[Limegrntaln]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

The 7:20 and 7:28 are not for the same lap length. You need to use the official 7:16 lap time for the CSL to compare the same lap length. Still 12 seconds is not a huge difference for PSC2R and factory vs Supertest drivers, as you stated.

https://fastestlaps.com/articles/nrb...-of-bmw-m4-csl

"M4 CSL with 7:15.67 lap time at the 20.6 km layout and 7:20.21 at full layout."

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by Limegrntaln

https://fastestlaps.com/articles/nrb...-of-bmw-m4-csl

"M4 CSL with 7:15.67 lap time at the 20.6 km layout and 7:20.21 at full layout."

Correct. AM&S use the 20.6km lap for their testing (which excludes the short straight between pit-in and pit-out of the old track). So to compare with M4Cxdrive AM&S 7:29 lap time, you need to use the the 7:16 time for the CSL .

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Were “track tires” ever offered as a factory option on the Carrera-S ?

Just summers, which IMO make that time it did all that much more impressive. I do believe HP for HP (lb for lb) no one can touch Porsche on track times. I believe the new GT3 RS will set a N'Ring record with only 525 hp or so.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

Just summers, which IMO make that time it did all that much more impressive. I do believe HP for HP (lb for lb) no one can touch Porsche on track times. I believe the new GT3 RS will set a N'Ring record with only 525 hp or so.

My point was that previous generation 911 turbo could be ordered with track tires from the factory. But no longer on the 992 turbo. Most lap times posted for the 991 turbo were on the optional PZ Corsa tires.

I agree, the 992 GT3RS will likely post an impressive time around the ‘ring.

[F85MTuNED]

The G8X is everything I said it would be + more… I truly love this platform.

Sidebar: I need a 992 in my life as well 😓

[YamaLink]

Originally Posted by F85MTuNED

The G8X is everything I said it would be + more… I truly love this platform.

Sidebar: I need a 992 in my life as well 😓

Agreed. I went from "like it a lot" to "wow, this is amazing, this car offers so much for the money". But I also think my M4 has perfect steering because the past 8 years have been in understeering Audis and Tesla Model 3 AWD LR.

For street use what's a 992 or 718 GTS 4.0 going to give for the price? Is it splitting hairs, is it P owners justifying their passion, is it track rats being delusional about street feel, or is the current G8X that number and I just don't know what good steering is? Cuz as of today I think the G8X is telepathic and does everything my mind thinks it should do (on a public street). I'm sure older M owners are giggling reading that.

I'm all in for the 2025 Cayman EV (will go on record saying for DD an EV makes more sense, and a sporting light weight EV is bonus). The Turbo seems like a deal vs the TS. Also wondering why one would get a GT3. Is it just a disdain for turbos as a daily? Never driven one, but it'd be nice not to have low end lag yet the GT3 as a daily would seem to have mid and top end power. Or is it part of the passion? Guy in town selling GT3 RS for inflated price. Shoot, where am I going with this? Oh yeah, the G8X is a screaming bargain compared to my other options, ha.

[RPM33]

Originally Posted by YamaLink

Agreed. I went from "like it a lot" to "wow, this is amazing, this car offers so much for the money". But I also think my M4 has perfect steering because the past 8 years have been in understeering Audis and Tesla Model 3 AWD LR.

For street use what's a 992 or 718 GTS 4.0 going to give for the price? Is it splitting hairs, is it P owners justifying their passion, is it track rats being delusional about street feel, or is the current G8X that number and I just don't know what good steering is? Cuz as of today I think the G8X is telepathic and does everything my mind thinks it should do (on a public street). I'm sure older M owners are giggling reading that.

I'm all in for the 2025 Cayman EV (will go on record saying for DD an EV makes more sense, and a sporting light weight EV is bonus). The Turbo seems like a deal vs the TS. Also wondering why one would get a GT3. Is it just a disdain for turbos as a daily? Never driven one, but it'd be nice not to have low end lag yet the GT3 as a daily would seem to have mid and top end power. Or is it part of the passion? Guy in town selling GT3 RS for inflated price. Shoot, where am I going with this? Oh yeah, the G8X is a screaming bargain compared to my other options, ha.

I agree that an EV like the 2025 Cayman EV is intriguing for a daily driver. I still want a 911 though. However not sure I want to trade in my M2 CS. Just worry I will regret giving up the M2 CS. F87 M2 has perfect size and dimensions in my opinion. G87 M2 size reminds me of a 3 Series.

Someone mentioned on Rennlist that updated 911 configurator to go live by end of June which means a price increase. Mid cycle refresh for 911 is probably next year.

