[edofloat]

Originally Posted by YamaLink

As an M4CX owner this is a timely and great thread! I have a few questions for all you objective BMW/Porsche owners with realworld experience: which 992 should I consider?

Here's what I like about my M4CX as a pure daily...

1: Skyscraper gray/825 wheels/tartufo/tint is WOW!! Yes, I sometimes want the M3 hips, but otherwise the G82X looks is everything I could ask for. Stylish, classy, draws attention yet it's still under the radar compared to a yellow C8 or orange RS3. Two doors is perfect for 95% solo driving, no kids to haul.

2: The interior is near perfect. Makes me realize I prioritize a nicer more luxury interior. Always me or 1 passenger, but I do like a small back seat.

3: My OCD hands like the M1/M2 options. I am just okay with the lag below 3000rpm, the power elsewhere still makes me laugh out loud. I prefer a powerful fun car even if it's just for a few moments on an empty road. My dream car sound is the Z06 or GT3 or the Blackwing 5. I could get a Z06 but the styling is a bit too "hey, look at me" and it's overkill for a snowbelt daily. The BW5 is too big and the GT3 is truly unobtainable.

Here's why I'm looking to make the change when the warranty runs out in 2 years...and 2 years is also the estimated time I'd have to wait for a 992 build. I really want to keep the G82X for 4 years.

1: The G82X is just a little too long. Coming from a 2020 M240i, I'd like something in between. The 718 GTS 4.0 PDK was considered, but the interior is too basic and for me the exterior styling doesn't make me stop and turn like the 992 or G82X. That 992 rear end always gets my attention.

2: It's unrealistic to get the instant-on of my recently sold EV, but after driving my friend's Blackwing 5 it makes me realize I want more torque and instant hit for my non-track use. Again, my G82 is a bit laggy no matter what mode/gear because of compression/turbo size/tuning, I knew this going in. **Am I going to be disappointed with the S or GTS, and have to get a tune? I've never used launch control, and I don't race on public roads, but I do value big "quality" power.

The G82X is my best all-around street use daily for year-round use in a snowy climate.

As for the switch...I never keep German cars past warranty, BUT....I'd plan to keep the 992.1 or .2 for many years longer (I own an old Lexus SUV for bad snow, carrying bikes/skis/the rare road trip). A CPO with extended warranty is the unicorn.
I think the 992 has a timeless look that won't age. And I have read all about maintenance costs.

Speaking of snow, I am leaning toward NOT getting AWD P because great snow tires and my lifetime of snow driving should be enough, right? (again: old suv goes out on really snow/icy days when I don't stay home). Last 4 cars were AWD. Not opposed to another, but RWD 992 is fine.

So (sorry for the rambling) based on the above which coupe 992 PDK would you recommend I get if (big IF) I can find a CPO or MSRP 992.1 or .2?

1: ZERO track use (rules out the GT3)
2: Priority on an interior leaning more luxury (rules out the T). Don't need full leather top to bottom or headrest crests and matching stitching, but I don't want a black interior.
3: Power that isn't 9000 rpm high nor laggy nor underwhelming (guess I could get a 91 octane tune?)
4: Comfort via adjustable suspension is priority.

Thanks for your input. And if you think a 992 is still the "not ideal" smart decision I'd like to hear it.

I prefer the 992 and all of this will depend on how you plan to use the car.

Get C2 GTS and select PASM as PASM Sport is standard or C2S and don't option PASM Sport so you get a bit more comfort. People will tell you not to select the suspension that raises the car up in ride height citing stance and its not cool looking etc.

By the time you can get a car they may not have a GTS on offer as they don't always produce those.

As you pointed out the T doesn't have as many interior choices. A high-spec S will run into GTS price territory but either will have more than enough power and you can option a ton of leather options on the interior if you want to spend the money. A high-spec GTS will be in Turbo price territory. So regardless of what you choose once you add a bunch of options it might be smarter to just step up a model. I know you said you don't want AWD but if you are in Turbo or Turbo S pricing you will have AWD.

Based on the short points you made a C2S with leather interior option and extended leather is likely what you want. Also, option the leather or race tex visors (4500) since the standard ones are all plasticy and retrofitting after you get the car is $3k for the visors. I should have selected the leather or race tex visors. Skip the leather on the passenger cup holder.

C2S can easily be tuned to GTS or Turbo power if you want more power.

[YamaLink]

Originally Posted by edofloat

I prefer the 992 and all of this will depend on how you plan to use the car.

