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      03-04-2020, 02:39 PM   #287
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzuki720 View Post
I hope the chief designer gets let go and we get a better design team
Well BMW's CEO now has a handy reason to fire him - daring handshake denial
@6'14


Last edited by advantage20; 03-04-2020 at 02:52 PM..
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      03-04-2020, 02:40 PM   #288
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Hard to say how well this will sell because manufacturers can provide incentives to get anything off the lot. Question is, will the G8x get some of the biggest ever discounts for a BMW? I think this thing looks hideous and may be in need of serious plastic surgery on the front end. If they think they'll move them near MSRP, game over for BMW.
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      03-04-2020, 02:45 PM   #289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by advantage20 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suzuki720 View Post
I hope the chief designer gets let go and we get a better design team
Well BMW's CEO now has a handy reason to fire him - ostentatious handshake denial
@6'14

Lmao. That fist bump was not cool
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      03-04-2020, 02:46 PM   #290
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
If the car regained some of the magic that was lost when entering the EPS and FI era and has the reliability of the G8X it would have to be really ugly to pass up on.


When someone says hard pass due to a new grill design I’m shaking my head
Knowing what we know already, how in your mind could it possibly regain some of the old magic? Just because of higher HP?

My F80 was also an absolute joy to drive each and every day and was the pinnacle in many ways of M ownership, even faster and easier to drive than my former S85 E63.

However, im not saying, and not sure everyone (anyone) is saying hard pass JUST because its BUTT ugly, its actually all of the above and more and the last straw is the ugly design.

What i mean is, those of us that have followed and enjoyed for decades the offerings from M have finally has enough. First it was the move away from MT only M cars. Then the wannaB an M but never will be \\\M SUVs came about. Then FI...Then came EPS...Then came an M3 bigger than an E39 M5.

Now you will have to deal with all wheel drive on an M3 and a SLUSHBOX it appears for the most powerful versions of the new M3 - And yup... another thing to deal with - multi levels of M3s for peps to fight over which is the “real” M (and no comparison to the very scare CSLs of the past that were true strippers with performance as the focus and not generally for sale in the US).
And ofcourse, the car has gotten so damn big and heavy that one can hardly call this an M3, its nowhere near the size and nimbleness of what the small car M was all about.

So, its not at all just because of the bucktooth bandit grilles, but in fact the totality of the fall from grace that M has done to now offer something that by 90+% of the biased enthusiasts and their ilk all believe to be ugly, in addition to changing each and every enjoyable attribute from the cars previously known as the M3 into a bland, snout nose, bloated car with very little linkage to the history that made it at all possible.

Thats why its a hard pass.
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      03-04-2020, 02:48 PM   #291
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I agree that this is an absolutely disgusting design, and I was initially upset, but I no longer care as BMW is mostly dead to me at this point. I think what most of you are forgetting is that BMW stopped building cars for enthusiasts long ago. That's no longer their market. These will sell, ~90% of them will be leases, and the people that buy them will simply buy them for the badge recognition or to have something different. The problem that BMW faces long term is that when the enthusiasts stop buying, the badge recognition eventually goes away. But they'll be balls deep in electric cars by that time so it won't matter.
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      03-04-2020, 02:55 PM   #292
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m630 View Post
Knowing what we know already, how in your mind could it possibly regain some of the old magic? Just because of higher HP?

My F80 was also an absolute joy to drive each and every day and was the pinnacle in many ways of M ownership, even faster and easier to drive than my former S85 E63.

However, im not saying, and not sure everyone (anyone) is saying hard pass JUST because its BUTT ugly, its actually all of the above and more and the last straw is the ugly design.

What i mean is, those of us that have followed and enjoyed for decades the offerings from M have finally has enough. First it was the move away from MT only M cars. Then the wannaB an M but never will be \\\M SUVs came about. Then FI...Then came EPS...Then came an M3 bigger than an E39 M5.

Now you will have to deal with all wheel drive on an M3 and a SLUSHBOX it appears for the most powerful versions of the new M3 - And yup... another thing to deal with - multi levels of M3s for peps to fight over which is the “real” M (and no comparison to the very scare CSLs of the past that were true strippers with performance as the focus and not generally for sale in the US).
And ofcourse, the car has gotten so damn big and heavy that one can hardly call this an M3, its nowhere near the size and nimbleness of what the small car M was all about.

