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      05-04-2021, 06:58 AM   #1
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CarMagazine reviews M3 Competition vs 992 Carrera S

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     Featured on BIMMERPOST.com
It's a tie!

https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-re...s-porsche-911/

Quote:
Final reckoning: value and victory

It's a draw. A cop-out? Maybe, but sometimes answers are too complex to be tidied up into binary soundbites. And the truth is the BMW M3 and Porsche 911 have as much in common as they do points of difference. Since first they faced off they've changed, almost beyond recognition. But both remain relevant. And both are magnificent.

BMW M3 vs Porsche 911 Carrera S: verdict

=1st Porsche 911 Carrera S
We don't do draws, but this is one – too finely balanced to call. The Porsche, ultimately, can reach higher dynamic highs, but...

=1st BMW M3 Competition
...Munich's ferociously fast four-door is better value, has a better interior, indulges slip angles more readily and pushes the 911 to its limits while remaining a practical family car with proper back seats.
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      05-04-2021, 09:33 AM   #2
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Not too often you see a tie. C&D uses their scoring criteria and usually fudge some of the numbers (fun to drive in particular) to ensure the car they prefer wins even if another car is technically better. Strange how Car Mag couldn't pick a winner even on an emotional level.
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      05-04-2021, 03:23 PM   #3
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Impressive result. It mirrors my subjective feeling behind the wheel; good to see other professional anecdotal reviews that agree.

Porsche remains the money-no-object option for a usable daily driver, especially if you don't need the 2 extra doors and additional luggage space of the G80. The G80 represents incredible value, with the aforementioned increased practicality, excellent performance, and small niceties here and there (like HUD). Kudos to both brands for making these cars with a manual transmission.
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      05-18-2021, 01:07 PM   #4
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If you can even find one--not even Champion has any 911s in stock, the Carrera S2 goes for >$135,000 with the "normal" vastly overpriced options they all are ordered with. A nicely optioned M3/4 Comp is mid '80s. $50,000 is a LOT of money. The 992 is a great car. So is a Ferrari 812. But price/performance comes into it for most of us. The M gives very little away--VERY little, in performance and is far more luxurious, IMO. Easy choice.
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      05-18-2021, 03:42 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vetteflier View Post
If you can even find one--not even Champion has any 911s in stock, the Carrera S2 goes for >$135,000 with the "normal" vastly overpriced options they all are ordered with. A nicely optioned M3/4 Comp is mid '80s. $50,000 is a LOT of money. The 992 is a great car. So is a Ferrari 812. But price/performance comes into it for most of us. The M gives very little away--VERY little, in performance and is far more luxurious, IMO. Easy choice.
Price aside, I think the 911 exudes a much higher level of luxury, quality and finishing overall. Thing is, you cannot get a 911 right now and if you can you're paying over.
I can have an m3 or m4 at a decent discount. There's a lot of value in the M3/4 which that is partly what sells them - although the M3 will depreciate a lot so that delta in new price becomes much closer. Porsche is not about value nor will it ever will be yet the demand is through the roof even for a base 911. Just wait to see the GTS...

To me, if you want the best all around GT/sport car the 911 is the hands down winner as it continues to prove to be.
If you need practicality, but want performance the m3 is the car to have.

The winner here beyond which car you pick is you and I. Both available in manual and are fun to drive.
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      05-18-2021, 08:02 PM   #6
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I'm actually cross shopping a G8x and 992 at the moment. I still have a year+ warranty on my Alfa Giulia QV so I'm in no rush (which is a good thing given allocation constraints especially on the 911), but I'm finding myself very conflicted. Both cars are amazing but obviously have distinctly different personalities.

I know it's not all that common to be cross shipping these two given the price delta, but the resale value on 911s certainly dulls the pain of the initial price.

I've driven both recently and the BMW certainly has more brute force, but the 911 just feels like an extension of my mind... Which may be why I can't get it out of my head.

Good thing I have some time to decide. Any former/current 992 owners get a G8x yet? If so, interested to get your thoughts...
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      05-18-2021, 08:39 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by weinerj100 View Post
I'm actually cross shopping a G8x and 992 at the moment. I still have a year+ warranty on my Alfa Giulia QV so I'm in no rush (which is a good thing given allocation constraints especially on the 911), but I'm finding myself very conflicted. Both cars are amazing but obviously have distinctly different personalities.

