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      10-09-2020, 04:12 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Montaver View Post
My dogs order of preference -

1. G20 330i - Can fully lounge across the back and set the climate control to her preference. Can comfortably stick her head out the window and bark at pedestrians.
2. E90 M3 - Good lounge ability, bench slightly shallow. Good rear windows for hanging out of.
3. M2C - Seats too shallow, plastic bit in the middle to prevent lounging. Cant stick her head out the window. Complained on long journeys. Didn't like the manual trans.
Mine also hates the plastic bit in my F32 rear and if you put her in the back, she tries to be social with you driving and comes ontop of the center console

So she sits in the front. Luckily huge front window but horrible for long trips as she needs to curl up into a ball in the back and front

No go imo for 2-doors and 2-seaters with dogs, way too risky to have em in the front even with a seatbelt to their harness and unbearable for longer distances. I need to stop every 3 hours or so for short walks on highway and even then, need to be super considerate so your pup doesn't eat a face full of dash....

Which makes me think that the G80 4-door sedan will be the dog friendliest of the "sportier" cars + the casual auto trans being smoother to your passengers was intentional design by BMW imo.
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      10-09-2020, 04:20 PM   #24
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looks like a resurgence of the 2 series for enthusiasts but based on this trend, sales numbers might be rough for this car.
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      10-10-2020, 07:01 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by Avaley View Post
looks like a resurgence of the 2 series for enthusiasts but based on this trend, sales numbers might be rough for this car.
Sales numbers say nothing right now, so many effects playing into that, especially in the US (thanks Cheeto lol). I can tell you in Europe the demand/interest for the G8X is higher compared to the launch of the F8X. We will be able to see the success cleaned of all the uncontrollable influences on sales number earliest in Q4/21 or Q1/22.
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      10-10-2020, 08:56 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by Flamingi View Post
Sales numbers say nothing right now, so many effects playing into that, especially in the US (thanks Cheeto lol). I can tell you in Europe the demand/interest for the G8X is higher compared to the launch of the F8X. We will be able to see the success cleaned of all the uncontrollable influences on sales number earliest in Q4/21 or Q1/22.
My U.S. dealer has 86 new units in inventory today, 75 of which are SUVs. They only have a pair of 2s and a pair of 3s and the only M which is an 8. I don’t know what their allocation is for the new M3 and M4 but even with the demand for the SUVs in my zip code I know they could sell every allotted a G8x.
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      10-10-2020, 04:05 PM   #27
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As a late 30s male from EU, I plan to buy the new M3. Allthough it does not have all the things I'd like (4 wheel drive, for example), I believe that coming back to RWD BMWs (which I drove for last 18 years) will be a spicy addition to this fruit cake of a car

My initial plan was to get the 8 GC, as I was looking for second car (along my diesel 7 series LCI I use daily as a family car and for longer trips) that gives what BMWs are famous for: driving pleasure. And while my previous 650xi (tuned to 560HP) was pretty nice, it was too heavy and too big for my taste. After driving M850i GC for few days, it feels certainly like a lighter vehicle, but the overall dynamics did not impress me. And it's too expensive also in my country, with the price tag equivalent to ~180k USD.

So going back few numbers down the product line, I find G80 M3 very interesting. It has the looks, makes a statement, has some interesting new features, so I am now waiting for few reviews to confirm the driving dynamics before making an order probably later this month (or next).
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      10-10-2020, 05:55 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duky View Post
I feel like you're asking the wrong question. It seems like you need to better understand your priorities and choose a car that aligns with those. BMW telling you who their target audience is shouldn't influence that. I know a 33 year old, unmarried, with no kids who drives around in a 7 Series. He's happy with it despite (probably) not being the target user persona for BMW when they designed it. You just need to find what makes you happy and not worry about BMW's product marketing priorities.

Now if you're not actually asking the question to inform your 3-year commitment and it's just an educational question then sure I'll engage. To the point made by @wyndi335i above, I think BMW is targeting whoever will buy it which could include the {original E46 buyer from 2001 who is now 20 years older with a 1-car home and kids}, a {retiree who wants some of the engagement of a smaller car but doesn't want to feel aches and pains with every bump}, or even the {newly rich 30 year old who knows little about cars but saw that the price tag is high but affordable, it looks exotic, and sounds really "fast"}.

BMW's goal is volume and to get volume you have to appeal to multiple customer segments.
I think the question about who it targets is about what kind of outcomes the buyer is looking for not their demographics.

You have the purist historic M buyer who wants one for the raw feel and performance. The fact that they previously looked great (see pig snout) and can function well as a daily was a bonus.

