[seis-speed]

Originally Posted by Ragged Edge

Genuine question here, about your confusion. If there is another option to the manual 'pure' M3, please enlighten us! It needs:
4 doors (for kids in the back)
Large boot (trunk) for shopping and trips
MANUAL Transmission
400hp +
Track reliability re: brakes, suspension, motor
Warranty

YES!

Not sure why enthusiasts with kids that want a MANUAL are being ignored by the automakers? I will not own an automatic, they bore me and I just don't want to settle. I walked the entire floor of the LA Auto Show and there are no cars like the G80. The hot hatches, are a bit too small, so the only cars I found with 5 seats, cargo and a manual were the Tacoma and Wrangler.

I am constantly looking for 5 seats with a manual, because having a do it all car is vastly underrated. To all the Dad's out there, I regret selling my F80, TBH. I have some awesome cars, but there is something special about a family hauler, do-it-all, row your own gears car - That you can use for a simple drive to various activities and take on Road Trips.

When I heard about the Blackwing, I dismissed it, I like German cars and I always do European Delivery, but then I started researching the car. The lead engineer did a prolonged interview recently talking about the car and the entire concept. I am strongly considering the car.....

Here is the interview.

[stein_325i]

Originally Posted by seis-speed

YES!

Not sure why enthusiasts with kids that want a MANUAL are being ignored by the automakers? I will not own an automatic, they bore me and I just don't want to settle. I walked the entire floor of the LA Auto Show and there are no cars like the G80. The hot hatches, are a bit too small, so the only cars I found with 5 seats, cargo and a manual were the Tacoma and Wrangler.

I am constantly looking for 5 seats with a manual, because having a do it all car is vastly underrated. To all the Dad's out there, I regret selling my F80, TBH. I have some awesome cars, but there is something special about a family hauler, do-it-all, row your own gears car - That you can use for a simple drive to various activities and take on Road Trips.

When I heard about the Blackwing, I dismissed it, I like German cars and I always do European Delivery, but then I started researching the car. The lead engineer did a prolonged interview recently talking about the car and the entire concept. I am strongly considering the car.....

GM/Cadillac Chassis Tuning is some of the best in the business. They use the excellent alpha platform from the Camaro, and use the LT2 engine from a Corvette and add excellent steering feel, comfortable Magneride suspension as well as some of the best Recaro seats and create an awesome sports car. Their biggest downside was never the driving experience but rather the interior, however, the CT4/5 look to be improved over their CTS/ATS predecessors so I'm very excited to see the new Blackwing products, especially since I already know they will drive really well.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by seis-speed

YES!

Not sure why enthusiasts with kids that want a MANUAL are being ignored by the automakers? I will not own an automatic, they bore me and I just don't want to settle. I walked the entire floor of the LA Auto Show and there are no cars like the G80. The hot hatches, are a bit too small, so the only cars I found with 5 seats, cargo and a manual were the Tacoma and Wrangler.

I am constantly looking for 5 seats with a manual, because having a do it all car is vastly underrated. To all the Dad's out there, I regret selling my F80, TBH. I have some awesome cars, but there is something special about a family hauler, do-it-all, row your own gears car - That you can use for a simple drive to various activities and take on Road Trips.

When I heard about the Blackwing, I dismissed it, I like German cars and I always do European Delivery, but then I started researching the car. The lead engineer did a prolonged interview recently talking about the car and the entire concept. I am strongly considering the car.....

I appreciate the Blackwing, but I can't get on with its styling.

[seis-speed]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

I appreciate the Blackwing, but I can't get on with its styling.

For what I am looking for there are only two candidates.

Blackwing / G80

The Blackwing looks pretty good to me. I am a German car snob, but I don't know, this car might be the one.

[stein_325i]

Originally Posted by seis-speed

For what I am looking for there are only two candidates.

Blackwing / G80

The Blackwing looks pretty good to me. I am a German car snob, but I don't know, this car might be the one.

While I don't find it as attractive as the CTS or the Escala concept it was based on, with the G80/82 getting giant grills, it will likely make me appreciate the looks more.

[seis-speed]

Originally Posted by jstein55

While I don't find it as attractive as the CTS or the Escala concept it was based on, with the G80/82 getting giant grills, it will likely make me appreciate the looks more.

I was willing to deal with the grilles, even though I am not a fan, just get it in black and pick it up at The Welt.

But w/o Euro Delivery..... why not?

[Ghostriderf80]

You guys know how the 911 992 looks so stunning from every angle. The changes are so subtle between generations yet, each time the fans love it.

There was one weird issues w the drive stick which looks like an electric razor but once you touch it really grows on you.