I know it's not all that common to be cross shipping these two given the price delta, but the resale value on 911s certainly dulls the pain of the initial price.

I've driven both recently and the BMW certainly has more brute force, but the 911 just feels like an extension of my mind... Which may be why I can't get it out of my head.

Good thing I have some time to decide. Any former/current 992 owners get a G8x yet? If so, interested to get your thoughts...
Not quite the feedback you're looking for, but I am a 20+ year M3/4 faithful owner (E46/E92/F82) and decided to pass on the G8X and get a 992 instead.
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      05-18-2021, 08:55 PM   #8
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992 is $50K more, for starters, for a good reason. It is the gold standard. I had a 2017 911 CS and was able to sell it for a bundle this year. The G80 is a hell of a machine and works better for me and my lifestyle currently.
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      05-18-2021, 09:05 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bimmer TiM3 View Post
992 is $50K more, for starters, for a good reason. It is the gold standard. I had a 2017 911 CS and was able to sell it for a bundle this year. The G80 is a hell of a machine and works better for me and my lifestyle currently.
The 911 is significantly more expensive than the G8X, that is without question. A fully loaded G8X will intersect with a stripper base 992, but that's it. The M3/4 are much more practical and a real performance bargains. However, the 992 is a hell of an engineering masterpiece and pure driver's delight. If it's worth the cost depends on each's priorities.
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      05-18-2021, 10:03 PM   #10
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So I came out of a 992 c2s with spasm and rws.. The car had sublime steering and was dynamically excellent. The motor was good but not great. I sold it Because I used it as a daily and the for the compromise in practically and space, it just wasn't special enough. For background I also have a 991.2 gt3 manual and a 992 tts on order. I have a g80 m3 zcp now as a daily and I find it far more fun, mainly because it's much more usable and feels like a hammer (vs a scalpel). The 992 is much more precise and has higher Limits. It's also much less tail happy. The m3 sounds better stock and also has a better motor IMO. That being said, the m3 is not special enough to be a weekend car and one would be better suited in a 911 for that. For its intended purpose, the m3 is outstanding and far better than the f80 zcp I had in 2018.
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      05-18-2021, 10:07 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanAutM3 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by weinerj100 View Post
I'm actually cross shopping a G8x and 992 at the moment. I still have a year+ warranty on my Alfa Giulia QV so I'm in no rush (which is a good thing given allocation constraints especially on the 911), but I'm finding myself very conflicted. Both cars are amazing but obviously have distinctly different personalities.

I know it's not all that common to be cross shipping these two given the price delta, but the resale value on 911s certainly dulls the pain of the initial price.

I've driven both recently and the BMW certainly has more brute force, but the 911 just feels like an extension of my mind... Which may be why I can't get it out of my head.

Good thing I have some time to decide. Any former/current 992 owners get a G8x yet? If so, interested to get your thoughts...
Not quite the feedback you're looking for, but I am a 20+ year M3/4 faithful owner (E46/E92/F82) and decided to pass on the G8X and get a 992 instead.
Right, but I've seen you on the turbo boards as I'm waiting for my build as well... to compare an m3 to a Tts is bonkers. I'm not sure if u got to test drive a tts but it's on a different planet in every way.
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      05-19-2021, 08:17 AM   #12
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... it's much more usable and feels like a hammer (vs a scalpel). The 992 is much more precise and has higher Limits.
Funny you make this analogy. When I traded my W204 C63 for an F82, I felt the same exact way but in the opposite direction... The C63 was the hammer and the M4 was the scalpel.

The G80 or 992 will be my DD so I definitely appreciate the input. The G80 definitely checks all the "logical" boxes, but there's still just something about the 911. Some of this is likely the lure of the unknown as I've owned M cars but never a P car.

