[///LeFrenchie]

My future concern will be don't be the first to experiment this recall at my dealership

[HorsePower]

Originally Posted by modat

If they are replacing engines, then why rush it?

Just let ppl drive the cars as is and queue them up for repair. Doesn't make sense to stop the whole production line.

I think it's because of the significant number of cars that haven't been delivered yet, that have the issue. If all of the affected cars were on the road, then I would assume that they would all be treated the same way (keep driving them until we schedule your week for the fix). But apparently BMW doesn't want to deal with thousands of buyers screaming and jumping up and down (as I would be) if their ordered car was on delivery-stop, while the new engines kept ending up on the production line.

[KnightedBMW]

Originally Posted by darrelljs

I am close to my break in mileage, and have a vague fear that they will not give my car back to me. Sounds like you blazed that trail already and I have nothing to worry about?

Darrell

I've had that concern as well, but others seem to be getting their cars back.

[modat]

Originally Posted by KnightedBMW

I've had that concern as well, but others seem to be getting their cars back.

It's your car. They can't hold it hostage

[NSG332]

If your car is affected and not been delivered yet due to the stop sale (my car has been sitting at the dealership for two weeks and will probably be there for many more) - do you think it would be difficult to get back your deposit if I were to cancel the purchase now?

[HorsePower]

Originally Posted by NSG332

If your car is affected and not been delivered yet due to the stop sale (my car has been sitting at the dealership for two weeks and will probably be there for many more) - do you think it would be difficult to get back your deposit if I were to cancel the purchase now?

In my opinion (and this is just a hunch, I don't have any data points to support it), it shouldn't be too difficult to get back a deposit on a normal, reasonable build. By that, I mean something that's not individual pink with YMB/yellow carbon buckets (where the buyer was probably told pretty clearly up front that his or her deposit would be non-refundable). If you back out, once fixed, the dealer will probably be able to sell the car in about 2 seconds, at full price or more.

[SintAFM]

Originally Posted by NSG332

If your car is affected and not been delivered yet due to the stop sale (my car has been sitting at the dealership for two weeks and will probably be there for many more) - do you think it would be difficult to get back your deposit if I were to cancel the purchase now?

You can back out and get your money back in most states up to the point you sign the purchase agreement

[Tdubb88]

Originally Posted by HorsePower

So your understanding is that they're still moving main-bearing-recall cars from the VPCs to the dealers? Not questioning you at all. That is just a disappointing update from my view point. I feel like the likelihood of damage sitting at a dealer for months may be much higher than sitting at the VPC. I also read earlier this morning (this thread or another) that certain pre-delivery affected cars would be fixed at VPCs or the factory. Which, to me, seems like a more reliable, uniform, quality-controlled fix than different techs at different dealers each doing 1 or 2, in a very busy shop full of everything from oil changes to tire rotations to major work.

When I do large mechanical jobs, including major restoration and fabrication work, being interrupted is a real problem. Let's assume that dealerships are having their most senior techs do this work. Aren't those the same techs that the others in the shop usually go to for questions etc. as issues arise? I don't think the top techs at dealerships will have the luxury of just tuning everybody else out for 40 hours and being uninterrupted for an entire business week to fix each one of these cars.

If the fix for this is truly de-constructing and re-constructing the drivetrains of these cars (as I read earlier this morning), I really feel for everyone affected. On a modern, state-of-the-art car, that's quite a task (and very different from the relatively easy in-and-out engine swaps I've helped with for 4-cylinder vintage British race cars, for example).

No, I think I just have an incompetent dealership that didn't look at anything before saying it was going to be delivered in a week or two based on it arriving at the port today. Totally agree that I'd rather it be fixed at the VPC rather than the dealership, but I don't actually know which will happen.

[NSG332]

Originally Posted by SintAFM

You can back out and get your money back in most states up to the point you sign the purchase agreement

Appreciate the responses guys. I actually did sign a purchase order once I got the allocation (but it didn't include a VIN #).

My thought process is - this was all assuming the car would be in a "sell-able" condition and now it seems like it isn't...so there shouldn't be any legal issue for not giving me back the deposit.