Get C2 GTS and select PASM as PASM Sport is standard or C2S and don't option PASM Sport so you get a bit more comfort. People will tell you not to select the suspension that raises the car up in ride height citing stance and its not cool looking etc.

By the time you can get a car they may not have a GTS on offer as they don't always produce those.

As you pointed out the T doesn't have as many interior choices. A high-spec S will run into GTS price territory but either will have more than enough power and you can option a ton of leather options on the interior if you want to spend the money. A high-spec GTS will be in Turbo price territory. So regardless of what you choose once you add a bunch of options it might be smarter to just step up a model. I know you said you don't want AWD but if you are in Turbo or Turbo S pricing you will have AWD.

Based on the short points you made a C2S with leather interior option and extended leather is likely what you want. Also, option the leather or race tex visors (4500) since the standard ones are all plasticy and retrofitting after you get the car is $3k for the visors. I should have selected the leather or race tex visors. Skip the leather on the passenger cup holder.

C2S can easily be tuned to GTS or Turbo power if you want more power.

My local dealer told me today "no ADM" and no preferential treatment. Everything is time stamped from the refundable deposit.

Looking at the 992.2 price increase AND the ugly front end vertical slots (maybe it's Porsche's pre-launch teaser?), I would want a 992.1 if I can't avoid the new front end on a C2S. I can't find info if only the higher performance variants get the ugly cooling fins.

After reading this thread and watching way too many videos on "which 992 is best for 100% street/how do I not spend GTS money on an S" etc, I've had some honest convos about where I drive, how often, will driving those same half dozen routes be any different in an S vs GTS....and since I work from home and prioritize excitement and a sense of occasion, maybe I really want the "bad daily" GT3, but they average 250K! Not happening. I may as well buy a Z06 2LZ and a new Japanese-made awd/4x4 as my daily for a lot less.

Oh, so many decisions, and I've got 2 years of happily driving my perfectly fine M4CX before taking delivery of anything from P, but the deposit needs to happen sooner rather than later.

[BryanCO]

Originally Posted by YamaLink

My local dealer told me today "no ADM" and no preferential treatment. Everything is time stamped from the refundable deposit.

Looking at the 992.2 price increase AND the ugly front end vertical slots (maybe it's Porsche's pre-launch teaser?), I would want a 992.1 if I can't avoid the new front end on a C2S. I can't find info if only the higher performance variants get the ugly cooling fins.

After reading this thread and watching way too many videos on "which 992 is best for 100% street/how do I not spend GTS money on an S" etc, I've had some honest convos about where I drive, how often, will driving those same half dozen routes be any different in an S vs GTS....and since I work from home and prioritize excitement and a sense of occasion, maybe I really want the "bad daily" GT3, but they average 250K! Not happening. I may as well buy a Z06 2LZ and a new Japanese-made awd/4x4 as my daily for a lot less.

Oh, so many decisions, and I've got 2 years of happily driving my perfectly fine M4CX before taking delivery of anything from P, but the deposit needs to happen sooner rather than later.

Buy a used GT3.

[YamaLink]

Originally Posted by BryanCO

Buy a used GT3.

Prices are in the stratosphere. Same with the unobtainable gt4rs. So much so the z06 looks like a bargain. The market is falling rapidly on that car and my three year wait can be found on dealer lots without adm.
Makes you realize what a “bargain” the BMW is.

[Needsdecaf]

Originally Posted by YamaLink

My local dealer told me today "no ADM" and no preferential treatment. Everything is time stamped from the refundable deposit.

Looking at the 992.2 price increase AND the ugly front end vertical slots (maybe it's Porsche's pre-launch teaser?), I would want a 992.1 if I can't avoid the new front end on a C2S. I can't find info if only the higher performance variants get the ugly cooling fins.

After reading this thread and watching way too many videos on "which 992 is best for 100% street/how do I not spend GTS money on an S" etc, I've had some honest convos about where I drive, how often, will driving those same half dozen routes be any different in an S vs GTS....and since I work from home and prioritize excitement and a sense of occasion, maybe I really want the "bad daily" GT3, but they average 250K! Not happening. I may as well buy a Z06 2LZ and a new Japanese-made awd/4x4 as my daily for a lot less.

Oh, so many decisions, and I've got 2 years of happily driving my perfectly fine M4CX before taking delivery of anything from P, but the deposit needs to happen sooner rather than later.