I did think that the 911 felt pretty mundane just puttering around town on my test drive. But. Once I got the chance to unwind it on a twisty road, it was a totally different story.
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      05-19-2021, 09:16 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedyJ View Post
So I came out of a 992 c2s with spasm and rws.. The car had sublime steering and was dynamically excellent. The motor was good but not great. I sold it Because I used it as a daily and the for the compromise in practically and space, it just wasn't special enough. For background I also have a 991.2 gt3 manual and a 992 tts on order. I have a g80 m3 zcp now as a daily and I find it far more fun, mainly because it's much more usable and feels like a hammer (vs a scalpel). The 992 is much more precise and has higher Limits. It's also much less tail happy. The m3 sounds better stock and also has a better motor IMO. That being said, the m3 is not special enough to be a weekend car and one would be better suited in a 911 for that. For its intended purpose, the m3 is outstanding and far better than the f80 zcp I had in 2018.
I personally think the G8X motor feels a lot more like the turbo 911 motor (smart move by BMW to go this way). I had an F8x and didn't care for the spikey powerband whereas my 991.2S was linear like an NA engine and low and hehold the G8x feels much more like that. I do find the 991/992 motors sound and feel special to me whereas the M motors make me cringe with how they sound and are really unbecoming of a car that nears the 6 figure mark.

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      05-19-2021, 04:59 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HeelToeShift View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedyJ View Post
So I came out of a 992 c2s with spasm and rws.. The car had sublime steering and was dynamically excellent. The motor was good but not great. I sold it Because I used it as a daily and the for the compromise in practically and space, it just wasn't special enough. For background I also have a 991.2 gt3 manual and a 992 tts on order. I have a g80 m3 zcp now as a daily and I find it far more fun, mainly because it's much more usable and feels like a hammer (vs a scalpel). The 992 is much more precise and has higher Limits. It's also much less tail happy. The m3 sounds better stock and also has a better motor IMO. That being said, the m3 is not special enough to be a weekend car and one would be better suited in a 911 for that. For its intended purpose, the m3 is outstanding and far better than the f80 zcp I had in 2018.
I personally think the G8X motor feels a lot more like the turbo 911 motor (smart move by BMW to go this way). I had an F8x and didn't care for the spikey powerband whereas my 991.2S was linear like an NA engine and low and hehold the G8x feels much more like that. I do find the 991/992 motors sound and feel special to me whereas the M motors make me cringe with how they sound and are really unbecoming of a car that nears the 6 figure mark.
different strokes I guess. The 3.0tt motor in the 991/992 feel and sound blah compared to the na 3.8 and 4.0... those motor are bliss. The s58 is the first bmw turbo 6 that has a nice mature burley tone to it I love. I don't understand the people on their forum cutting off resonators etc to make it sound worse. But then again i have another loud car so I don't feel the need to make my m3 louder
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      05-20-2021, 11:24 AM   #15
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A tie with a 911 is a huge win for BMW, especially when it comes to value.
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      05-20-2021, 11:36 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HeelToeShift View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by vetteflier View Post
If you can even find one--not even Champion has any 911s in stock, the Carrera S2 goes for >$135,000 with the "normal" vastly overpriced options they all are ordered with. A nicely optioned M3/4 Comp is mid '80s. $50,000 is a LOT of money. The 992 is a great car. So is a Ferrari 812. But price/performance comes into it for most of us. The M gives very little away--VERY little, in performance and is far more luxurious, IMO. Easy choice.
Price aside, I think the 911 exudes a much higher level of luxury, quality and finishing overall. Thing is, you cannot get a 911 right now and if you can you're paying over.
I can have an m3 or m4 at a decent discount. There's a lot of value in the M3/4 which that is partly what sells them - although the M3 will depreciate a lot so that delta in new price becomes much closer. Porsche is not about value nor will it ever will be yet the demand is through the roof even for a base 911. Just wait to see the GTS...

To me, if you want the best all around GT/sport car the 911 is the hands down winner as it continues to prove to be.
If you need practicality, but want performance the m3 is the car to have.

The winner here beyond which car you pick is you and I. Both available in manual and are fun to drive.
I'm getting a 992 C2S and am not paying over MSRP, nor are others on here that are getting 992s…..

Also, that is for an ordered car and euro delivery in the fall.

All the G80s and allocations for G80s within a couple 100 miles of me are all marked up $10-20k.