I am just wondering how to best modify a 992. Ohlins, better tires - mostly they come fully loaded.

For your voyeuristic pleasure I have attached a picture that is easy on the eyes.

The M4 really is like a dissection of a nose. or a slice on the CT scanner waiting to see fluid filled sinuses. LOL ENT

[omaralt]

I was planning on picking up an m4 but after seeing the rendering I finally decided to take the plunge and get a 911. Found a clean CPO 2018 with a 7 speed manual and all I can say is wow. I've owned two different f80s and this is on a whole different level. I'm always open to coming back to bmw if they surprise me but for the time being I'm content

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by omaralt

I was planning on picking up an m4 but after seeing the rendering I finally decided to take the plunge and get a 911. Found a clean CPO 2018 with a 7 speed manual and all I can say is wow. I've owned two different f80s and this is on a whole different level. I'm always open to coming back to bmw if they surprise me but for the time being I'm content

Congrats!!!

[stein_325i]

Originally Posted by omaralt

I was planning on picking up an m4 but after seeing the rendering I finally decided to take the plunge and get a 911. Found a clean CPO 2018 with a 7 speed manual and all I can say is wow. I've owned two different f80s and this is on a whole different level. I'm always open to coming back to bmw if they surprise me but for the time being I'm content

Congrats, I'm looking at CPO 991.2's now that my M2 has departed from the garage (totaled).

Which trim level did you get? And if you don't mind me asking, what price range/deal did you get? I'm mainly looking at Base Carrera's, Carrera T's and Carrera S' as GTS' seem to still be pricey.

[SabineBimmer]

Originally Posted by Ghostriderf80

You guys know how the 911 992 looks so stunning from every angle. The changes are so subtle between generations yet, each time the fans love it.

There was one weird issues w the drive stick which looks like an electric razor but once you touch it really grows on you.

I am just wondering how to best modify a 992. Ohlins, better tires - mostly they come fully loaded.

For your voyeuristic pleasure I have attached a picture that is easy on the eyes.

The M4 really is like a dissection of a nose. or a slice on the CT scanner waiting to see fluid filled sinuses. LOL ENT

Agreed! ER

[eman4517]

Originally Posted by Ghostriderf80

You guys know how the 911 992 looks so stunning from every angle. The changes are so subtle between generations yet, each time the fans love it.

There was one weird issues w the drive stick which looks like an electric razor but once you touch it really grows on you.

I am just wondering how to best modify a 992. Ohlins, better tires - mostly they come fully loaded.

For your voyeuristic pleasure I have attached a picture that is easy on the eyes.

The M4 really is like a dissection of a nose. or a slice on the CT scanner waiting to see fluid filled sinuses. LOL ENT

I'm still contemplating modifications on the 991 2 4S, however, to your point, they have everything you need if you spec it right. I was lucky enough to get the awesome and sticky Pilot Sport 4S tires and the grip is amazing. The Sport Chrono pkg is also a must (rear axle steering, sport chrono, GT steering wheel, sport exhaust). Mine is a 2019 with PDK.

We also didn't like some of the design changes on the 2020 992 as much (personal preference). Porsche did a good job at incorporating several design and engineering changes into the 992, but unlike BMW on the 4, they did it well. They made the car a bit better and also refreshed it to still keep it relevant.

The changes were very noticeable, but not completely polarizing and kept 75% of the 911 DNA so it was welcomed by most. We personally didn't care for how the exhaust was incorporated through the bumper (like my 2015 RS5), and also how the car grew in size a bit. The instrumentation panel was also more modern; it still looked good (Panamera-ish) but I preferred the more analog look.

Yes, we need to wait for the Fall I guess to see more slices. Perhaps The G8x ///M cars will get a Rhinoplasty and it's sinuses drained by then to help heal this infection. Wishful thinking...

Yes, definitely easy on the eyes from all angles

[omaralt]

Originally Posted by jstein55

Congrats, I'm looking at CPO 991.2's now that my M2 has departed from the garage (totaled).

Which trim level did you get? And if you don't mind me asking, what price range/deal did you get? I'm mainly looking at Base Carrera's, Carrera T's and Carrera S' as GTS' seem to still be pricey.

