[PappadocX6M50i]

Searched a ton on this and it might be the Oil filter housing gasket. Just got my 2023 M50i off Swapalease. Couple days later the CEL goes on. Fields BMW (Northfield, IL) are HORRIBLE and convince me that the previous owner put oil by accident in the coolant tank. Total BS. So they refused to warranty anything and wanted $5K for flushes, thermostat, new tank, etc. They also said I could go to an indy shop and get it done much cheaper then take the car to another dealer!

I took the car to a private BMW mechanic who said it is may be leaking somewhere but could try to fix. He flushed the system several times, new hoses, and tank and the oil was gone. The hope was BMW then replacing the thermostat as the system was clean. One week later it's at a different BMW dealer (Patrick in Schaumburg) and oil is back in the coolant tank! So it is coming from somewhere. New SA at Patrick BMW initially said it is not covered under warranty having called Fields. However, they are still looking into it. Also, two thermostats were replaced the past 3 months before I bought the car.

If the system was flushed, hoses changed, new coolant, tank, most of the oil has to be gone. So HOW DOES THE OIL KEEP COMING BACK? It must be leaking from somewhere? I told the SA to check the OFHG. I'm losing my mind and probably got screwed by the guy whose lease I took over. Car had a clean history besides the thermostats (I talked to that dealer before I got the car) but clearly has systemic issues.

Thank you!

[RockCrusher]

Originally Posted by PappadocX6M50i

Searched a ton on this and it might be the OFHG. Just got my 2023 M50i off Swapalease. Couple days later the CEL goes on. Fields BMW (Northfield, IL) are HORRIBLE and convince me that the previous owner put oil by accident in the coolant tank. Total BS. So they refused to warranty anything and wanted $5K for flushes, thermostat, new tank, etc.

I took the car to a private BMW mechanic who said it is may be leaking somewhere but could try to fix. He flushed the system several times, new hoses, and tank hoping BMW replaces the thermostat. One week later it's at a different BMW dealer and oil is back in the coolant tank! So it is coming from somewhere. New SA at Patrick BMW just said it is not covered under warranty and called the prior dealer. Also, two thermostats were replaced the past 3 months.

If the system was flushed, hoses changed, new coolant, tank, most of the oil has to be gone? So HOW DOES THE OIL KEEP COMING BACK? It must be leaking from somewhere? I told the SA to check the OFHG. I'm losing my mind and probably got screwed by the guy whose lease I took over. Car had a clean history besides the thermostats.

Thank you!

Can take some real effort to flush a cooling system of contamination especially oil and oil being non water soluble.

Using a good cooling system chemical flushing agent probably is best. One has to run the engine enough to get it up to temperature so the t-stat(s) open and there is full circulation of the hot water/flushing agent through the entire cooling system.

The fluid is drained and the flushing process repeated again.

A test is then putting in just water and running the engine until the engine is up to temperature then draining the water in to a *clean* drain pan. And looking for any oil sheen on the water.

The flushing is not complete until there is no more oil sheen.

Of course there is the possibility the flushing was successful but oil is getting back in the coolant system.

There are a number of areas this can occur. A common area -- because all engines have one (or more) -- is a head gasket.

But each engine model/design has other places where coolant and oil are quite close -- but of course separated -- and if this separation break down -- like in an oil cooler that has coolant flowing through it -- then intermixing of oil and coolant can happen.

A head (or block) porosity problem can also result in oil in the coolant.

It would be up to a tech to know (via training and experience) where the possible sources of intermix could be and then investigate each one in turn to determine which one (or ones) is (are) leaking.

Could be a real job. Could involve a bit or a lot of engine tear down.

I'd hazard a guess at some point rather than the factory funding an intermix problem investigation to simply replace the engine. 'course, for the factory to do this requires the problem be identified and determined to qualify for warranty coverage.

[PappadocX6M50i]

Thank you!!! Great analysis. Challenge is getting BMW to actually do the work to diagnose the root issue. They want the easy way out to say oil was added and it is not covered. Not sure what to do now.

[Chilled]

From memory the water pump/thermostat does no have any oil passages. Same goes for the engine oil coolers. They don't use water to cool them.

