[wtwo3]

Thoughts?

https://www.roadandtrack.com/reviews...-drive-review/

"Out on track, the CT4-V Blackwing doesn't have quite the same pointy front end as the new M3, but it's better in every other regard. You'd have to get a stopwatch out to see which is quickest, but the Cadillac is far more fun and communicative than the BMW. And, as previously stated, the manual in the Caddy is much sweeter than the M3's."

[JDUNITNOW]

I never owned a Cadillac and actually considered the CT5V but came back to the M3 and ordered one. Here's the thing, it can drive better but to me the M3 is a better looking car and they don't change their design after two years. My fear is GM will abandon a project at the drop of a hat and their reliability and support can be abysmal.

[DoubleDave]

I seriously considered this car but the biggest plus and minus of the car is it’s size. While it weighs nearly as much as an M3 it’s noticeable smaller inside.

I’m 5’10” and I have a 5’7” daughter and 6’ son…the car is simply too small for me to carry my two favorite people around.

The inability to drive one until who knows when was another downside. I bought one car without driving it and regretted it in a big way. Won’t do that again.

Lastly, the interior still looks a little too GM parts bin…the central 8” screen is too small and feels a little last gen to me.

Having said all of that…it looks like they nailed the powertrain and driving dynamics.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by DoubleDave

Lastly, the interior still looks a little too GM parts bin…the central 8” screen is too small and feels a little last gen to me.

Having said all of that…it looks like they nailed the powertrain and driving dynamics.

Yeah these were my thoughts. Great job on the dynamics, but the build quality and interior design are big question marks just going off GM products historically. As far as I know BMW doesn't have a "parts bin" from a lower tier brand the way Cadillac does with Chevy. And you KNOW Chevy parts will be used.

Another thing for me, and people may feel differently, but to me at least, Cadillac doesn't have the same brand cachet as BMW (despite BMW's best efforts recently to ruin that with their marketing).

[DoubleDave]

Originally Posted by wtwo3

Yeah these were my thoughts. Great job on the dynamics, but the build quality and interior design are big question marks just going off GM products historically. As far as I know BMW doesn't have a "parts bin" from a lower tier brand the way Cadillac does with Chevy. And you KNOW Chevy parts will be used.

Another thing for me, and people may feel differently, but to me at least, Cadillac doesn't have the same brand cachet as BMW (despite BMW's best efforts recently to ruin that with their marketing).

Brand cachet has never been a thing for me. If it’s a good car and does what I want, has the features I want, at the price I want then I’m sold. I do understand that’s important to some.

[Patton250]

Originally Posted by wtwo3

Thoughts?

https://www.roadandtrack.com/reviews...-drive-review/

"Out on track, the CT4-V Blackwing doesn't have quite the same pointy front end as the new M3, but it's better in every other regard. You'd have to get a stopwatch out to see which is quickest, but the Cadillac is far more fun and communicative than the BMW. And, as previously stated, the manual in the Caddy is much sweeter than the M3's."

I actually looked at getting one. You can’t get one.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by DoubleDave

Brand cachet has never been a thing for me. If it’s a good car and does what I want, has the features I want, at the price I want then I’m sold. I do understand that’s important to some.

It's not high up on my list per se (just look at my car history lol). But it's still something... I feel good about driving a BMW more so than I did when I drove my Infiniti.

[DAlby18]

Me personally I would never touch GM with a 10 ft pole. My brother-in-law only use to buy GM products (8 in total) ranging from pickups to Escalades to Corvettes and each one came with their own bucket of problems. The last gen Escalade had an interior sprinkler system every time it rained that would wet him every time he accelerated. His C7 Z06 had the lovely limp mode every time it was hot outside and he kept bringing it in but they would never resolve the issue. 5 years later they finally have a recall for the issue but when he brought it in they said that he needed to produce the issue on video before fixing it and that his last 10 work orders weren't enough proof of the issue. He got so fed up and sold all his vehicles.

Between my father, brother and myself we have owned 11 BMW's all together and currently have a G80 on order. All I can say is BMW is not perfect but when there is an issue they are on it like a fat kid on a smartie. I bought one Mercedes (GLE 43). I loved the vehicle but hated Mercedes sales/service. Just wanted to try something else but I keep finding my way back to BMW.

[DoubleDave]

Originally Posted by Patton250

I actually looked at getting one. You can’t get one.

The first run is sold out but I believe dealers are taking names of those who want in on the next production run.

[heavyD^2]

GM was smart to limit quantities. They made a bunch of ATS-V's and nobody bought them. I was close to buying a heavily discounted ATS-V. It looked good and drove great but I just couldn't get over the interior. It had an instrument cluster that looked like it was pulled straight out of a late 90's Chevy Lumina and piano black plastic everywhere. I feel they have improved the interior a lot but made the exterior less attractive so one step forward, one step back. If you can get a good deal they would be a pretty cool to own as it's basically a 4-door Camaro and there won't be many around if you are into exclusivity.

