[paliknight]

Originally Posted by Nahlem

Here is the thing with comments on these forums everyone here is for the right to express opinions and free speech. But there is a certain point where if you watch the forums closely i my self ain't no moderator but even i can see when certain members of the forums because they are so displeased with the design of the car even though it is probably gonna be changed in the not to distant future, when certain people keep expressing their opinions as if it is a fact or it is the truth in some way, or simply that is the "correct" opinion to have. This is seen not only on forums but all over the world if you are of the "right" opinion then that opinion no matter what anyone says is the correct one to have so that becomes the so called"absolute" truth.

That is when it becomes a problem, i have followed the discussions of the G80 for a long time now and the moderators have respected peoples opinions for a very long time but when every thread gets filled with the same comments over and over and drowning out any discussions that may occur that is somewhat interesting and not just another "right" opinion to have then the moderators should act.

Because the truth of the matter is, an opinion is an opinion without fact behind it then that is what it is just another opinion from members on the forums trying to make their opinion of the car become a fact then that is when we get a problem. Because what you feel about the looks of this car and remember it is after all just a car that in 8-15 years will change quite drastically it is only your look on it and certainly other people will probably feel and think like you but it still doesn't make it a fact.

Discussions are to be free and held but when the discussions is posting same old memes of the BMW grill growing in size for every model and becoming the whole car in the end, and same old post about, BMW is trying to kill itself or this is a disaster design or this ain't BMW heritage. Thats when the discussions ain't no discussions anymore it is just gossiping, the same type of gossiping you can hear the elderly have about certain stuff at the downtown local grocery shop.

Well guess what our opinions on what BMW heritage is, probably quite different to what the company thinks and as with anything it is bound to change. Nothing stays the same forever and for good reasons and neither will this design be forever.

To simply put it if you don't like it, and you have already stated your opinion on the design in the previous 10 threads preceding this one, and you ain't going to buy the car.
Then stop flooding the forums with that type of opinion cause if you have already stated it and you gotten your freedom of speech to express it, stop spamming it in every coming thread about the G80.

It is as simple as that.
Let your wallet do the talking and walking. And to those that is going to keep the F80 for a long time fantastic you are doing the environment a favor and using your car to the fullest. And you will save a buck or a few more not spending those cash on a new car.

Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.

I agree with what you're saying, mostly. One thing though, most Forum members consider the car more than just a car. It's a household member to most. Cherished and loved as such. So if they are being emotional and expressing disdain for this controversial design that is hated by the majority (on this forum), its primarily for that reason.

Yes, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but some appearances can be almost universally disliked; be it living things or objects.

I understand that the G80 threads getting drowned out by the plethora of negative design comments makes it difficult to have a productive discussion, but hopefully BMW takes notice and adjusts accordingly.

Other than that, I guess maybe subtly stating your abhorrence of the design then moving onto something more relevant to the discussion would be a start. It's not my forum though so...



Personally, I really like the focus on performance with the new G80 and the idea behind a radical and distinctive design, but hope they can use the negative feedback as a learning experience with future designs.

[Jcali86]

Originally Posted by VTX3

Very seriously considering an order (base RWD, 6MT, Cloth, São Paulo, basically nothing else). Although no question I'd get the touring if available in the US. My "concern" is that they'll change the grill for the LCI. Then I'd be stuck with something I don't personally mind that much, but others really dislike, that was replaced with something much better looking. Scott26 mentioned in the touring thread that the grill appears here to stay even with the LCI. So perhaps I need not be concerned.

Originally Posted by VTX3

Very seriously considering an order (base RWD, 6MT, Cloth, São Paulo, basically nothing else). Although no question I'd get the touring if available in the US. My "concern" is that they'll change the grill for the LCI. Then I'd be stuck with something I don't personally mind that much, but others really dislike, that was replaced with something much better looking. Scott26 mentioned in the touring thread that the grill appears here to stay even with the LCI. So perhaps I need not be concerned.

They're not going to change the grill. It's not going to happen. After a while people will get used to it that didn't like it, and for those of us that already do we can finally stop listening to the whining. The current M3 and M4 look so beyond bland and old now I've seen so many photos of the G8X, sometimes a revolution is needed when your cars all look the same from evolution.

[Mdoa]

This one looks better?

https://carbuzz.com/news/someone-has...he-2021-bmw-m4

[CDN-Driver]

This is just crudely executed.

[dephrank]

Got mixed feelings about those grills. Can't afford that car so I'll just sneak away quietly

[blau.violett.rot]

Originally Posted by CDN-AWD

This is just crudely executed.

+1
May look only good in conjunction with a short number plate on the opposite side.

[GrimJaw]

Everything is great minus the grills. There is no, "I'm warming up to them". They are down right hideous bottom line.