Carrera T

[ChrisM4]

I spec’d out a 911 Carrera T over COVID and it came out to 115K Cdn. That exact car now is ~146K Cdn before ADM.

I ended up not ordering it as it was a year wait, the car didn’t feel that quick, and the rear seat room is terrible.

It’s definitely a special car but I much prefer my M4 Comp X-Drive at this point in my life. Down the road when I retire I may consider a 911 again.

[Schn3ll]

I have owned 2 Carrera T's (991.2 and now a 992.1), they are by far 2 of the most reliable cars I've ever owned. The 3.0L twin turbo is extremely reliable and I never had a single issue. The rest of the car is fantastic as well. These cars do not depreciate either.

I got my 992 last August and specced with manual, and it would be my forever car if I wasn't such a nutjob masochist who desires a GT3 or GT3RS someday.

I drive my 992 almost everyday, if you spec it right it's just as comfortable as any other car minus the egress in and out.

If you are even remotely thinking about 991.2 or 992, just do it - incredible cars and the 911 is an icon without the 2hr drive to the Ferrari, Lambo, McLaren dealer for service (I have a Porsche dealer 5 min away). Ownership is easy and the community is great.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by Schn3ll

I have owned 2 Carrera T's (991.2 and now a 992.1), they are by far 2 of the most reliable cars I've ever owned. The 3.0L twin turbo is extremely reliable and I never had a single issue. The rest of the car is fantastic as well. These cars do not depreciate either.

I got my 992 last August and specced with manual, and it would be my forever car if I wasn't such a nutjob masochist who desires a GT3 or GT3RS someday.

I drive my 992 almost everyday, if you spec it right it's just as comfortable as any other car minus the egress in and out.

If you are even remotely thinking about 991.2 or 992, just do it - incredible cars and the 911 is an icon without the 2hr drive to the Ferrari, Lambo, McLaren dealer for service (I have a Porsche dealer 5 min away). Ownership is easy and the community is great.

Porsches generally in the past were known for decent depreciation - the turbo/S being one of the worst cars in that regard. When they started artificially reducing production, the values were higher than usual, but the Porsche bubble is starting to pop on the 992 cars, sans the GTs. I also owned a 991.2T, as well as a 991.2S, and my wife used to have a 991.1 C4S Cabrio, and have had severa 718s including 2 GT4 (which again GTs dont lose money) and still have a 991.1S in PTS which was as a 2013 model more expensive than most S specs today and this car I've been offered original MSRP.
The values are starting to come down and you can get discounts on 992s now...

[02M3ForMe]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

The values are starting to come down and you can get discounts on 992s now...

Which trim levels, and how much of a discount can one expect?

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by 02M3ForMe

Which trim levels, and how much of a discount can one expect?

Def not anything that starts with a GT. Regular Carreras you should be able to find a few % off, especially if you've got a good relationship.

[DFW_M]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

Porsches generally in the past were known for decent depreciation - the turbo/S being one of the worst cars in that regard. When they started artificially reducing production, the values were higher than usual, but the Porsche bubble is starting to pop on the 992 cars, sans the GTs. I also owned a 991.2T, as well as a 991.2S, and my wife used to have a 991.1 C4S Cabrio, and have had severa 718s including 2 GT4 (which again GTs dont lose money) and still have a 991.1S in PTS which was as a 2013 model more expensive than most S specs today and this car I've been offered original MSRP.
The values are starting to come down and you can get discounts on 992s now...

What a genius business plan!
Let’s artificially reduce the production by 30% (the revenue) and inflate the value of new cars by 20% and protect the used market for silly customers not understanding that we artificially reduced the production capacity!

[BryanCO]

Originally Posted by DFW_M

What a genius business plan!
Let’s artificially reduce the production by 30% (the revenue) and inflate the value of new cars by 20% and protect the used market for silly customers not understanding that we artificially reduced the production capacity!

I assume that’s tongue in cheek but while Porsche certainly manages availability (especially for GT products), their overall worldwide demand has increased and their overall sales have also increased. And their least expensive model line (Macan) out sales all of their combined cars sales in the US.

Porsche GT car sales are also way up over previous generations. It remains to be seen where demand goes in the short and long term. But, I certainly wouldn’t buy a regular 911, Cayman, Boxster expecting no or minimal depreciation. It wasn’t that long ago that a friend of mine bought a new, $150k Turbo then traded it back in within two years for about $100k…

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by BryanCO

I assume that’s tongue in cheek but while Porsche certainly manages availability (especially for GT products), their overall worldwide demand has increased and their overall sales have also increased. And their least expensive model line (Macan) out sales all of their combined cars sales in the US.