Some people purchase an M3 for the prestige of owning one and its styling. Performance and raw feel maybe a bit less important to them.

Now you also have the previous 335/other turbo car 0-60 guys. Looks and gapping people is what is important.

Every gen seems to be pointed more and more towards the two latter buyer profiles and us purists are losing out. Just my .02 as a previous e46,92, and f82 owner.
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      10-10-2020, 11:06 PM   #29
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It's targeted at ME, in black please!
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      10-11-2020, 05:14 PM   #30
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I think it's being targeted at Millennials who are looking to lease a $80K car for $1000 a month with a $75K yearly salary.

I do not think it's targeted at $100K+ income +40 year old Males anymore.

Prior to the E92 days it was difficult to find a 30 year old in an M3 since people used to purchase these cars and not lease them. Leasing has made these vehicle much more accessible to anyone. With he F80 you can find a very large group of owners in their 20s as well as 30s which is surprising based on the MSRP of the car.

The 40-50 year old crowd are mostly moving to P-cars.
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      10-11-2020, 09:34 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zodiac View Post
As a late 30s male from EU, I plan to buy the new M3. Allthough it does not have all the things I'd like (4 wheel drive, for example), I believe that coming back to RWD BMWs (which I drove for last 18 years) will be a spicy addition to this fruit cake of a car

My initial plan was to get the 8 GC, as I was looking for second car (along my diesel 7 series LCI I use daily as a family car and for longer trips) that gives what BMWs are famous for: driving pleasure. And while my previous 650xi (tuned to 560HP) was pretty nice, it was too heavy and too big for my taste. After driving M850i GC for few days, it feels certainly like a lighter vehicle, but the overall dynamics did not impress me. And it's too expensive also in my country, with the price tag equivalent to ~180k USD.

So going back few numbers down the product line, I find G80 M3 very interesting. It has the looks, makes a statement, has some interesting new features, so I am now waiting for few reviews to confirm the driving dynamics before making an order probably later this month (or next).


If a AWD M3 is what you want, why not wait for the AWD Model to come out? should be releasing in the summer of next year I believe.
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      10-12-2020, 07:42 AM   #32
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I also do not know the target market, but I can tell you why I am attracted to the M4. I'm 46, married, son grown, so no kids. I have two dogs, but will not put them in my car. I like the understated nature of the M cars relative to a Porsche or American muscle car. I like to drive "spiritedly" and like having a car that's sort of unique. I've owned the E92, 2 F82's, and will lease a G82 more than likely when the lease on the 2020 (leased in 2019) is up. I like doing the track days BMW puts on, but have never tracked my own car, but am mustering the courage to invest in this hobby. I have a couple of colleagues at work that track their cars, and they enjoy it.

Anyway, I don't give a lot of thought to what other people like. I don't see any need to mod my car, tint my windows, or change out the wheels, or whatever. I do like reading about what others do, and seeing the pictures. I did use a Carly to code out some stuff on my car, but in fairness I did that on my X2 as well.

When I was a kid, only rich people drove Cadillacs. Now, anyone can drive anything. As someone else said, unlimited options and credit let anyone with a decent job lease a 100k car. There's no status in a car anymore.
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      10-12-2020, 09:18 AM   #33
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Who's buying?

I've had the first of the last three generations of M3 Coupe/M4 (current '15 M4). Even though I'm 72, I'm leaning toward getting the new one (subject to spousal negotiation!). I don't like the fact that it's gotten bigger and heavier, however. Other option is to wait for the next M2, but I like a little more luxury than that currently affords.
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      10-12-2020, 12:38 PM   #34
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I wouldn't mind the ever increasing size if they would let us put the nicer options on the smaller cars. Let me option up an M2 and I don't care how big they make the M3.
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      10-12-2020, 02:32 PM   #35
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I am considering the G80 M3 due to growing family members. In my late 30s with a 5 month old, I can live with my M2C, but we are planing for a 2nd one, and two infant seat in a M2 ain't happing. Wife was telling to get a M5, but its way to big for my taste. I guess I am in the purist catagory, I have owned e30, e36M, and e46M, e90 and now f87 which I love, but with a growing size family will need a sedan. Also told my wife once our kids are in front facing booster seat most likely get back on the next gen M2 lol. Sure it won't have the luxury goods as the M3/4/5 etc, but could care less. As someone else had mentioned M is so diluted now a days and anyone can pretty much get one. Met a 20 year old or so guy few weeks back at Whole Foods he was telling how he just spent 4K on his 2018 M4 on MP parts that morning. Also my neighbor was a Audi guy until he became our neighbor lol. After he met me he ended up getting X7 for his wife and M4 for him lol.

