change gears yourself, you're probably not simultaneously seeking to have the steering wheel removed from the road as much as possible.

[Tuxedo]

will def order one if true

[Germanauto]

I'm happy to hear this. Thanks to popular demand we've seen MTs return in some vehicles. GT3, Supra, and now the Z4. I hope people put their money where their mouth is and buy these.

[Sublime00]

Originally Posted by Germanauto

I'm happy to hear this. Thanks to popular demand we've seen MTs return in some vehicles. GT3, Supra, and now the Z4. I hope people put their money where their mouth is and buy these.

Totally anecdotal, but I haven't heard/come across z4 drivers complaining that they don't have a manual option, at least not like the whines from the Supra community…so I don't know how many buyers are going to opt for the stick and "put their money where their mouth is".

I think Supra sales will def get a huge bump with the stick, not sure about the z4.

As always, props to any manufacturer offering a manual option.

[KevinC]

It's a hairdresser's car. Nobody's gonna care if they put a 6MT in it. If you want a REAL Z4, get the original E86 Z4 M Coupe. Back then the M boys were able to ditch the base Z4's electric PS and put a real hydraulic rack in it, and the rest of the drivetrain is straight out of the E46 M3. Still looks spectacular 15 years later and the driving experience is absolutely sublime. None of this "numb but precise" nonsense!

[BMWGirlFL]

Originally Posted by KevinC

It's a hairdresser's car.

What do you mean by that?

G29AT vs. F87MT:

[No one]

Originally Posted by BMWGirlFL

What do you mean by that?

G29AT vs. F87MT:

Attachment 2932312

Attachment 2932313

I believe it's driving agility (ability to keep a non-straight line at some speed, change directions under control) rather than pure speed/power that is meant. Just don't bother to dig it, perhaps: ignorance is bliss. And the look, just as it is said. And the body type, too!

[BMWGirlFL]

Originally Posted by KevinC

It's a hairdresser's car.

Originally Posted by BMWGirlFL

What do you mean by that?

Originally Posted by No one

I believe it's driving agility (ability to keep a non-straight line at some speed, change directions under control) rather than pure speed/power that is meant. Just don't bother to dig it, perhaps: ignorance is bliss. And the look, just as it is said. And the body type, too!

I believe it's a pejorative, suggesting a lack in power/performance, that does not apply to the M40i.

[MooMooM2]

Hairdressers are bad ass. I think the z4 looks great, will be even better with a manual.

[No one]

Originally Posted by BMWGirlFL

I believe it's a pejorative, suggesting a lack in power/performance, that does not apply to the M40i.

Why? Don't you like your hair taken professional care of? To me, it's just a show over function, shallow approach definition.

[BMWGirlFL]

Originally Posted by No one

Why? Don't you like your hair taken professional care of? To me, it's just a show over function, shallow approach definition.

G29 and the earlier Z roadsters are very different. Show over function does not fairly describe the M40i.

[Westside Guy]

Originally Posted by Sublime00

Totally anecdotal, but I haven't heard/come across z4 drivers complaining that they don't have a manual option, at least not like the whines from the Supra community…so I don't know how many buyers are going to opt for the stick and "put their money where their mouth is".

I think Supra sales will def get a huge bump with the stick, not sure about the z4.

As always, props to any manufacturer offering a manual option.

Do a search and read the posts on the G29 forum, we have had people requesting it for some time.

[Sublime00]

Originally Posted by Westside Guy

Do a search and read the posts on the G29 forum, we have had people requesting it for some time.

Are people on the G29 forums not buying Z4s bc of a lack of a manual option? I don't think anyone thought/expected the z4 to get a stick, while plenty of people lamented the lack of a 3rd pedal in the Supra, waiting with crossed fingers for the optional transmission. Consequently many buyers crossed the Supra off the list for that very reason (I was one of them). But with a "new" manual supra coupe at $55-65k, it'll be cross shopped with m2, 400z, M4, used M cars, etc.

