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      01-14-2022, 10:12 AM   #1
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New Generation Of Combustion Engines Coming Says BMW Board Member (Interview)

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BMW development board member Weber promises completely new combustion engines

The signals in terms of electrification are becoming clearer, the end dates for the construction of cars with combustion engines more concrete: Rapid conversion to all-electric is the motto of several manufacturers, for whom the complete turnaround just can't happen fast enough. Fears of government bans on internal combustion engines are spreading. Frank Weber, BMW's board member responsible for development, thinks nothing of this. Before setting an end date, such as the 2035 proposed by the EU, the alternative infrastructure must be in place.

Mr. Weber, the 7 Series is due to be replaced this year. How will it differentiate itself from the Mercedes S-Class?

I'm very sure we'll succeed in doing that convincingly. For example, the 7 Series will be the only car in its segment where buyers can choose between a combustion engine and all-electric. The all-electric BMW i7 is fantastic to drive, for the self-driver, but especially when being driven. I would even go so far as to say that with the i7 we will launch the first fully electric luxury sedan.

So you're not planning a standalone electric sedan?

No, because we are convinced that this is the only way we can offer a standard level of space without having to make too many compromises here due to aerodynamics. Our efficient drive technology will nevertheless enable the best possible fuel consumption figures and ranges.

What's happening with the combustion engines?

One thing is certain for us: We will need the state-of-the-art internal combustion engine for a few more years to effectively reduce CO2 emissions in the passenger car sector globally. That's why we're working on a new generation of engines: gasoline, diesel, six-cylinder, eight-cylinder. These will then also be technologically equipped for the coming emissions standards. In the six-cylinder engine alone, we are reducing CO2 emissions more massively than ever before in a new generation. We are helped in this by the fact that legislation in this area is beginning to converge worldwide. To reconcile emissions requirements on the one hand and performance demands on the other, we looked at the entire charge change and found a promising approach there. This technology then runs through all engine families and is supplemented by a high-performance e-drive disc.

So, new from the ground up - or rather a major overhaul?

Nothing is really the same as it was before. There's something completely new in the cylinder head. And with it, we're going to up the ante in terms of efficiency. Because regardless of whether it's a combustion engine or an electric vehicle, reducing CO2 emissions across the board is crucial in the fight against climate change. Equally decisive is what the customer wants. And we have to meet their wishes and requirements accordingly.

So the new 7 Series can do both electric and internal combustion. The iX has an independent architecture. The i4, on the other hand, is based on an internal combustion engine architecture, and front-wheel drive models such as the X1 will also be able to run purely on electricity in the future. In 2025, the so-called New Class will arrive, electric only. Why all this confusion?

Oh, it's not really that complicated. We once sketched a picture with three waves. The first wave was formed by the i3 and i8. They were early, the volume was low, there was no platform thinking. Now we are in wave two, where flexibility is immensely important. No matter what we do, the components have to be usable everywhere. On the drive side, on the storage side and on the vehicle electrical system side, for example, iX and i4 are the same. This then extends through 7s and 5s to the X1. This means that we have an identical technology basis in drive-flexible architectures for electric drives.

How does the iX fit in? Why not an electric SUV?

Look, the X5 development began around 2014. At that time, the risk of having to make too many compromises with the conventional X5 and thus possibly alienating the large core clientele was too great. At the same time, we decided to achieve the maximum possible with the iX and to position it in a deliberately different way alongside the conventional product. And with the New Class, at the latest, we will enter an era that is no longer about BMW on the one hand and BMW i on the other, but only about BMW. From then on, the brand will basically be electric.

Do you really believe that, globally speaking, the automotive world will change to such an extent from 2025 onwards that the drive-flexible architectures can be phased out?

It's a fair question, because if you compare an i4 and an iX today, you'll come to the conclusion that both are excellent products regardless of their architecture. It is also clear, by the way, that vehicles based on a BEV-only architecture will not be fundamentally different. It's just that we now have to consider going into the very big volume with upcoming e-vehicle generations. For us, that means the 3-series and the X3 for example.