Agree on all your other points. Also, a 911 C2S is the only non-GT luxury sports car that holds 70%+ of its value over three years (assuming you don't option it to something ridiculous like over $145k).
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      05-20-2021, 11:38 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanAutM3 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by weinerj100 View Post
I'm actually cross shopping a G8x and 992 at the moment. I still have a year+ warranty on my Alfa Giulia QV so I'm in no rush (which is a good thing given allocation constraints especially on the 911), but I'm finding myself very conflicted. Both cars are amazing but obviously have distinctly different personalities.

I know it's not all that common to be cross shipping these two given the price delta, but the resale value on 911s certainly dulls the pain of the initial price.

I've driven both recently and the BMW certainly has more brute force, but the 911 just feels like an extension of my mind... Which may be why I can't get it out of my head.

Good thing I have some time to decide. Any former/current 992 owners get a G8x yet? If so, interested to get your thoughts...
Not quite the feedback you're looking for, but I am a 20+ year M3/4 faithful owner (E46/E92/F82) and decided to pass on the G8X and get a 992 instead.
Me too.
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      05-20-2021, 11:41 AM   #18
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Maybe I'm the only one that would pay the $50K price differential simply to not have to see the G8X pig nostrils.
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      05-20-2021, 11:48 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HeelToeShift View Post
Price aside, I think the 911 exudes a much higher level of luxury, quality and finishing overall. Thing is, you cannot get a 911 right now and if you can you're paying over.
I can have an m3 or m4 at a decent discount. There's a lot of value in the M3/4 which that is partly what sells them - although the M3 will depreciate a lot so that delta in new price becomes much closer. Porsche is not about value nor will it ever will be yet the demand is through the roof even for a base 911. Just wait to see the GTS...

To me, if you want the best all around GT/sport car the 911 is the hands down winner as it continues to prove to be.
If you need practicality, but want performance the m3 is the car to have.

The winner here beyond which car you pick is you and I. Both available in manual and are fun to drive.
I don't disagree, if you put price aside. But the delta between them would buy a very nicely equipped Honda CR-V, which is exactly what I have for bad weather/need storage or passenger space, and excellent fuel economy. My 2020 fills that bill, although I bought it last August, I can consider it a 'freebie...' Would love a 911 GTS; but having two great cars for the same price is what makes sense to me.
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      05-20-2021, 11:56 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vetteflier View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeelToeShift View Post
Price aside, I think the 911 exudes a much higher level of luxury, quality and finishing overall. Thing is, you cannot get a 911 right now and if you can you're paying over.
I can have an m3 or m4 at a decent discount. There's a lot of value in the M3/4 which that is partly what sells them - although the M3 will depreciate a lot so that delta in new price becomes much closer. Porsche is not about value nor will it ever will be yet the demand is through the roof even for a base 911. Just wait to see the GTS...

To me, if you want the best all around GT/sport car the 911 is the hands down winner as it continues to prove to be.
If you need practicality, but want performance the m3 is the car to have.

The winner here beyond which car you pick is you and I. Both available in manual and are fun to drive.
I don't disagree, if you put price aside. But the delta between them would buy a very nicely equipped Honda CR-V, which is exactly what I have for bad weather/need storage or passenger space, and excellent fuel economy. My 2020 fills that bill, although I bought it last August, I can consider it a 'freebie...' Would love a 911 GTS; but having two great cars for the same price is what makes sense to me.
Very underrated point. I'm getting the C2S because I live somewhere where we have sunshine and no snow or ice year round. If I lived up north, the two car solution would probably be best for me.
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      05-20-2021, 12:06 PM   #21
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Love the 911 vs M3 material. They are both the best as what they do and both incredible values. And so many variations of both to pick from so we the consumer can get exactly what we want.
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      05-20-2021, 12:34 PM   #22
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I would love a 911 to have as a garage queen, but can't justify that sort of money to be used once a week (although I'd have no problem spending more on a boat that I'd use less frequently, so what do I know).

For me, the M3 just ticks every box I have. I have 2 car seats in it, I use it every day for drop offs, grocery runs etc., it has 3 pedals, and am lining up a track day for it shortly. What the hell other car can do that?
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