GT3 and GT4 RS and of course GT3 RS allocations are not an option for me since I am not a VIP customer at my Porsche dealer. Dealer has told me multiple times, in-person, email, and phone. 911 Turbo S is best Porsche I can buy. I know 911 GTS is not powerful enough for me as I would regret not spending the extra dough for the Turbo S.

[solstice]

Originally Posted by RPM33

I agree that an EV like the 2025 Cayman EV is intriguing for a daily driver. I still want a 911 though. However not sure I want to trade in my M2 CS. Just worry I will regret giving up the M2 CS. F87 M2 has perfect size and dimensions in my opinion. G87 M2 size reminds me of a 3 Series.

Someone mentioned on Rennlist that updated 911 configurator to go live by end of June which means a price increase. Mid cycle refresh for 911 is probably next year.

GT3 and GT4 RS and of course GT3 RS allocations are not an option for me since I am not a VIP customer at my Porsche dealer. Dealer has told me multiple times, in-person, email, and phone. 911 Turbo S is best Porsche I can buy. I know 911 GTS is not powerful enough for me as I would regret not spending the extra dough for the Turbo S.

The Turbo S is a damn special Porsche. Every time I see one I do the instinctive beautiful woman or supercar 180 degree passer by turn. The GT cars look like race cars and the Carreras as the quintessential sports cars…but the TTS…that’s the only one that looks like a real supercar. It’s so much wider and expensive looking that I often think it’s a new Porsche model not a 911. It’s just fantastic looking and we all know it backs up the looks with performance.

I’m not a there’s no substitute guy and think BMWs are sometimes the better choice but the GT cars and the Turbo S are something else. An EV Cayman, just why? It’s a cramped, heavy sports car with an appliance motor, no appeal to me. An EV Raptor or X5, yes please but a little sports car? No thanks, there’s a reason Elon’s first car flopped…

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by solstice

The Turbo S is a damn special Porsche. Every time I see one I do the instinctive beautiful woman or supercar 180 degree passer by turn. The GT cars look like race cars and the Carreras as the quintessential sports cars…but the TTS…that's the only one that looks like a real supercar. It's so much wider and expensive looking that I often think it's a new Porsche model not a 911. It's just fantastic looking and we all know it backs up the looks with performance.

I'm not a there's no substitute guy and think BMWs are sometimes the better choice but the GT cars and the Turbo S are something else. An EV Cayman, just why? It's a cramped, heavy sports car with an appliance motor, no appeal to me. An EV Raptor or X5, yes please but a little sports car? No thanks, there's a reason Elon's first car flopped…

I feel the same way about the TT/S. It's wide and beautiful; such a curvaceous 911.

[Longboarder]

To be honest i like to look at it in the garage but given the choice, I pick my stock e92 M3 DCT to drive for fun every time.

The GT3 with comfy seats is the ultimate emotional car for a fun drive. I hated the carbon buckets. The 991.2 GTS 4wd with a tune is also incredible if you want 650 hp and a raw emotional connection and brutal speed.

[solstice]

The TTS has all that supercar visual wow factor going on and few of the regular supercar drawbacks. It has great visibility all around and ample head/shoulder room, it’s ride is compliant, the noise level is comfortable and you can use it all year around in most places. You can enter and exit the car without looking like fool and the list goes on. A very special 911 indeed.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by Longboarder

To be honest i like to look at it in the garage but given the choice, I pick my stock e92 M3 DCT to drive for fun every time.

The GT3 with comfy seats is the ultimate emotional car for a fun drive. I hated the carbon buckets. The 991.2 GTS 4wd with a tune is also incredible if you want 650 hp and a raw emotional connection and brutal speed.

Too many people underestimate the 18 way seats in the GT3 but they are great. I also think their buckets are probably the best in the business as well though when you talk about a track and street seat.

[YamaLink]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

Too many people underestimate the 18 way seats in the GT3 but they are great. I also think their buckets are probably the best in the business as well though when you talk about a track and street seat.

Almost OT. There's a new six-figure 2022 Macan GTS on the lot, and someone spec'd it with 8 way. WHY, OH, WHY would someone do that? I'm frugal and sometimes think of the 14 way to save $$, but I'd definitely do 18 once you're at 6 figs and above.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by YamaLink

Almost OT. There's a new six-figure 2022 Macan GTS on the lot, and someone spec'd it with 8 way. WHY, OH, WHY would someone do that? I'm frugal and sometimes think of the 14 way to save $$, but I'd definitely do 18 once you're at 6 figs and above.

So the 8 ways are standard and have the same bolstering as the 18 ways, just without the additional adjustments. Id keep 8 ways before I went to 14 way myself.

[Longboarder]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

Too many people underestimate the 18 way seats in the GT3 but they are great. I also think their buckets are probably the best in the business as well though when you talk about a track and street seat.