[HorsePower]

Originally Posted by NSG332

Appreciate the responses guys. I actually did sign a purchase order once I got the allocation (but it didn't include a VIN #).

My thought process is - this was all assuming the car would be in a "sell-able" condition and now it seems like it isn't...so there shouldn't be any legal issue for not giving me back the deposit.

I'm 99% certain that it's a safe assumption that your signed purchase order did not include required timing of delivery. So even if there's a 6 month delay, hypothetically, to get the main bearing delivery stop remedied, eventually BMW/dealer would likely take the position that the car that was ordered is ready for delivery. In addition, I expect they'll take the position that the pre-delivery engine swap is no different from repairing port damage, or adding the RAM or cameras pre-delivery. And they would force a buyer to try and litigate alleged impaired value (if you wanted to go down that route). I'm not saying who has the better arguments, but just that BMW likely has armies of lawyers and isn't likely to stress too much over this.

All of that to say, I still think that as a practical, business matter, setting any legal rights and wrongs aside, I just don't see dealers pocketing deposits for M3 or M4 orders that weren't incredibly customized (for example, I was told that if I ordered a bright, individual yellow, with the blue carbon buckets, that they wanted a significant deposit and it would be non-refundable. I chose not to go in that direction, and instead ordered something that they could easily sell to someone else in an instant - better re-sale value for me down the road that way anyway.)

If you really want out, I'd suggest having a calm, frank discussion with your dealer.

[jimbethesda]

Originally Posted by NSG332

If your car is affected and not been delivered yet due to the stop sale (my car has been sitting at the dealership for two weeks and will probably be there for many more) - do you think it would be difficult to get back your deposit if I were to cancel the purchase now?

Did you put the deposit on a credit card (you always should)? If so, you can always do a charge back if they refuse. As others have said though, you should be able to have them refund it if you want.

[a1gio2]

So...Do you think it's a good time to order one of these cars or wait and see what the resolution is first?

[modat]

If anyone has a m3 they would like to get out of I will gladly take your spot

[Merda10]

Originally Posted by g80 Portimaoblue

So are they offering 5K discount on even M cars? What if you return it, get your refund and build a new M car utilizing the 5K discount? Also, is this a corporate discount?

Thanks!

It was on two of their cars already there that I looked at.

M3 manual
M5

I think it was just to keep me happy. This was #4 M purchase in 30 months.

[HorsePower]

Originally Posted by a1gio2

So...Do you think it's a good time to order one of these cars or wait and see what the resolution is first?

I don't think you'll have the opportunity to order one right now. My sense is that there aren't unspoken-for actual allocations currently, so I think "ordering" right now would probably mean being put on a very long, indefinite wait.

[Likeanowl]

Not to stir the pot but I called genius just a bit ago regarding my car and decided to ask some questions just to see what I could find and got the following info:

-She said according to her “bulletin” as well as a recent meeting they had the main bearing shell affects LESS than 600 vehicles total. She said it is only the m3/4 x3/4m. I said “I heard it was in the thousands” to which she replied “no I’m reading it directly. Total affected vehicles: less than 600.”

-She said she heard nothing of the sort regarding bmw halting/pausing production of unbuilt cars with the s58 engine. She said at most the estimated delay because of this is a week or two at most specifically pertaining to shifting of parts to fix those 600 cars.

-other delays affecting production on top of that are still the Harmon kardon sound system and the laser lights. She said those are still listed as “restricted” options on our cars. She said that does not mean it will be built without them it will just cause more delay. She said if Bmw absolutely cannot source the parts they will remove it from your build and notify you. She said because the HK is standard she doubts that will happen but she said if laser lights for some reason can’t be sourced then because it’s an added option they can remove it if needed. Unless you are specifically notified of something being removed just assume you’ll still get it, just delayed.

-She said she does not have details on the specific “fix” for the main bearing shell but said it was brought up in their meeting but no details we’re given yet.