So the next three-wheeler will be all-electric?

I didn't say that. It's still too early for that.

So will there be a completely new, all-electric 3 Series, and the current one with the combustion engines will remain on offer?

Well, the current 3-series isn't a bad car, is it? Even in 2025, there will still be many people who can't drive an electric car because they don't have the necessary infrastructure. This will develop at very different rates in the individual markets. But - and this is very important to me - we will not force our customers to choose between the new and the supposedly old. Our aim is always to offer the most sustainable and innovative vehicles, regardless of the type of drive.

How do you bring the two worlds together?

I don't want to tell you that just yet. Okay, maybe this much: What we are bringing to the New Class with the e-drive modular system is fundamentally different from what we know today. But that also applies to all the other modules - such as the digital module with its onboard network, operating concept and automated driving functions, or the chassis and interior modules. Here, we will take a big step forward everywhere. And all these kits are cross-architectural and can be adapted for all future vehicle concepts, regardless of the powertrain. And by the way, what the e-machines will be capable of may mean that you'll have to imagine the next M3 quite differently, too.

Compared to an i4, how big will the leap in efficiency and cost be?

We can already look to the end of the decade and see that the leaps in efficiency and cost that will be possible far surpass those that we know from internal combustion engines. Even with an electric motor, which is known for its high efficiency, a lot is still possible. What happens at higher speeds? How does the motor degrade? What is the most attractive design? There really is still a lot of potential here. We develop and build the motors ourselves, which helps us, of course. Power electronics are also an issue, because they shrink by 50 percent every three to four years for the same performance. In the case of the cell, the aim is to reduce costs by 30 percent in the next generation. That's why our goal is to achieve a comparable return on investment with the next generation of BEVs as with a combustion engine.

So the New Class no longer needs government subsidies?

In our planning, we don't assume that. We're talking about really high volume, the "new normal," so to speak. Efficiency is at the heart of everything we do. Thermal systems, structures, high-voltage and low-voltage systems - all of this has a value comparable to that of the weight of a vehicle. There really is a lot more that can be done. We don't just call the New Class that because it was time again. It represents how the brand is addressing the issue of BEVs, how that affects the design, which platform and components are required, and how digital performance is developing, because that's where the pace of development is particularly rapid. Not to forget: sustainability. This is not trivial for a BEV. If the cycle cannot be closed, there will be no BEV industry.

Back to digital performance: Since the E65 Seven Series, i.e. the first iDrive system, BMW has established a leading role in this field. However, the iX that we tested was notable for a number of bugs. Is that also "new normal," simply because the subject is so complex?

Absolutely not. The cars that come to the customers run without errors. The initial launch of a new generation of wiring systems is challenging. When we introduced the over-the-air upgrade in 2018, it already became more complex than before. Before, you had a hardware and a software status, and then that was merged. In the meantime, especially from the area of assistance systems, functions are coming into the car that require an enormous depth of protection. With our BMW Operating System 8, we have a modular operating system that allows us to update every single line of code in the vehicle over the air. This allows us to perfectly maintain vehicles in customer hands digitally. We have the largest upgradeable fleet in the world, with 2.5 million vehicles, across 30 models and all drive types. In the last three years, we have carried out 35 upgrades, providing functions such as the Parking Maneuver Assistant, eDrive Zones and BMW Maps.

But if all the building blocks are so important, rather than the architecture itself, what is really new about the New Class?

It is the universal architecture concept for all BMWs, from the 1 Series to the X7. As a result, easy-to-structure modular systems are created, from the entry-level engine to an M product. The way the battery gets in there will also be completely new. That's really only possible with BEV-only. Then we're paying a lot of attention to the display and operating concepts. There has never been so much change in a BMW in one fell swoop.

And until everyone wants to drive an electric car, you still have to increase the range of your plug-in hybrids?

