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      09-28-2020, 11:33 AM   #1
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G80 Technology Improvements?

The launch of the F8x was surrounded with a blizzard of information about the technology improvements that helped to save weight, improve handling, chassis stiffness, engine responsiveness etc.

e.g. CF driveshafts, directly bolted rear axle/subframe, turbo lag mitigation.

It would be great to see a compilation of articles like this for G8x... but I am struggling to find much by way of technical information. (if there's any out there it's buried under mounds of posts about 'aggressive styling' etc.)

Would be great to collect some links here!
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      09-28-2020, 11:52 AM   #2
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Ditto to this...

One of the best improvements in the F8X was the inclusion of 3 separate cooling systems. I wonder if the S58 has a similar setup? I also looked at some engine photos, and it didn't look as maintenance friendly w/ the location of various parts.
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      09-28-2020, 12:13 PM   #3
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Here is some information regarding the engine.

https://g80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1582884

https://www.bimmerpost.com/goodiesfo...S58-Engine.pdf
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      09-28-2020, 12:17 PM   #4
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And some engine output numbers. About +80whp over S55 like for like tune.

I haven't redlined the tech sheets yet but i'm sure a qualified engineer here can explain the technical technological improvements over the prior gen.

I hope the technological improvements atleast somewhat offset the weight gain but we prob won't know until driving reviews and press gets their hands on the car.

https://g80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1760334
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      09-28-2020, 01:16 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Avaley View Post
And some engine output numbers. About +80whp over S55 like for like tune.

I haven't redlined the tech sheets yet but i'm sure a qualified engineer here can explain the technical technological improvements over the prior gen.

I hope the technological improvements atleast somewhat offset the weight gain but we prob won't know until driving reviews and press gets their hands on the car.

https://g80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1760334
Thanks for the technical engine details - I'd seen that thread before, but always good to have more pointers.

The engine is one of the things I'm least concerned about (apart from perhaps the power/tq curves below 3000rpm - which perhaps explain some of the X3M "lag" comments)

Would love to see similar technical docs for transmission (my #1 priority!), electrical power steering, suspension/chassis, AWD!
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      09-28-2020, 02:22 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pbar View Post
Thanks for the technical engine details - I'd seen that thread before, but always good to have more pointers.

The engine is one of the things I'm least concerned about (apart from perhaps the power/tq curves below 3000rpm - which perhaps explain some of the X3M "lag" comments)

Would love to see similar technical docs for transmission (my #1 priority!), electrical power steering, suspension/chassis, AWD!
I don't think the full G8x technical document is out yet (someone please correct me here as I would love to get my hands on that) but the closest thing we have now is the F9x docs.

https://www.bimmerpost.com/goodiesfo...te-Vehicle.pdf

I don't think they offer the SUVs in manual, but the ZF M8HP76 will be the exact same transmission for the auto. I think the M Xdrive also carries over.
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      09-28-2020, 02:37 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pbar View Post
Thanks for the technical engine details - I'd seen that thread before, but always good to have more pointers.

The engine is one of the things I'm least concerned about (apart from perhaps the power/tq curves below 3000rpm - which perhaps explain some of the X3M "lag" comments)

Would love to see similar technical docs for transmission (my #1 priority!), electrical power steering, suspension/chassis, AWD!
Agreed. Even on the engine front, doesn't seem like they've posted anything to suggest the turbo lag/engine responsiveness will be improved from the X3M
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      10-03-2020, 06:54 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by momo3605 View Post
Agreed. Even on the engine front, doesn't seem like they've posted anything to suggest the turbo lag/engine responsiveness will be improved from the X3M
There's indeed no new tricks or technology in the S58 over the S55. From what I read, they simply went with the old proven method of lower compression ratio with bigger turbos to increase power through more boost at the expense of a higher boost threshold and more lag.
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      10-03-2020, 09:03 AM   #9
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It's a clear tell-tale sign that BMW's R&D budget is slipping on the pure internal combustion engine platform. A paradigm shift all the way to Hybrid and pure EV.

The old M is gone.

For people who opt AT instead of the 6MT you have now a much wider selection of cars to choose from since one primary ethos of classic BMW M - agility - is virtually non existent in this generation.
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      10-03-2020, 09:42 AM   #10
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The Alpina acknowledges the S58 coming out of box is quite laggy, therefore has already done the right thing to it with the B3.

The result is the lag free and more mid range punch, which is more than enough to make up for the top end loss.
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      10-03-2020, 11:22 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Avaley View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by pbar View Post
Thanks for the technical engine details - I'd seen that thread before, but always good to have more pointers.