[BMWBuffalo]

Originally Posted by CDN-AWD

This is just crudely executed.

My OCD cannot deal with this! (Picture of the radar sensor in the left grill. Not showing up for some reason.)

[_poseidan]

Ngl grille and front end looks better on the M3 than the M4

[Andrae26]

Originally Posted by CDN-AWD

This is just crudely executed.

Porsche Turbo has it as well

[VetteGuy]

Originally Posted by paliknight

I agree with what you're saying, mostly. One thing though, most Forum members consider the car more than just a car. It's a household member to most. Cherished and loved as such. So if they are being emotional and expressing disdain for this controversial design that is hated by the majority (on this forum), its primarily for that reason.

Yes, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but some appearances can be almost universally disliked; be it living things or objects.

I understand that the G80 threads getting drowned out by the plethora of negative design comments makes it difficult to have a productive discussion, but hopefully BMW takes notice and adjusts accordingly.

Other than that, I guess maybe subtly stating your abhorrence of the design then moving onto something more relevant to the discussion would be a start. It's not my forum though so...



Personally, I really like the focus on performance with the new G80 and the idea behind a radical and distinctive design, but hope they can use the negative feedback as a learning experience with future designs.

With 217 people looking at this particular forum as I write this, and 53 replies to this particular thread, some of them multiple by the same poster, and with a few being overly negative to the point of being a joke, I’m not sure this is much of a learning experience for BMW and its design team and won’t have much impact on adjustments. Constructive criticism and realistic suggestions would carry far more weight than all of the vitriol posted here.

[VetteGuy]

Originally Posted by Mdoa

This one looks better?

https://carbuzz.com/news/someone-has...he-2021-bmw-m4

I like the car as it is, but... I’ll admit... that’s the absolute best optional rendering I have seen to date. Nice job!

That said, I’m sure it will be at least a few years before BMW does an LCI.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by Andrae26

Porsche Turbo has it as well

Many cars have this, but it is centred and not as visually disturbing as on the G8X...

[Rockshaker]

Originally Posted by _poseidan

Ngl grille and front end looks better on the M3 than the M4

You're saying the ugly one looks better than the uglier one

[khanyam4]

Loving the big grill.

[cheezsandwiches]

Lol what the fuck is up with the off center sensor panel on that hideous grill?

[The English Guy]

Long Live The King !
Just don't look at the face

[Tallest]

Wait, the abysmal grille has a tiny abysmal grille in its grille?! What the hell, are they serious?!

[CDN-Driver]

Some thoughts on Grillegate.

The car industry is struggling right now.
I could go on for pages about all the challenges.
Out of these myriad of pressures come massive management blunders.
Grillegate is a symptom of this, as was Dieselgate at VAG.

BMW has a massive design department issue, and a management issue that has allowed this to happen.

As some have said it is no so much about the size of the grille, it's the execution.

Audi has been doing big grilles (15 years now) and it is working just fine, because they are getting the execution right.

If these cars sell poorly BMW will change over time.

One thing is for sure:
BMW Needs to put together a pile of cash and go recruit some designers.

[frankiebones]

Originally Posted by CDN-AWD

Some thoughts on Grillegate.

The car industry is struggling right now.
I could go on for pages about all the challenges.
Out of these myriad of pressures come massive management blunders.
Grillegate is a symptom of this, as was Dieselgate at VAG.

How can you compare a design direction you don't particularly like with the largest fraud ever committed by the automotive industry that was perpetuated on millions of consumers all over the world?

[CDN-Driver]

Originally Posted by frankiebones

How can you compare a design direction you don't particularly like with the largest fraud ever committed by the automotive industry that was perpetuated on millions of consumers all over the world?

Totally fair point, I see them as both representing a problem within a management structure, but I should not compare this to illegal activity. Thanks for pointing that out.

[xlover]

Originally Posted by CDN-AWD

Totally fair point, I see them as both representing a problem within a management structure, but I should not compare this to illegal activity. Thanks for pointing that out.

The problem with the "bad business decision" grill argument is the bold grill designs are selling well so it's unlikely to see any course correction. What the situation really comes down to is those who do not like the grill, cannot understand why bmw would make a product they don't like, then start firing off all kinds of reasoning not supported by the facts of the market.
A couple key examples:
7 series LCI - grill haters say horrible, sales say huge increase vs pre-lci
X5/x7 - grill haters throw out tons of memes, both sales successes
8 series - grill haters reference as the standard for a good looking bmw or what the M4 should have looked like... M8 coupe and convertible canceled for 2021 in the USA due to sales failure

It is what it is, as long as the "controversial" designs drive sales growth and high overall customer satisfaction/appeal with the design bmw will keep going in that direction.