So, its not at all just because of the bucktooth bandit grilles, but in fact the totality of the fall from grace that M has done to now offer something that by 90+% of the biased enthusiasts and their ilk all believe to be ugly, in addition to changing each and every enjoyable attribute from the cars previously known as the M3 into a bland, snout nose, bloated car with very little linkage to the history that made it at all possible.

Thats why its a hard pass.
That’s fair and I’m not saying everyone should buy it but I’m dumbfounded when it sounds like someone who has experienced and acknowledge how good of a car the current generation is would hard pass by a controversial design without having driven the car.

If like you you pretty much only have the design left as a plus and that is no longer to your liking it’s understandable.
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      03-04-2020, 02:59 PM   #293
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrussGott View Post
Or.

As with the Edsel, the Aztek, the Pacer ... The G8x joins the VW Phaeton and Bangle Butt as one of Europe's worst auto fails. With the depreciation to match.

Anybody that takes a loan or pays cash is out of their mind.
"Gentlemen, our work is almost complete. But what this bold design really deserves is a neon yellow/green color to match. We shall name it Sao Paulo Yellow!"
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      03-04-2020, 03:03 PM   #294
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Sol.... for me atleast this is the case, i dont want a big car anymore and anything more than 500hp on day streets is just a stat anyway and not usable. Im moving on to a 2 car scenario, and while ill still likely always have a bmw on my driveway, ill go elsewhere for a sports sedan/car....
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      03-04-2020, 03:06 PM   #295
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frankiebones View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by paliknight View Post
Here >90%. Since that's what you're focused on in this entire thread.

There are no definitive statistics for something this specific. But it doesn't take a genius to extrapolate:

1- it's a 4 door sedan with almost as many convenience features as an S class.

2- it's meant for the road first, track second.

3- even those that do track it, most go once or twice a year average. Still not justifying a hideous car.

4- its competitors are the RS4/5, C63, Quadrifoglio.

5- other competitors managed to design beautiful cars while focusing on performance, including BMW (M8).

6- owners that track their cars are commonly enthusiasts, which are most likely forum members. So you can most likely gauge the percentage of owners that track the car just from this forum.

7- if you like the design, that's great. But most on here do not and you need to respect that. If you don't want negative feedback then don't post shit on a PUBLIC forum.
Most of your points are fair. Appearances are subjective (whereas performance is not) , and each of us are enthusiasts with very strong opinions. People have the right to make decisions about the appearance of a car without ever seeing it in its entirety. And other people (myself) have the right to judge them for making decisions based on grainy, and leaked images of a portion of the car.

WHERE I TAKE ISSUE is with the histrionics of certain members who say "100% the designers of BMW are not proud of this," or other such ridiculous statements.
Yeah I don't blame you for wanting to wait until official release. Ill probably still want to see it in person, just out of curiosity as to what the BMW designers saw. Yes forum members hate on every new generation of a model line. They did the same with the 997, 991, 992, E92, F80, etc. I just hope these photos dont do the car justice.
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      03-04-2020, 03:11 PM   #296
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I think this design change really took on a life of it own. I read a lot of the posts and I think some of us lost perspective on the current car market:

If you drive automatic and don't like the new design, you have plenty of choices so just buy an Audi, Benz etc or simply take one of the current generation M since there are dozens that are available on the lot today.

If you are like me and love 6MT, get the M2.

If you like to complain for the sake of complaining, keep posting!!
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      03-04-2020, 03:12 PM   #297
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F32Fleet View Post
VW Phaeton was a Bentley at a fraction of the cost.
Exactly why the Phaeton was sales poison:

Nobody wants a budget bentley or high-dollar volkswagen. That strategy didn't work the first time when it was called the Chrysler TC in the late 80s which was a cheap Maserati.

BMW is betting that new-to-the-brand buyers (esp in China) will outnumber fleeing existing customers ... FYI BMW: just like budget luxury cars, that strategy has never once worked.
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I thought the next M4 was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.
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      03-04-2020, 03:19 PM   #298
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Quote:
Originally Posted by advantage20 View Post
Well BMW's CEO now has a handy reason to fire him - daring handshake denial
@6'14