I'd be interested to see sales number change once the manual Z4 comes out or the take percentage on the stick. I'd think it'll be about 40-50% w/ minimal change in the number of annual z4 sales. Looks like BMW is moving 2300 to 2900 units a year without the manual. But then you factor in Covid production delays and bottlenecking so who knows how production numbers will be for MY22/23. Also the z4 has its own niche in terms of a manual convertible at that price point; You have to go up to a Porsche with a significant jump in cost for a comparable manual convertible, or go to a Miata, which is in a completely different league vs the z4. The Supra competes in a more narrow spectrum, and (IMO) it will definitely cannibalize sales of some bmw models (Z4, M2). Makes sense for BMW to offer a manual with that thinking.

I'm def not saying a manual Supra will be flying off the shelf, ultimately it is a $60k 2 seater sports coupe, but it'll make a big difference for the select few shopping for a sports car in that price range.

[StradaRedlands]

Originally Posted by BMWGirlFL

https://www.bmwblog.com/2022/07/12/bmw-z4-m40i-manual/

Attachment 2930281

I think BMW has finally nailed it with this car, and love the G29! Really their best looking two seater ever (Z1 not included). Never considered it due to lack of MT, but now... hmmm, mid-life crisis is coming up!

[BMWGirlFL]

THE FUTURE OF THE BMW Z4 (2026)

Is the Bayern roadster soon to end? If it were only about CO2 emissions, BMW could stay with the Z4 forever with the combustion engine: The roadster accounts for only 0.7 percent of the total sales of the Munich company. But on the other hand, that's exactly the problem. What will become of the two-seater at the generation change?

For the current model generation of the Z4, BMW is cooperating with Toyota (Supra) - the Japanese wanted a closed sports car and use the complete substructure and the drive trains from Munich. When tuning the chassis of their car with a fixed roof, they did it themselves, but the manufacturers use the complex hardware parts together. This is sorely needed, because BMW was only able to sell around 16,000 Z4 cars worldwide in 2019, and in 2020 and 2021 the two-seater remained just under 15,000 units. BMW sold no series less often, with the manufacturer showing the sales figures for the 7 Series and 8 Series as well as the i3, i8 and iX3 together in these years. How difficult it might be to get the development costs out of the Z4 sales (base price: around 43,000 euros), although part of it has certainly ended up at Toyota, can be measured by looking at the number of units of the X7. In this country it is only available from more than 93,000 euros and borrows a lot of technology from the X5: the up to 7-seater giant SUV, which the Bavarians produce in the USA, they sold almost 55,000 times in 2021.

Own platform, high CO2 emissions
Similar to the i3, the Z4 has the problem of being the only model on its platform. In principle, of course, unlike the small electric car made of carbon, the roadster uses many parts of the CLAR rear-wheel drive architecture from BMW, but its wheelbase of just 2.47 meters is 27 centimeters shorter than the next largest rear-wheel drive (2-series coupé with 2.74 meters). In addition, there are a corresponding number of specific parts on the body or the underlying structures, the hood or exhaust systems - special curls that can only be transferred to small quantities, sometimes not even to those of the cooperation model Toyota Supra (no fabric hood).

The only advantage of the manageable quantities: the few Z4s that far exceed the CO2 fleet consumption target of 95 g/km (manufacturer-specific and corrected according to WLTP, it was probably more than 116 g/km for BMW 2021) are, on balance, hardly significant, although even the entry-level Z4 has CO2 emissions of 161 g/km. Because the EU demands fines of 95 euros per gram of excess, multiplied by the number of cars sold by the manufacturer in the EU, each Z4 in Europe costs around 4275 euros; However, BMW did not exceed the 2021 limit, for example, because the Munich company sold numerous electric cars whose CO2 emissions are averaged with zero and initially count twice.