[Tyga11]

Originally Posted by heavyD^2

GM was smart to limit quantities. They made a bunch of ATS-V's and nobody bought them. I was close to buying a heavily discounted ATS-V. It looked good and drove great but I just couldn't get over the interior. It had an instrument cluster that looked like it was pulled straight out of a late 90's Chevy Lumina and piano black plastic everywhere. I feel they have improved the interior a lot but made the exterior less attractive so one step forward, one step back. If you can get a good deal they would be a pretty cool to own as it's basically a 4-door Camaro and there won't be many around if you are into exclusivity.

I never considered the ATS-V for this reason - the instrument cluster. I have no idea what they were thinking.

[heavyD^2]

Originally Posted by Tyga11

I never considered the ATS-V for this reason - the instrument cluster. I have no idea what they were thinking.

I believe Cadillac fired the people responsible for that at least and have a new president. It should have never made it to production though.

[TrevorM3]

Originally Posted by DAlby18

Me personally I would never touch GM with a 10 ft pole. My brother-in-law only use to buy GM products (8 in total) ranging from pickups to Escalades to Corvettes and each one came with their own bucket of problems. The last gen Escalade had an interior sprinkler system every time it rained that would wet him every time he accelerated. His C7 Z06 had the lovely limp mode every time it was hot outside and he kept bringing it in but they would never resolve the issue. 5 years later they finally have a recall for the issue but when he brought it in they said that he needed to produce the issue on video before fixing it and that his last 10 work orders weren't enough proof of the issue. He got so fed up and sold all his vehicles.

Between my father, brother and myself we have owned 11 BMW's all together and currently have a G80 on order. All I can say is BMW is not perfect but when there is an issue they are on it like a fat kid on a smartie. I bought one Mercedes (GLE 43). I loved the vehicle but hated Mercedes sales/service. Just wanted to try something else but I keep finding my way back to BMW.

He had issues with a c7Z when it was hot outside? Up in Canada? Or he had issues with it when he tracked it? The car is known to have cooling issues (Auto) when tracked, but regular driving? I hardly believe that.

I had a c7Z in south florida, raced it monthly, that car never had one issue, and it was 8 speed.

[Murf]

I like it.

[six-n-twins53]

Resale will be terrible

[TrevorM3]

Originally Posted by six-n-twins53

Resale will be terrible

ok, and the m3 wont?

[car_fan]

Originally Posted by six-n-twins53

Resale will be terrible

Based on what? Prices for used V2’s & V3’s hold up really well. For that matter a used V2 wagon, especially the 6speed, will likely have a higher resale value than any comparable M3 for that era. The V2 sedans (2009-2014) are equal in resale value - if not more so - to the value of E9x ///M’s from the same period albeit up to 2013 for the E9x ///M’s. V3’s (2016-2019) with reasonable miles are low to mid 60k on average. Low mileage cars are over 70K.

[strohw]

I posted this in another thread but I looked into the Blackwing yesterday and today. Was trying to decide between the M3 and the Blackwing and I was actually leaning towards the Blackwing. Found one on Autotrader today, spec'd the way I wanted at 65k with a manual. Called and had them run the numbers which came back at a 51% residual on a 36/10k with a .002 MF. Basically, the 65k Blackwing cost 3K more over 3 years than a 75k M3. Down goes the Blackwing.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by strohw

I posted this in another thread but I looked into the Blackwing yesterday and today. Was trying to decide between the M3 and the Blackwing and I was actually leaning towards the Blackwing. Found one on Autotrader today, spec'd the way I wanted at 65k with a manual. Called and had them run the numbers which came back at a 51% residual on a 36/10k with a .002 MF. Basically, the 65k Blackwing cost 3K more over 3 years than a 75k M3. Down goes the Blackwing.

What did your payment end up being?

[strohw]

Originally Posted by wtwo3

What did your payment end up being?

They wanted 1241 per month with 0 DAS. I was hoping the numbers were more like 53-54% residual with something like a .0015 MF. That would have put the payment more around 1150 per month with 0 DAS.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by strohw

They wanted 1241 per month with 0 DAS. I was hoping the numbers were more like 53-54% residual with something like a .0015 MF. That would have put the payment more around 1150 per month with 0 DAS.

And this was for a CT4 blackwing? Yikes... so a CT5 would be over $1,500 easy then...

[strohw]

Yep. A 90k CT5 Blackwing would have around a $1650 month payment with 0 DAS assuming the same MF and residual as the CT4. Both are definitely finance vehicles.