2021 BMW G82 M4 Competition vs RS5 vs AMG C63S // DRAG & ROLL RACE

jkap27 · 03-16-2021, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FreeDarko

How does a model Y long range only weigh 4400 lbs and we are expecting a 48volt hybrid to weigh more?

The new M340i with 48v went up only 70lbs and combined with inline 6 its under 4000lbs.

Ah it's just the 48 volt motor and the 4 cylinder engine? The way people were talking performance wise I thought they were putting two jet engines on this thing 🤣 it shouldn't gain much weight if it's just the 48v but theyre gonna have to engineer their butts off just to meet the horsepower figure of the outgoing c63. Should be a pretty nice bump in torque though...about 30 lb ft id guess.

FreeDarko · 03-16-2021, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jkap27

Quote:

Originally Posted by FreeDarko

How does a model Y long range only weigh 4400 lbs and we are expecting a 48volt hybrid to weigh more?

The new M340i with 48v went up only 70lbs and combined with inline 6 its under 4000lbs.

Ah it's just the 48 volt motor and the 4 cylinder engine? The way people were talking performance wise I thought they were putting two jet engines on this thing 🤣 it shouldn't gain much weight if it's just the 48v but theyre gonna have to engineer their butts off just to meet the horsepower figure of the outgoing c63. Should be a pretty nice bump in torque though...about 30 lb ft id guess.

Their current in-line 4 is already pushing out 420hp. Tuners are going 520 easily. 48v In front will be more for torque.

However I should rephrase that the rear will need to have a separate battery as well if they plan to do plug in.

But there's also reports that it will have self charging battery which usually isn't the heavy type like the plug ins.

jkap27 · 03-17-2021, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FreeDarko

Their current in-line 4 is already pushing out 420hp. Tuners are going 520 easily. 48v In front will be more for torque.

However I should rephrase that the rear will need to have a separate battery as well if they plan to do plug in.

But there's also reports that it will have self charging battery which usually isn't the heavy type like the plug ins.

I've been poking around the internet for rumors and it seems like the amg insiders are saying similar hp output and a 40 ish jump in TQ. They could be setting it up to just blow people away though I have no idea haha

3RDSECTOR · 03-31-2021, 06:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

Quote:

Originally Posted by jkap27

I think you're not factoring in that mercedes will want to keep the car at a similar price point as the current gen...they're not going to be able to 'turn the wick up' as much as you're expecting. I would expect 550hp max with a several hundred pound weight increase. From the ind dyno it sounds like bmw is sandbagging their numbers as usual so the m4 likely has a bit more power than advertised. I think the two will be pretty close performance wise and the odds of the next gen c63 being significantly faster are unlikely. competition is great for the industry so I'd love to see mercedes come up with a much faster car and see the other brands respond but it seems pretty unlikely logically. Tesla really has all the answers as far as electric cars go.. they completely strip down their interior and brand it as sleek then spend all that savings on the performance bits. I dont think mercedes or other luxury cars will make sacrifices like that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by adc

I think you are correct. BMW, Mercedes etc only bring incremental performance improvements from generation to generation not because they couldn't do more, but because they want to charge more for extra performance.

To wit, M3 power figures in the last 3 generations:
E90 414BHP, 450BHP GTS
F80 425BHP, 444BHP ZCP, 503BHP GTS
G80 477BHP, 503BHP ZCP

With the F80, they could have come out of the gate with 450-470BHP but they didn't. That is because they charged $3-4k more for the ZCP, and another $70k on top of that for the GTS. And the same for the G80, the difference between base and ZCP is just an engine tune, but that tune is worth thousands of dollars to BMW.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jkap27

Exactly this hypothetical 600hp c63 would probably cost about $100k and step all over the toes of the e class. And if they end up going hybrid with the e63 people will likely still conclude that the c63 is plenty

THANK YOU. I keep repeating the same thing over. What Mercedes can theoretically do doesn't mean they're going to do it. They're not going to deviate that much from what the M3/M4 and RS5 can do and charge the same price for it. At $70k, you're looking at a certain level of performance and output that everyone else in the segment is doing, nothing more/less.

The idea that Mercedes with a hybrid four setup will come out as a "class topping model" out the gate isn't realistic. When has any manufacturer done anything that benefits the customer from a price/performance point-of-view when they can charge you more for incremental performance? The output and performance that you can theoretically get out of a hybrid setup will come at a price and it's highly unlikely Mercedes is going to give you everything for $70k just because it's a first in this segment.

Just popping back in to make you look stupid... https://www.topgear.com/car-news/ele...electric-turbo

3RDSECTOR · 03-31-2021, 06:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jkap27

Quote:

Originally Posted by adc

I think you are correct. BMW, Mercedes etc only bring incremental performance improvements from generation to generation not because they couldn’t do more, but because they want to charge more for extra performance.

To wit, M3 power figures in the last 3 generations:
E90 414BHP, 450BHP GTS
F80 425BHP, 444BHP ZCP, 503BHP GTS
G80 477BHP, 503BHP ZCP

With the F80, they could have come out of the gate with 450-470BHP but they didn’t. That is because they charged $3-4k more for the ZCP, and another $70k on top of that for the GTS. And the same for the G80, the difference between base and ZCP is just an engine tune, but that tune is worth thousands of dollars to BMW.

Exactly this hypothetical 600hp c63 would probably cost about $100k and step all over the toes of the e class. And if they end up going hybrid with the e63 people will likely still conclude that the c63 is plenty

Lol no... https://www.topgear.com/car-news/ele...electric-turbo

Y'all will learn to listen one day.