An e-architecture for roadsters does not yet exist
Like the electrified Z4? Theoretically yes. However, it is not that easy to throw the CO2-intensive combustion engine out of the open two-seater. Even if you didn't attach much importance to the range in this segment and that saved an e-drive from the very large and correspondingly expensive battery, the problem of the special technology would remain: A skateboard platform with a battery between the axles would be for a short roadster Wheelbase rather bad, if only because the battery is tall. It is not for nothing that Audi thinks of a battery in the Concept Sky Sphere, which is placed upright behind the seats, where the mid-engine was located in roadsters such as Porsche's 718 Boxster.On the subject of Porsche: The Mission R racing car study has the same structure and could therefore have the layout of the electric 718 successor announced for 2023.

As an open Boxster, the 718 is definitely a competitor for the Z4. And although the price list for the Porsche (with 300 hp) only starts at a good 60,000 euros, the 2021 series found a good 20,000 customers - not even the world, but at Porsche (total sales in 2021 around 301,000 vehicles) that is at least 6.8 percent of all sold Cars and the 718 should have some common parts with the 911 (sales in 2021: 38,464 pieces). Incidentally, Porsche has sold more of the electric Taycan than its classic (41,296), proving that even brand icons with decades of tradition are not safe from the electric drive - Manager Magazine claimed in March 2022 that Porsche boss Oliver Blume was leaving already working on an electric 911 with solid-state batteries.

BMW does not want to comment on an electric Z4 or its possible end. The Z4 is just in the middle of its life cycle, so you are not talking about a potential end, but are happy about such a beautiful car in the heart of the brand.

CONCLUSION

While some brands are considering electric sports cars or expressing their hopes about how well the noiseless and locally emission-free drive would suit an open-top car, BMW is not yet calling its roadster with combustion engines into question. In fact, it may still be early for that - the Z4 was launched in 2019, so a successor is due in 2026. But with classic development times of three years, it should be clear in Munich from 2023 what a Z4 successor should look like and what drives it. Toyota has already shown how to imagine an open two-seater with an electric drive.

https://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/...2-strafsteuer/

[GuidoK]

I've just done some mountain pass hooning in the austrian and italian alps last month in the g29 M40i (I think the natural habitat for these kinds of cars...all the hairdressers seem to go on vacation in this region....), and it's a very good chassis and pretty good engine (this one was lightly tuned to I believe 420hp or so...not very good for the fuel economy...11mpg average and gasoline is of course quite a bit more expensive in europe at $8,20/gallon).
But a manual would indeed be much more fun, and that's what it's all about with these cars.
I hope, if a manual comes, it'll also come to europe.

I don't understand why manuals becoming extinct in these kinds of cars. Look at how much of a premium they fetch in some sportscars on the 2nd hand market.

[allinon72]

I can't believe the Z4 is sticking around at all, much less with a manual. You hardly see these cars on the road and they clearly didn't market them to enthusiasts really at all, so why the MT? Admittedly I would like to own one sometime in life but I feel like I'm not old enough yet to pull it off.

[KevinC]

Originally Posted by BMWGirlFL

G29 and the earlier Z roadsters are very different. Show over function does not fairly describe the M40i.

I don't know about you, but I don't buy a car based on a bunch of acceleration, hp, torque, etc. charts. EVERYTHING is fast nowadays, some cars are faster than others. Some people just want speed and love to bench race or stoplight-drag the kid in a blown Civic. Great. Most of us actually care how a car looks and the overall driving experience, which involves a LOT more than numbers.

The Z4 has never been a popular car, especially in the last decade. I think I've seen ONE of the current generation on the road, ever. I don't think adding a stick is going to help it. Maybe I'm wrong. I would certainly want a manual if I were a potential buyer, but like most people, I'm not.

I'm not blasting anyone for liking the car, nor for getting excited about a manual possibly coming. My main point is - it's not a popular car now, and I don't think this changes that. Perhaps I'll be proven wrong, and I'll happily eat crow if that's how it plays out.