Disheveled Adrian looked like some hobo in a suit!
The only interesting part of the video was the E30.
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      03-04-2020, 03:31 PM   #299
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jez_zza View Post
Could be a repost ... but there you go . new leak / render
"Could be"? lol
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      03-04-2020, 03:35 PM   #300
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thebmw View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by 535i MSport View Post
Let's wait and see what we think of it. My hunch is that it will grow on you....hopefully!
Yes, it will grow on us like a moldy fungus. Thanks but I'd rather have it not grow on me and just appreciate the plentiful good designs that are already out there that needed no fungal overgrowth.
Lol, like it....let's see what discounts will be rolled out on this.
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      03-04-2020, 04:00 PM   #301
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Not everything can be "warmed up to". I've strayed away from plenty of cars that made such drastic changes they flipped from a would-buy to a would-never-buy

This new look, coming from the F80, almost hurts. I felt the F80 was the best looking non supercar from the last decade. I doubt the G8X cars will be in my top 20 for this coming decade
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      03-04-2020, 04:23 PM   #302
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From HowStuffWorks "Why the Ford Edsel Failed":

"Ford designers wanted to make it stand out, so they hit on the idea of a vertical grille. The thing is, a car's grille has a specific purpose: It allows air into the engine bay to keep the engine cool. In order to keep the Edsel running, that vertical grille had to be enormous, which made the entire car look silly in the eyes of critics and consumers."

https://auto.howstuffworks.com/why-t...sel-failed.htm
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      03-04-2020, 05:10 PM   #303
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Originally Posted by bimmerfile View Post
"...that vertical grille had to be enormous, which made the entire car look silly in the eyes of critics and consumers."
Ah HA!

But Ford marketing never used the words "bold" and "presence in abundance" - that's the difference here.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
I thought the next M4 was going to be a flying car powered by bloomin' onions and a teaspoon of mayonnaise. At least that's what I read on the internet @ BimmerPoop.org.
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      03-04-2020, 05:31 PM   #304
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrgunfun View Post
Calling 2018 year model M3CS as a future classic is a bit going overboard.
What about M4 GTS?
Sorry man, gonna go w the new one on this one.

It will be amazing in person. Also, its BMW of the future. We all will get used to it, everyone had mixed feelings about the e90, F80 etc...

Hopefully they will make the option for the blue you have on the CS.
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      03-04-2020, 05:34 PM   #305
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I wonder if years down the line the F80 will be looked at as the last true M3.

The backlash the F80 got just as bad as E9X got when it was new. "Not a true M3! Too big! Too heavy! Wrong engine." And then down the line everyone loved it.
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      03-04-2020, 06:06 PM   #306
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Originally Posted by TanzaniteBlue View Post
I wonder if years down the line the F80 will be looked at as the last true M3.
Other than bigger grills, what about the new G80 will make it less M3 than the F80 when at least with spec'd with a Manual and RWD. Now with a regular auto and awd, I see the point, but with a manual and rwd, the G80 doesn't present a big change mechanically, more just an evolution of the F80 formula, only visually is it a revolution.
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      03-04-2020, 06:10 PM   #307
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joshuastein55 View Post
Other than bigger grills, what about the new G80 will make it less M3 than the F80 when at least with spec'd with a Manual and RWD. Now with a regular auto and awd, I see the point, but with a manual and rwd, the G80 doesn't present a big change mechanically, more just an evolution of the F80 formula, only visually is it a revolution.
Agreed, for the AWD/8 speed auto models, it's not much of an M3 to me now. The M-DCT is leagues ahead of the ZF 8 speed in terms of dynamics. Driving my F80 and an M340i back to back you feel it. The 8 speed is good, but not nearly visceral enough IMO. It's all about programming. This is what ultimately drove me away from a Quadrofoglio. Alfa managed to totally screw the downshifting logic unless you're in race mode and 100000% up to temperature. Slow, clunky, unresponsive. Losing the DCT is a huge downfall right off the bat.

Now....for the 6 speed RWD G80, different story. I agree there as well.

Looks wise, the F8X is a sexy, stunning car. I cannot get past the front end of a G80. I will be buying out my F80, and maybe get a Z4 M40i or something. I don't want to jump the BMW ship. I've been in all the competitors and they don't do it for me.
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      03-04-2020, 07:01 PM   #308
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrgunfun View Post
Calling 2018 year model M3CS as a future classic is a bit going overboard.
What about M4 GTS?
M3CS is by far the best BMW I have ever driven. And I have driven almost all of them. My own Comp Pack F80 is very very nice but what comes to driving dynamics, it is quite pale in compared to the CS.
A future classic? For sure imho.
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