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      10-12-2020, 03:40 PM   #36
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all cars are getting heavier as consumers generally prefer the swiss army knife approach and want "more", "bigger', "faster" in every new car they buy... this is the end result. It's only gonna get worse as most new cars after this generation will be electrified.

Positioning wise, I agree with many that it doesn't matter how BMW spends their ad dollars. All the EDM music and harbour drifting might portray a younger image but it's really just trying to get attention. In fact all the bashing we are doing on the internet is free advertising for BMW and getting ordinary shoppers to check out the car. Most people who have seen the car in real life have softened their stance or even reported positive impressions, so you can extrapolate where this is going ...

and to the gate keeping crowd who complain M is diluted, I say it's just a necessary evil. Just think of Porsche SUVs and how that saved the brand financially and allowed continuing brilliance of their sports cars. I hope hardcore/pure M models will come, but you can't expect them to come cheap as there's no economy of scale in them. Overall BMW's liberal use of M marketing isn't as bad as MB with AMG... as example I rarely hear "fake M" associated with a M340i but hear "fake AMG" all the time when someone describes a C43 or A35
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      10-12-2020, 04:23 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW / Oregon View Post
I've had the first of the last three generations of M3 Coupe/M4 (current '15 M4). Even though I'm 72, I'm leaning toward getting the new one (subject to spousal negotiation!). I don't like the fact that it's gotten bigger and heavier, however. Other option is to wait for the next M2, but I like a little more luxury than that currently affords.
Wow! An OG. I remember you from over a decade ago.
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      10-13-2020, 05:03 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by deceptiv.M3 View Post
What's the target audience? I'm trying to understand how I personally fit into BMW's lineup.

The car seems to get longer and heavier every generation. Forget the grills, the car looks like a behemoth on video. I bought my M3 because I wanted one since I set my eyes on the E46 M3, but each generation seems to move farther from that car.

Anyone else feeling similar?
Probably the same demo as previous M//4s. Find out who bought those and that's probably the same group(s) ... right?
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      10-13-2020, 10:05 AM   #39
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It's targeted at ME, in black please!
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      10-13-2020, 12:08 PM   #40
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Answer: The demographic that purchases M-cars or german luxury performance in general. Strange question.
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      10-13-2020, 12:27 PM   #41
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Answer: The demographic that purchases M-cars or german luxury performance in general. Strange question.
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      10-21-2020, 01:46 AM   #42
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They're not targeting this demographic but they'll still buy it eventually.
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      10-21-2020, 02:58 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Penguino View Post
I think it's being targeted at Millennials who are looking to lease a $80K car for $1000 a month with a $75K yearly salary.

I do not think it's targeted at $100K+ income +40 year old Males anymore.

Prior to the E92 days it was difficult to find a 30 year old in an M3 since people used to purchase these cars and not lease them. Leasing has made these vehicle much more accessible to anyone. With he F80 you can find a very large group of owners in their 20s as well as 30s which is surprising based on the MSRP of the car.

The 40-50 year old crowd are mostly moving to P-cars.
$1000 lease for an $80k car?! That's a rip off. More like $800 with zero down given the high RV's that were offered on the F80 leases. Who knows if they will continue that tradition with the G80.

Being 40+ and already having 3 other cars, the F80 just seemed like a great deal for what you got, especially the CS models. The new G80, however, doesn't quite fit in the same category, being larger and heavier. M2 or P-Car are probably going to replace my F80. Note that the M2 nor Porsches enjoy the inflated RV's that the F80 did, so it's a totally different financial decision.
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      10-21-2020, 03:02 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m20e3087 View Post
I am considering the G80 M3 due to growing family members. In my late 30s with a 5 month old, I can live with my M2C, but we are planing for a 2nd one, and two infant seat in a M2 ain't happing. Wife was telling to get a M5, but its way to big for my taste. I guess I am in the purist catagory, I have owned e30, e36M, and e46M, e90 and now f87 which I love, but with a growing size family will need a sedan. Also told my wife once our kids are in front facing booster seat most likely get back on the next gen M2 lol. Sure it won't have the luxury goods as the M3/4/5 etc, but could care less. As someone else had mentioned M is so diluted now a days and anyone can pretty much get one. Met a 20 year old or so guy few weeks back at Whole Foods he was telling how he just spent 4K on his 2018 M4 on MP parts that morning. Also my neighbor was a Audi guy until he became our neighbor lol. After he met me he ended up getting X7 for his wife and M4 for him lol.
Get an M2 and an X3 commuter or something. Or drive the wife's car when it's family time. M2/Porsche for daddy time. I went for M3 daddy car, i3 daddy commuter, SUV for mommy, and a spare 4 door for random occasions.
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