Buckets were perfect when I was tracking. But I stoped track events. So on the street they were horrible for me because I like to recline. Then I tried the 2 inch adjusters to lean it back and little and it forced my thighs to angle way too high and it was also very uncomfortable. So I sold it because of the seats.

I have the 14 way on the 991TTS and don't like them at all, but at least I can recline. Much prefer BMW's seats in their top end models over Porsche.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by Longboarder

Buckets were perfect when I was tracking. But I stoped track events. So on the street they were horrible for me because I like to recline. Then I tried the 2 inch adjusters to lean it back and little and it forced my thighs to angle way too high and it was also very uncomfortable. So I sold it because of the seats.

I have the 14 way on the 991TTS and don't like them at all, but at least I can recline. Much prefer BMW's seats in their top end models over Porsche.

I like the buckets, but IMO the most comfortable seats out there are either Porsche sport car 18 ways or the Macan/Cayenne 18 ways.
I do love the buckets in my G80 M3 too but they're more of a compromise than the Porsche buckets.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

I like the buckets, but IMO the most comfortable seats out there are either Porsche sport car 18 ways or the Macan/Cayenne 18 ways.
I do love the buckets in my G80 M3 too but they're more of a compromise than the Porsche buckets.

I think the G8X buckets are the perfect street/track seat.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

Too many people underestimate the 18 way seats in the GT3 but they are great. I also think their buckets are probably the best in the business as well though when you talk about a track and street seat.

I agree about the 18-way seats being very good, I find they offer the best street and track versatility. For the street, I open up the seat bottom and seat back side bolsters and inflate the lumbar support for a comfortable seat; on track I tighten the seat bottom and seat back side bolsters and deflate the lumbar support for a bucket like snug fit. The beauty is that the seat memory also remembers the position of the air bladders (which was not the case on my F82), so switching between street and track configurations is done by the press of a single button.

I had the opportunity to drive a GT2RS on track a few weeks ago that had the fixed CF bucket seats. Surprisingly, I found them less supportive than my properly adjusted 18-way seats. I guess some padding could be added to better fit my body. They do offer very interesting weight reduction and are the ticket for having 6-point harnesses and a Hans device though.

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

I think the G8X buckets are the perfect street/track seat.

Having tried both, I find the 992 18-way to be better. They offer more adjustability, are more supportive and are less ingress/egress compromised.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by Longboarder

To be honest i like to look at it in the garage but given the choice, I pick my stock e92 M3 DCT to drive for fun every time.

The GT3 with comfy seats is the ultimate emotional car for a fun drive. I hated the carbon buckets. The 991.2 GTS 4wd with a tune is also incredible if you want 650 hp and a raw emotional connection and brutal speed.

Have you driven a 992 turbo or turbo-S ? If not, you really should. Porsche have moved the sportiness of the turbo quite a few notches up with the 992. I’ve test driven a 997 and 991.2 turbo and turbo-S, and while blistering fast, I found them a bit too cushy and disconnected for my taste. The 992 TT/TT-S, especially when fitted with the lowered Sport-PASM suspension (that was developed by the GT division) and the Sport exhaust, feels much more raw. It is actually more stiffly sprung than the Carrera-S and feels more connected to the road while offering a very decent aural experience (as opposed the the vacuum cleaner sound of the previous gens).

[AllaVodka]

Tuned car vs stock

Why even compare?

[Longboarder]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Have you driven a 992 turbo or turbo-S ? If not, you really should. Porsche have moved the sportiness of the turbo quite a few notches up with the 992. I've test driven a 997 and 991.2 turbo and turbo-S, and while blistering fast, I found them a bit too cushy and disconnected for my taste. The 992 TT/TT-S, especially when fitted with the lowered Sport-PASM suspension (that was developed by the GT division) and the Sport exhaust, feels much more raw. It is actually more stiffly sprung than the Carrera-S and feels more connected to the road while offering a very decent aural experience (as opposed the the vacuum cleaner sound of the previous gens).

Have't driven a 992GT3 yet but my neighbor has a 992TTS he gave me the keys. I love it (seats are much improved) but not $50 to 75k over msrp love it. To this day still bothered by the rear brake light and interior. I'll prob skip 992.1 gen and see what's in store for the 992.2 hybrid.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by Longboarder

Have't driven a 992GT3 yet but my neighbor has a 992TTS he gave me the keys. I love it (seats are much improved) but not $50 to 75k over msrp love it. To this day still bothered by the rear brake light and interior. I'll prob skip 992.1 gen and see what's in store for the 992.2 hybrid.

Agreed, I would never pay over MSRP for any car. We're lucky where Ilive, selling above MSRP is illegal. I paid 170k USD for my decently well appointed (16k USD in options) 992TT last year. What bothers you about the interior? I find mine quite appealing.