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      10-20-2021, 07:14 AM   #375
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slo_F80_Mike View Post
Can it really not handle the power, or is it an excuse of some type? The manual is probably the same from F8x M cars and those weren't that far off for the ZCP models. I have a 6 speed F80 pushing more power than the stock G8x ZCP with no issues. So it makes you wonder what the real reason is
Of course itís an excuse and a marketing move to force people into betraying 6MT.
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      10-20-2021, 12:35 PM   #376
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its cool but toooooo damn large for a coupe. Curious what's up with the up and coming M2, thats a proper sized coupe. Just my 2 cents.
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      10-20-2021, 01:05 PM   #377
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Originally Posted by MadBimmeRad View Post
The CSL will not be a GTS - sure, it'll be track focused, but not built solely for track use (if the E46CSL is anything to go by)
Didn't they publish something recently just CSL=GTS? The F82 M4GTS wasn't solely for track use either, the slider just went that way a little more. The M4 GT4, M2 CS racing, etc., would be the real track-only cars.

I was hoping the CSL would have a roll cage, but that doesn't seem to be the case here... unless we're looking at a CS and the CSL is just assumed based on the release timing vs testing, or they're still leaving some bits off.

EDIT, I was thinking of the Van Meel interview with R&T stating the CSL was replacing the GTS:
https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-sho...34460/bmw-csl/
and recalling this training image from an article here more recently:
https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1553566
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      10-20-2021, 03:20 PM   #378
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robopp View Post
Because BMW said the manual can't handle the competition horsepower. No way they're going to decrease the hp on the CS or CSL, unfortunately.
which is an outright lie. my F80 had 600whp/600wtq and had no issues on my 6mt.
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      10-20-2021, 03:41 PM   #379
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Quote:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robopp View Post
Because BMW said the manual can't handle the competition horsepower. No way they're going to decrease the hp on the CS or CSL, unfortunately.
which is an outright lie. my F80 had 600whp/600wtq and had no issues on my 6mt.
For how many miles ? They don't engineer these things only for the casual 2-3year leaser.
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      10-20-2021, 03:51 PM   #380
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beachBmmr View Post
How could BMW justify a 30-50k premium on a car unless is there Material difference from the Base, or Competition.

Reading over the F80 GTS materials, seems it only had more power, a cage, and different seats, and some aero differences (and a wing) and lighter wheels. This amounts to 15-20k of bolt ons...

Braking, Suspension, and the powerplant were the same in the GTS as the M4.

Looking at all these photos, I dont see a cage, the Seats look like M-buckets, and the aero looks like 7k worth of the Mperf CF that you can buy from the parts depts.
You're forgetting the cost for design, development, test and validation, certification, tooling etc. which needs to be recovered over relatively few units. It's not as simple as adding up the perceived incremental costs of the unique hardware and saying it should be priced at $X.

Besides, they'll probably sell every one they make at whatever price they end up asking.
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      10-20-2021, 05:53 PM   #381
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicane_ View Post
You're forgetting the cost for design, development, test and validation, certification, tooling etc. which needs to be recovered over relatively few units. It's not as simple as adding up the perceived incremental costs of the unique hardware and saying it should be priced at $X.

Besides, they'll probably sell every one they make at whatever price they end up asking.
What does everyone think the price will be for the M4 CSL? $150K? Slightly below the base of the new GT3? At what point does it become too expensive for a BMW based on what happened with the low M8 sales?
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      10-20-2021, 06:23 PM   #382
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hegge View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicane_ View Post
You're forgetting the cost for design, development, test and validation, certification, tooling etc. which needs to be recovered over relatively few units. It's not as simple as adding up the perceived incremental costs of the unique hardware and saying it should be priced at $X.

Besides, they'll probably sell every one they make at whatever price they end up asking.
What does everyone think the price will be for the M4 CSL? $150K? Slightly below the base of the new GT3? At what point does it become too expensive for a BMW based on what happened with the low M8 sales?
My guess would be high $140's.
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      10-20-2021, 09:04 PM   #383
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicane_ View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hegge View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicane_ View Post
You're forgetting the cost for design, development, test and validation, certification, tooling etc. which needs to be recovered over relatively few units. It's not as simple as adding up the perceived incremental costs of the unique hardware and saying it should be priced at $X.