We are already registering exceptionally high customer satisfaction with the X5 PHEV in particular. A PHEV that can drive 80 to 100 km on pure electric power will also be the vehicle that most customers will drive on pure electric power most of the time. This plays a really important role in the transition, because the problem of too few charging stations cannot be solved overnight. That's why we are so vehemently opposed to naming a date for the phase-out of internal combustion engines. Instead, the question should be: When will the infrastructure be in place? Of course, the future is electric, but if we force customers into an electric car now and they are all stuck in traffic jams at the charging station on the way to their vacation, then nothing will be gained. And no one can want that. This transition will not be over in five or ten years.
https://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/...orstand-weber/

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      01-14-2022, 01:24 PM   #2
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That's a breath of fresh air that ICE aren't dead at BMW. I think they are doing it correctly. Having posted records in 2021 I think BMW knows a thing or two about the industry.
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      01-14-2022, 01:36 PM   #3
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So, new from the ground up - or rather a major overhaul?

Nothing is really the same as it was before. There's something completely new in the cylinder head.
would it be something like Freevalve (Koenigsegg) cylinder head?

I'm glad that they're not putting all their eggs into EV basket. ICE will still have their use in vehicles for as long as fuel is available and plenty of efficiency & power improvements are to yet to come.

Last edited by XsltAnalyst; 01-14-2022 at 01:44 PM..
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      01-14-2022, 01:41 PM   #4
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That interview made me feel real good!!
Wooow












Last edited by midnofgriizmano; 01-15-2022 at 12:17 PM..
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      01-14-2022, 01:48 PM   #5
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This was a great read. I think it speaks volumes to the Tesla fan bois that scream BMW sucks and doesn't know what they are doing with ev's. I just wish the exterior styling of the newer cars wasn't so disappointing (to my eyes).
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      01-14-2022, 01:51 PM   #6
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      01-14-2022, 01:59 PM   #7
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Rightfully so!
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      01-14-2022, 02:22 PM   #8
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Good read.

In summary:
- most people will go with the herd and get an EV. BTW, I'm not calling EV adopters a herd, just saying that a typical regular car owner who doesn't even know what car they are driving, will just drive what's on the market and that will be increasingly EV saturated.
- this leaves ICE options that will have to meet strict emission standards and consume less fuel still.
- demand for fossil fuels will decrease and as a result, we will never get even close to "peak oil" and petrol will be cheap

So, the more people around me switch to EV, the cheaper my modern ICE car will be to drive! Yay!

p.s. We all know the above logic will be destroyed by rich folks using fossil fuels to fly to orbit and back just for kicks.
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      01-14-2022, 02:27 PM   #9
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What a fantastic breath of fresh air from BMW.

I especially liked this little bit: "That's why we're working on a new generation of engines: gasoline, diesel, six-cylinder, eight-cylinder". Seems to indicate the V8 will survive for future vehicles.
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      01-14-2022, 02:27 PM   #10
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Even in 2025, there will still be many people who can't drive an electric car because they don't have the necessary infrastructure. This will develop at very different rates in the individual markets. But - and this is very important to me - we will not force our customers to choose between the new and the supposedly old.
I'm glad there's some people at bmw still who are level-headed about this matter. I like this pragmatic approach.
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      01-14-2022, 02:44 PM   #11
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That article allows up to have hope for the ICE M cars as well
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      01-14-2022, 03:03 PM   #12
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wonderful pragmatic approach by BMW, this news snippet cheered me up this morning.
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      01-14-2022, 03:07 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason60051 View Post
That's a breath of fresh air that ICE aren't dead at BMW. I think they are doing it correctly. Having posted records in 2021 I think BMW knows a thing or two about the industry.
Not dead but make no mistake ICE buyers will continue to subsidize BEV leasees. Don't expect great lease deals on ICE either.
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      01-14-2022, 03:12 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eljay View Post
Good read.

In summary:
- most people will go with the herd and get an EV. BTW, I'm not calling EV adopters a herd, just saying that a typical regular car owner who doesn't even know what car they are driving, will just drive what's on the market and that will be increasingly EV saturated.
- this leaves ICE options that will have to meet strict emission standards and consume less fuel still.
- demand for fossil fuels will decrease and as a result, we will never get even close to "peak oil" and petrol will be cheap

So, the more people around me switch to EV, the cheaper my modern ICE car will be to drive! Yay!

p.s. We all know the above logic will be destroyed by rich folks using fossil fuels to fly to orbit and back just for kicks.
If anything, I've read gas prices will increase as demand lessens with increased consumer preference for EVs. Economics of scale.
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      01-14-2022, 03:16 PM   #15
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We will need the state-of-the-art internal combustion engine for a few more years to effectively reduce CO2 emissions in the passenger car sector globally.