The engine is one of the things I'm least concerned about (apart from perhaps the power/tq curves below 3000rpm - which perhaps explain some of the X3M "lag" comments)

Would love to see similar technical docs for transmission (my #1 priority!), electrical power steering, suspension/chassis, AWD!
I don't think the full G8x technical document is out yet (someone please correct me here as I would love to get my hands on that) but the closest thing we have now is the F9x docs.

https://www.bimmerpost.com/goodiesfo...te-Vehicle.pdf

I don't think they offer the SUVs in manual, but the ZF M8HP76 will be the exact same transmission for the auto. I think the M Xdrive also carries over.
I would expect bmw to publicize specific tech improvement whether to the motor or otherwise in concert with the first press drive event... that way they can pair the technical side with real experiential feedback on the benefits
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      10-06-2020, 09:45 PM   #12
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The drift analyzer is the biggest improvement. I’m getting a G8x just because of that.
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      10-06-2020, 09:51 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abenney View Post
The drift analyzer is the biggest improvement. I’m getting a G8x just because of that.
Would love for you to do a G8x vs your F82 side by side comparison / review.
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      10-06-2020, 10:21 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by Avaley View Post
Would love for you to do a G8x vs your F82 side by side comparison / review.
I forgot to add the /sarcasm at the end of my sentence. I couldn’t cringe any harder when I saw them market the drift analyzer as a “cool” feature.
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      10-06-2020, 10:40 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanAutM3 View Post
There's indeed no new tricks or technology in the S58 over the S55. From what I read, they simply went with the old proven method of lower compression ratio with bigger turbos to increase power through more boost at the expense of a higher boost threshold and more lag.
Agreed, that’s exactly what it looks like which is likely going to be a bummer for those who love low rpm TQ and/or a linear power curve. Personally I don’t care much at sub 3k TQ but I do care about throttle response within the power band and on/off throttle behavior. If the low compression ratio make that significantly softer than the S55 it’s not something I’ll be happy about.
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      10-08-2020, 11:07 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
Agreed, that’s exactly what it looks like which is likely going to be a bummer for those who love low rpm TQ and/or a linear power curve. Personally I don’t care much at sub 3k TQ but I do care about throttle response within the power band and on/off throttle behavior. If the low compression ratio make that significantly softer than the S55 it’s not something I’ll be happy about.
I totally agree that I would always want to drive an M car with the revs in the power band - and especially on the track. With these cars, my concern is that the time it takes to go from 3000 to 7000rpm is going to be really short - and especially if the 8 speed box is setup with quite similar ratios. This is going to make it really hard to drive "manually". I found this to be a real issue with the X3M... and I wonder if the ratios are going to be the same on the G8x?

Additionally, if you're city driving you're going to have to be really careful not to let the revs bog down below 3k. Again- this is probably not an issue in full auto - but I don't want to drive an M car like that. One of the reasons I drive a DCT in 'manual' mode is so that I can keep the revs where I want them, rather than letting it 'save fuel' for me.

I'm also very interested in technological improvements to chassis, suspension and steering, and that is the main reason I started this thread. We know surprisingly little about any of these things right now.... I wonder when the press drives will start happening?
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      10-08-2020, 12:03 PM   #17
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I suspect part of the lack of info is the press drives haven't started. We'll get more info soon I hope

Driving an 8 sp manually is a bit annoying but I do it all the time in my X5. I want to select gears myself
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      10-08-2020, 01:24 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pbar View Post
One of the reasons I drive a DCT in 'manual' mode is so that I can keep the revs where I want them, rather than letting it 'save fuel' for me.
This was the main issue with our only ZF 8 AT BMW to date, that it upshifted way to early, often two gears to high at city speeds making the car on the border to stutter. It was easy to get around though by driving it in S mode. Our Cayenne with the Asin/Toyota AT has none of that, it’s perfect in normal mode. I’m more curious than concerned to see if BMW allow an M car to behave like that in any mode, especially when the low rpm TQ is non existent... Not really concerned since I’m confident there will be a mode to avoid it but I am curious. This car will be shared between my wife and I much more than the F80 so it will see a lot of auto mode time.

Last edited by solstice; 10-08-2020 at 01:48 PM..
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      10-21-2020, 07:54 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
This was the main issue with our only ZF 8 AT BMW to date, that it upshifted way to early, often two gears to high at city speeds making the car on the border to stutter. It was easy to get around though by driving it in S mode. Our Cayenne with the Asin/Toyota AT has none of that, it’s perfect in normal mode. I’m more curious than concerned to see if BMW allow an M car to behave like that in any mode, especially when the low rpm TQ is non existent... Not really concerned since I’m confident there will be a mode to avoid it but I am curious. This car will be shared between my wife and I much more than the F80 so it will see a lot of auto mode time.
I had an F30 with Sport AT and now a G20 and am happy to report that the transmission programming is now great in Sport mode with gear selector in D. It's similar to Porsche PDK in Sport mode. With the F30 I was changing back and forth between D and manual all the time because D kept the revs too low and S too high.
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      10-22-2020, 09:35 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ABenChod View Post
I forgot to add the /sarcasm at the end of my sentence. I couldn’t cringe any harder when I saw them market the drift analyzer as a “cool” feature.
I thought your sarcasm was pretty apparent, lol
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