The only oil cooler that uses water, is the het exchanger for the trans.


Did you try a leak CO2 leak detection on the water tank? This is a very easy, quick and cheap DIY.

[BlkGS]

I'd be swapping that lease back out. It could be a cracked head, a damaged cooler, or any number of things. Without the history, if the dealer thinks it was improperly filled, they won't have any reason to do further analysis.

The other issue is what they find. If they find the vehicle was.ovearheated and cracked a head, that's not gonna be covered under warranty.

You're taking on a lot of risk by taking this lease over

[M5Rick]

Taking over a lease is always risky, previous owner knows he won't own it and couldn't care less.

[PappadocX6M50i]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

Taking over a lease is always risky, previous owner knows he won't own it and couldn't care less.

I know and this is my 6th time doing it with BMW and first problem. I ran Carfax, Autocheck, and called the dealer where it was just serviced weeks before I took over the lease. They noted no concerns besides the replaced thermostats. So I agree I got screwed...but don't know WTF to do now. I am not gonna swap it out and screw someone else. I have 18 months left and a $1400/mo payment!

[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by PappadocX6M50i

I know and this is my 6th time doing it with BMW and first problem. I ran Carfax, Autocheck, and called the dealer where it was just serviced weeks before I took over the lease. They noted no concerns besides the replaced thermostats. So I agree I got screwed...but don't know WTF to do now. I am not gonna swap it out and screw someone else. I have 18 months left and a $1400/mo payment!

You're at the mercy of the dealer. If you pay them to do the flushing and cleaning, will they warranty the remainder of it needs a new head? What if they have to replace the motor? Or will they say "car was overheated by driver, not under warranty".

You've got big boy expenses you're looking at here. Can you trade it in to the dealer and get out of the lease? Can you dispute the lease swap? You've got to decide how much money you're gonna put into it to fix it, vs what will you be willing to lose on trading or early lease termination.

[Windshieldfarmer]

Originally Posted by PappadocX6M50i

I know and this is my 6th time doing it with BMW and first problem. I ran Carfax, Autocheck, and called the dealer where it was just serviced weeks before I took over the lease. They noted no concerns besides the replaced thermostats. So I agree I got screwed...but don't know WTF to do now. I am not gonna swap it out and screw someone else. I have 18 months left and a $1400/mo payment!

Big Red Flag…replaced a thermostat! Overheating is the classic cause for head gasket failure/head warping. If the thermostat failed open, no big deal. If it failed to fully open, that how overheating can occur. No sure how BMW thermostats are designed but that would certainly be my argument back to the dealer…

[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by Windshieldfarmer

Big Red Flag…replaced a thermostat! Overheating is the classic cause for head gasket failure/head warping. If the thermostat failed open, no big deal. If it failed to fully open, that how overheating can occur. No sure how BMW thermostats are designed but that would certainly be my argument back to the dealer…

That doesn't help, that just means that there's an even better chance the previous owner overheated it, lol.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by BlkGS

That doesn't help, that just means that there's an even better chance the previous owner overheated it, lol.

Yeah, but 1 year old new car should never overheat unless it has a manufacturing defect. A manufacturing defect is covered by warranty. OP should call BMW N.A. and get the regional manger involved. The car should be repaired by BMW because it is under warranty.

Taking it to an indy was not a good solution.

[DrVenture]

Have you (or the dealer) performed a coolant pressure test? Put the system under pressure and see if it loses pressure over time? Assuming it loses pressure, then the oil can be checked for signs of coolant being forced into the crankcase.

That would prove there was indeed a real problem. Maybe then the dealer/BMW would have to step up. A failed thermostat, that led to another failure, would seem to be a warranty claim. A kit like this is relatively cheap, but the trick is getting one that has the correct cap for your vehicles coolant tank.

https://www.amazon.com/LLNDEI-Pneuma...kit-63862.html

https://www.harborfreight.com/radiat...kit-63862.html

If either didn't fit, I am sure they could be returned.

[DrVenture]

Also, is there some legit reason to suspect that a failed OFHG (oil filter housing gasket?) can allow coolant and oil to mix? IOW, are there coolant openings at the OFHG on this specific vehicle?