Besides, they'll probably sell every one they make at whatever price they end up asking.
What does everyone think the price will be for the M4 CSL? $150K? Slightly below the base of the new GT3? At what point does it become too expensive for a BMW based on what happened with the low M8 sales?
My guess would be high $140's.
I'm in Australia; try $300k
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      10-20-2021, 10:51 PM   #384
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hegge View Post
What does everyone think the price will be for the M4 CSL? $150K? Slightly below the base of the new GT3? At what point does it become too expensive for a BMW based on what happened with the low M8 sales?
They certainly messed up with pricing for the F8x CS and GTS cars, there was really just nothing comparable price-wise within the BMW lineup (i8 aside), so you were left just seeing it as a huge jump from a base F8x ZCP that was likely not worth it. Similar story with the initial pricing for the M8. I sure hope they aim high again and price it out of the ballpark, then we could lease one in 2 years for a steal when my M8 is due in.

Low to mid 140s are probably where it should be to make sense given the potential buyers, roughly the same as an M5CS or M8 Competition. BMW pricing seems to work best when you could go up a model and down a trim to arrive at the same cost like this, letting us choose between practicality and impulse.
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      10-21-2021, 01:19 PM   #385
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PLF69 View Post
For how many miles ? They don't engineer these things only for the casual 2-3year leaser.
For as many miles as the F10 M5 which had a manual transmission option.
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      10-21-2021, 02:11 PM   #386
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Quote:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PLF69 View Post
For how many miles ? They don't engineer these things only for the casual 2-3year leaser.
For as many miles as the F10 M5 which had a manual transmission option.
Apparently modification had been made to the clutch or transmission for this application.

I don't want to argue that the M/T can't cope with more power, hell I had a 6 speed in my 550whp 135i for many miles, it's just that hoping for a Manual in a CSL is akin to wishful thinking.

Unfortunately BMW is not the kind of company to listen to its customer base like Porsche. Porsche turned back on the PDK only GT3 (991.1) because of customer complaints and they even changed the 718 GTS product planning to satisfy there customers. You just never see this with BMW, it's there way that's it. G80 front facia is the perfect example. They've always been like that it's in there corporate culture.
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      10-21-2021, 02:17 PM   #387
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PLF69 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by adc View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by PLF69 View Post
For how many miles ? They don't engineer these things only for the casual 2-3year leaser.
For as many miles as the F10 M5 which had a manual transmission option.
Apparently modification had been made to the clutch or transmission for this application.

I don't want to argue that the M/T can't cope with more power, hell I had a 6 speed in my 550whp 135i for many miles, it's just that hoping for a Manual in a CSL is akin to wishful thinking.

Unfortunately BMW is not the kind of company to listen to its customer base like Porsche. Porsche turned back on the PDK only GT3 (991.1) because of customer complaints and they even changed the 718 GTS product planning to satisfy there customers. You just never see this with BMW, it's there way that's it. G80 front facia is the perfect example. They've always been like that it's in there corporate culture.
I don't think that's true. I think both companies listen to their customers.

We just don't happen to be them.
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      10-21-2021, 09:45 PM   #388
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Wonder if the new CSL will have any air intake goodness like the E46 CSL did? That simple(!) change of the airbox made such a phenomenal upgrade to the sound, it was brilliant!
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      10-26-2021, 07:24 AM   #389
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      10-31-2021, 03:54 PM   #390
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      11-01-2021, 04:48 PM   #391
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We just started a waitlist for the CSL at work, I think it's a bit too early but people have been calling in to leave deposits.
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      11-01-2021, 04:52 PM   #392
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Can people stop crying about the Manual transmission, it's not happening. The last CSL didn't have one and was one of the greatest cars BMW ever made.

Most of these people crying out for the manual have probably never even driven a CSL so please just stop
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      11-01-2021, 06:58 PM   #393
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We just started a waitlist for the CSL at work, I think it's a bit too early but people have been calling in to leave deposits.
About how many allocations are each dealer expected to receive?
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      11-01-2021, 11:30 PM   #394
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Quote:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMWALLO View Post
We just started a waitlist for the CSL at work, I think it's a bit too early but people have been calling in to leave deposits.
About how many allocations are each dealer expected to receive?
We have no idea its way too soon, it depends on production amount. We imagine our store that received three M5CS, will get anywhere from 3-5 M4 CSL.
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      11-02-2021, 01:39 AM   #395
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My Client Advisor told me approximately 5 allocations.
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      11-02-2021, 05:05 AM   #396
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Quote:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RPM33 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BMWALLO View Post
We just started a waitlist for the CSL at work, I think it's a bit too early but people have been calling in to leave deposits.
About how many allocations are each dealer expected to receive?
We have no idea its way too soon, it depends on production amount. We imagine our store that received three M5CS, will get anywhere from 3-5 M4 CSL.
How many M5CSs were made in total, and how many of them were allocated to NA? Total must have been very small number as I know Canada got 19 and Australia got 20 only.

That knowledge would be a great benchmark for guesstimating M4CSL numbers (total of which is rumoured to number 1000)
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