-She said regarding build week, unfortunately it’s all up in the air. She said she’s seen cars go week 41-44-48-47 and back to 41 again. Others just repeatedly delayed so just cross your fingers because there’s no real way to know until it actually hits production.

I hope some of this helps.

Edit: also I asked about the carbon bucket seats and she said she’s heard nothing about those being short or causing delay. Which I find strange because anyone that’s post week 42-43ish and have carbon buckets seem to all be delayed. But who knows.

[Tdubb88]

Can anyone get their hands on that bulletin?! Must see!… lol

[savi01]

Likeanowl, thank you for sharing!

[KnightedBMW]

Originally Posted by Likeanowl

Not to stir the pot but I called genius just a bit ago regarding my car and decided to ask some questions just to see what I could find and got the following info:

-She said according to her “bulletin” as well as a recent meeting they had the main bearing shell affects LESS than 600 vehicles total. She said it is only the m3/4 x3/4m. I said “I heard it was in the thousands” to which she replied “no I’m reading it directly. Total affected vehicles: less than 600.”

-She said she heard nothing of the sort regarding bmw halting/pausing production of unbuilt cars with the s58 engine. She said at most the estimated delay because of this is a week or two at most specifically pertaining to shifting of parts to fix those 600 cars.

-other delays affecting production on top of that are still the Harmon kardon sound system and the laser lights. She said those are still listed as “restricted” options on our cars. She said that does not mean it will be built without them it will just cause more delay. She said if Bmw absolutely cannot source the parts they will remove it from your build and notify you. She said because the HK is standard she doubts that will happen but she said if laser lights for some reason can’t be sourced then because it’s an added option they can remove it if needed. Unless you are specifically notified of something being removed just assume you’ll still get it, just delayed.

-She said she does not have details on the specific “fix” for the main bearing shell but said it was brought up in their meeting but no details we’re given yet.

-She said regarding build week, unfortunately it’s all up in the air. She said she’s seen cars go week 41-44-48-47 and back to 41 again. Others just repeatedly delayed so just cross your fingers because there’s no real way to know until it actually hits production.

I hope some of this helps.

Edit: also I asked about the carbon bucket seats and she said she’s heard nothing about those being short or causing delay. Which I find strange because anyone that’s post week 42-43ish and have carbon buckets seem to all be delayed. But who knows.

How is it possible that of all the members here who have called into genius daily over the past few months and gotten next to no info, this genius happens to have more info than any other genius ever? Interesting.

[Likeanowl]

Originally Posted by KnightedBMW

How is it possible that of all the members here who have called into genius daily over the past few months and gotten next to no info, this genius happens to have more info than any other genius ever? Interesting.

No idea. She seemed super spot on with what she was telling me. I just wish she had better news pertaining to my car

[Murse85]

Originally Posted by eMMit

Further to this, I also just spoke to my dealer principal.

My car is currently at the port storage facilty in Port Kembla (arrived last week). Production date was 30 July.

It will likely to be shipped to BMW's Mulgrave facility where they will do the rebuild/replacement (this facility is much more capable than dealerships). BMW will then release the vehicle to the dealer. Likely 2 months, but agree with above, may blow out to early 22.

I was also offered full refund, etc. But...

Also note - whilst the 4,000-odd affected cars worldwide (Australia has 114 affected vehicles) are being fixed - the parts (or engines) will not be going to new cars to be produced - rather to fixing these vehicles. So cars to be produced in the short to medium term will all be pushed back. So re-ordering will likely mean another 9+ months minimum time to delivery.

Sigh.

So is it going to be a bearing replacement or engine replacement?

[Brendan///M]

Originally Posted by KnightedBMW

How is it possible that of all the members here who have called into genius daily over the past few months and gotten next to no info, this genius happens to have more info than any other genius ever? Interesting.

Because the stop sale memo went out on October 8th, so calling daily for "months" before that date about an issue they weren't aware of yet wouldn't likely have yielded any useful information. Those of us calling in the days after the 8th probably haven't given enough time for a plan/fix/details to be developed and disseminated to staff and dealerships. It sounds like they are making some headway in that regard, as recently as this week, which is what I'd expect.