[PappadocX6M50i]

Originally Posted by DrVenture

Also, is there some legit reason to suspect that a failed OFHG (oil filter housing gasket?) can allow coolant and oil to mix? IOW, are there coolant openings at the OFHG on this specific vehicle?

Thanks for the replies. Yes, oil filter housing gasket. I have no clue other than what I found the forums.

[Bret]

If the thermostat replacements were covered under warranty, I don't see how the dealership could claim that the original owner overheating the car has voided the warranty. Wouldn't they have claimed that to the original owner? OP, can you get copies of all the dealer work that was done on the car?

[BlkGS]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Yeah, but 1 year old new car should never overheat unless it has a manufacturing defect. A manufacturing defect is covered by warranty. OP should call BMW N.A. and get the regional manger involved. The car should be repaired by BMW because it is under warranty.

Taking it to an indy was not a good solution.

While I agree in theory, all bets are off in reality. Maybe it overheated because someone had a piggyback tuner installed and was beating the crap out of it. Maybe they were fiddling with something else and pinched a coolant line. Maybe they sprang a leak and ran it without coolant for a few days while they commuted to work because they didn't have another car. People do dumb stuff to cars all the time, and there's a line between manufacturers defect and dumb customer where the liability transfers. Him being the unfortunate recipient of this car means he can't even really defend himself, because it happened before his ownership (possibly).

If I was a scammer with a car I blew up I'd absolutely try to get out of it on a lease swap, because the reality is that it doesn't get seen by a technician so any sketchy stuff I did is gonna be undetected until the car isn't my problem anymore.

[Mavus]

Can you find out why is dealer denying wrnty?

car mi at the time tstats were replaced?

current mi?

is dme report clean?

something doesn’t add up here …

[PappadocX6M50i]

I got a case manager assigned at BMW NA who seems eager to help. He is contacting the service manager at Patrick and the BMW field engineer to help. Patrick I believe is trying to help diagnose the problem vs. Fields who are just ignorant A-holes telling me the only way oil got in there is from someone dumping it in and wanting to charge me $5K to end up in the same spot I started. Anyone in the Chicago area, NEVER take your car to Fields BMW.

[Chilled]

If its a leased vehicle, isn't it the responsibility of the leasing agency to insure the vehicle is sound? So even if the agreement is private to take over the lease, the vehicle ownership/title belongs to the lease agency. Thus it's on them to insure the leased vehicle is sound.

If not, you have grounds to break lease as you've entered the lease agreement under the pretenses that the vehicle is in full working condition.

[BMWCCA1]

Originally Posted by Chilled

If its a leased vehicle, isn't it the responsibility of the leasing agency to insure the vehicle is sound? So even if the agreement is private to take over the lease, the vehicle ownership/title belongs to the lease agency. Thus it's on them to insure the leased vehicle is sound.

If not, you have grounds to break lease as you've entered the lease agreement under the pretenses that the vehicle is in full working condition.

In your dreams!

The OP isn't even the original lessee. Regardless, the leasing company doesn't guaranty anything.

[alex2364]

Originally Posted by Chilled

If its a leased vehicle, isn't it the responsibility of the leasing agency to insure the vehicle is sound? So even if the agreement is private to take over the lease, the vehicle ownership/title belongs to the lease agency. Thus it's on them to insure the leased vehicle is sound.

If not, you have grounds to break lease as you've entered the lease agreement under the pretenses that the vehicle is in full working condition.

That’s not how it works in the US.

[DrVenture]

Originally Posted by PappadocX6M50i

I got a case manager assigned at BMW NA who seems eager to help. He is contacting the service manager at Patrick and the BMW field engineer to help. Patrick I believe is trying to help diagnose the problem vs. Fields who are just ignorant A-holes telling me the only way oil got in there is from someone dumping it in and wanting to charge me $5K to end up in the same spot I started. Anyone in the Chicago area, NEVER take your car to Fields BMW.

I hope they find the issue and step up to correct it. Sounds like you have the attention of the right people. I do think the dealer should have reached out on your behalf, but...