Thanks. I got a base 991.2. The newer turbo engines are great stock but you can tune them for huge gains very inexpensively so I didn't see the need for an S

I got a 2018 with 8.5k miles. Have 1.5 years left in original warranty and another 2 years unlimited miles on a CPO. Nicely optioned; most importantly with the sport Chrono for the rev match. MSRP was $105k and I got it for $79k. These cars hold their value pretty well. I'll probably keep it for 2 years or so and then either go back to an M car or get the 992. Time will tell

[stein_325i]

Originally Posted by omaralt

Thanks. I got a base 991.2. The newer turbo engines are great stock but you can tune them for huge gains very inexpensively so I didn't see the need for an S

I got a 2018 with 8.5k miles. Have 1.5 years left in original warranty and another 2 years unlimited miles on a CPO. Nicely optioned; most importantly with the sport Chrono for the rev match. MSRP was $105k and I got it for $79k. These cars hold their value pretty well. I'll probably keep it for 2 years or so and then either go back to an M car or get the 992. Time will tell

Thanks for the info, I'm definitely strongly considering a 991.2 at the end of my CLS lease, only issue is that it will likely replace both the CLS and the totaled M2 for the price and I don't think the Mrs. will approve of that. Might look into some nicely maintained 981 Boxster's as I do love an NA engine and then have a nice and practical daily to pair with it. Luckily won't have to make any decisions til the end of the year.

[Sedan_Clan]

I think it's interesting that we're giving BMW crap for the 4 Series/M3/M4 grille when Mercedes produces a grille like this. That's pretty darn obnoxious.

[J-RO]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

I think it's interesting that we're giving BMW crap for the 4 Series/M3/M4 grille when Mercedes produces a grille like this. That's pretty darn obnoxious.

Maybe it’s because this is a BMW forum and not a Mercedes forum.

[Colinv6]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

I think it's interesting that we're giving BMW crap for the 4 Series/M3/M4 grille when Mercedes produces a grille like this. That's pretty darn obnoxious.

Even though it’s considerably larger than the BMW grille, it’s much more suited to the car and is executed with more taste.

[stein_325i]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

I think it's interesting that we're giving BMW crap for the 4 Series/M3/M4 grille when Mercedes produces a grille like this. That's pretty darn obnoxious.

That is just a render but even still the execution is better than BMW and fits the vehicle, and this will be on the black series only, a very niche vehicle and limited production which will need plenty of cooling, other more "mainstream" vehicles which use the Panamericana grill are much smaller and still overall look good.

Other manufacturers did receive shit for their big grills (Audi and Lexus - the latter still does) and BMW is getting theirs accordingly because their fanbase is so passionate and designs of theirs have always been very tasteful and conservative, so a big change like this of course will upset the fanbase.

The problem is the execution of the grills on the 4er just isn't good, there were many other ways to be "bold" such as the CSL concept, and still please the enthusiast, and arrogant comments from the head of design at BMW don't make it better. I know you are a fan of the grills, but its going to be a hot button topic around here for many years to come, so get ready, the worst has yet to come.

Also check the MB forums, plenty of owners there give Merc crap as well, just look at how unhappy MB owners are over the new E-Class taillights, or S-Class owners on the new W223 and its all touch screen interior, even the Audi forums were very upset over the touch screen MMI change, its just like any other thread here on Bimmerpost, we are not alone in our bitching.

[speedmaster20d]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

I think it's interesting that we're giving BMW crap for the 4 Series/M3/M4 grille when Mercedes produces a grille like this. That's pretty darn obnoxious.

that's why we (at least I) don't buy a hideous car like that Merc. I am sure it drives well ...but that look...still I agree... if I had to pick between the Merc and the new M3 I'd pick the Merc.

I am not at all for nostalgia and all that, things change and evolve with time, but if you look at a brand like Ferrari, Lamborghini etc. every generation of their cars is somewhat different, yet timeless... and so was the M3 in its own place, until now.

[m34m]

I've been waiting for this car as my next daily for three years. On the weekend I drive an M340i to get a sense of the platform. Well let's just say the design of the new M3 isn't its primary problem. It's size is. I absolutely despised the 340i it was huge. Not marginally bigger but significantly. Adding to its size was its softness and artificiality. Yes it was fast and pretty capable, the engineering is very good but to call this a 3 series is a laughable joke. I still own my E90 3 series and this new car is an insult to the 3 series legacy. So the M3 is out. It has to be it's just too big. What next? Great question, maybe a Porsche but which one? A Macan? I have no idea what car will have the performance, AWD, and daily usability that I was counting on the M3 for.

[solstice]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

I think it's interesting that we're giving BMW crap for the 4 Series/M3/M4 grille when Mercedes produces a grille like this. That's pretty darn obnoxious.

Wtf. Is that? Must be a Benz forum version of the “this is the next 3 series” joke consisting of just a grille.

[stein_325i]

Originally Posted by solstice

Wtf. Is that? Must be a Benz forum version of the "this is the next 3 series" joke consisting of just a grille.

Its a render of the upcoming GT Black Series, not a real vehicle, currently unsure of what the grill will look like since some spy shots show off a smaller grill while other shows off a bigger but unfinished grill.