What a logic...

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      01-14-2022, 03:28 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrippledLucifer View Post
What a fantastic breath of fresh air from BMW.

I especially liked this little bit: "That's why we're working on a new generation of engines: gasoline, diesel, six-cylinder, eight-cylinder". Seems to indicate the V8 will survive for future vehicles.
... but we'll need to pour out a glass of synthetic 0W-30 for the V-12's.
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      01-14-2022, 04:18 PM   #17
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bmw has ev and ice and outsells various manufacturers what's not to like.
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      01-14-2022, 04:21 PM   #18
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Good to see BMW developing the ICE engines to reduce the Co2 emissions, but lets hope they have the resources left to develop BEV's and other new drivetrains without the ICE taking to much of those resources.

But again anyone who knows a thing or two about this knows that ICE cars will be with us for quite some time still while some country's will outright ban the sales of new ICE after 2030 and upwards other country's without BEV infrastructure still needs personal transport and if that transport is ICE engines with minimal emissions the more the merrier of those new engines.

But i don't believe the board member is correct in his assessment of fuels becoming cheaper for ICE owners if anything this will be controlled by demand and supply if the demand lowers for each year simply oil companies wont produce petrol/diesel in such large quantities that it will be cheaper if anything it will get a bit more expensive but probably going to be reduced in such a way that it will be like with BEV infrastructure now they will simply switch places getting petrol/diesel will be harder to come by while BEV stations or other environmental fuel types stations will be abundant.

But make no mistake as much as governments around the world wants to phase out fossils fuels they do indeed love that sweet tax/vat revenue they get from it. And BEV drivers will probably be taxed by some form of miles/kilometre tax so the government wont loose to much money on the loss of petrol/diesel sales. That won't happen in the next 5-8 years but surely in 10 years or so governments will use some form of argument "Oh well drivers of BEVs need to pay this tax for upkeep of roads or the tires on the cars lets loose this particle and you need to pay tax for it"

That's how it always is, but i can imagine that cities who at times have issues with smog will appreciate more clear days and fresh air to breath in on those sunny days.

I Remember being in China 10-12 years ago while i could wake up one day and the hotel room was filled with this thick heavy air to breath and then a rain front came by and washed the smog away while making the buildings and streets covered in this dark brownish rain due to the rain particles bringing down the smog.

So i guess cities in the future will be a lot nice in that term.
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      01-14-2022, 04:28 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrippledLucifer View Post
I especially liked this little bit: "That's why we're working on a new generation of engines: gasoline, diesel, six-cylinder, eight-cylinder". Seems to indicate the V8 will survive for future vehicles.
B58 is getting a new revision. S68 is basically a hybridized N63. All of them will be good enough to satisfy EU7 and remain in production for the next 8-10 years. Don't expect anything better than that - the future is electric.
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      01-14-2022, 05:12 PM   #20
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All this because some megalomaniacs like klaus schwab want to tax the poor with their made up emission reductions goals and reduce 'carbon' output, meanwhile they fly around jetsetting the world without a care.

But i am happy we can shut the EV fanbois who love to say ITS THE FUTURE! Hahaha
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      01-14-2022, 05:13 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ynguldyn View Post
Don't expect anything better than that - the future is electric.
Dont be so sure, respectfully.
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      01-14-2022, 05:43 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoneIn4Secs View Post
Dont be so sure, respectfully.
I'm sure this interview was scrutinized by the corporate BMW layers word by word.

It won't make a lot of economic sense to do really develop a whole new ICE generation, I think a reasonable evolution (with "new cylinderhead designs") and (partly) hybridization is what we'll be getting, but let's see.
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