Porsche GT car sales are also way up over previous generations. It remains to be seen where demand goes in the short and long term. But, I certainly wouldn’t buy a regular 911, Cayman, Boxster expecting no or minimal depreciation. It wasn’t that long ago that a friend of mine bought a new, $150k Turbo then traded it back in within two years for about $100k…

Actually Porsche sales are down ~25% in both the US and China (two biggest markets) and 4% globally.
I have owned a lot of Porsches along with my wife (and still own a paint to sample 991.1S that I'll never sell) - many 911s, many Caymans, several Macans and a Cayenne. I think they make some great cars but you can see the quality has def gone down and the prices are way up. I personally want something more special for the 200K mark than a Carrera S/4S/GTS - sorry but the S58 in the G8x is a much better engine than the 3.0 F6. I know several friends who also just wont buy a Porsche product anymore due to the games Porsche and more so the dealers are/were playing.

[BryanCO]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

Actually Porsche sales last year were down ~25% in both the US and China (two biggest markets) and 4% globally.
I have owned a lot of Porsches along with my wife (and still own a paint to sample 991.1S that I'll never sell) - many 911s, many Caymans, several Macans and a Cayenne. I think they make some great cars but you can see the quality has def gone down and the prices are way up. I personally want something more special for the 200K mark than a Carrera S/4S/GTS - sorry but the S58 in the G8x is a much better engine than the 3.0 F6. I know several friends who also just wont buy a Porsche product anymore due to the games Porsche and more so the dealers are/were playing.

Thanks for reminding us that you’ve owned Porsches…

Not sure why you think sales were down.

[DFW_M]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

Actually Porsche sales last year were down ~25% in both the US and China (two biggest markets) and 4% globally.
I have owned a lot of Porsches along with my wife (and still own a paint to sample 991.1S that I'll never sell) - many 911s, many Caymans, several Macans and a Cayenne. I think they make some great cars but you can see the quality has def gone down and the prices are way up. I personally want something more special for the 200K mark than a Carrera S/4S/GTS - sorry but the S58 in the G8x is a much better engine than the 3.0 F6. I know several friends who also just wont buy a Porsche product anymore due to the games Porsche and more so the dealers are/were playing.

First, you got busted on your US sales figures .
The guy replying to you busted himself with the Macan outselling the rest combined in the US…

Why do you think the S58 is so much better engine than the 2.9 TT used in Porsches?
To me, the acceleration feels better than low down s58, the sound is waaaayy better than the S58. My Macan GTS 0-60 and 1/4 mile pretty much match my 6MT G80 in a significantly heavier vehicle. What is better in the S58?

[BryanCO]

Originally Posted by BryanCO

I assume that’s tongue in cheek but while Porsche certainly manages availability (especially for GT products), their overall worldwide demand has increased and their overall sales have also increased. And their least expensive model line (Macan) out sales all of their combined cars sales in the US.

Porsche GT car sales are also way up over previous generations. It remains to be seen where demand goes in the short and long term. But, I certainly wouldn’t buy a regular 911, Cayman, Boxster expecting no or minimal depreciation. It wasn’t that long ago that a friend of mine bought a new, $150k Turbo then traded it back in within two years for about $100k…

Originally Posted by DFW_M

First, you got busted on your US sales figures .
The guy replying to you busted himself with the Macan outselling the rest combined in the US…

Why do you think the S58 is so much better engine than the 2.9 TT used in Porsches?
To me, the acceleration feels better than low down s58, the sound is waaaayy better than the S58. My Macan GTS 0-60 and 1/4 mile pretty much match my 6MT G80 in a significantly heavier vehicle. What is better in the S58?

Humm. Macan outsold the car line in the US. I am a bit surprised I remembered that from reading it a month or so ago….

[Habber]

I had a few G80 and just got G87 all
Manuals and also have a 2021 911s manual and no BMW compares or even comes close to Porsche.

This forum likes to compare the 2 brands but for me, there are zero similarities between both brands. Porsche just makes an incredible product.

[DFW_M]

Originally Posted by DFW_M

First, you got busted on your US sales figures .
The guy replying to you busted himself with the Macan outselling the rest combined in the US…

Why do you think the S58 is so much better engine than the 2.9 TT used in Porsches?
To me, the acceleration feels better than low down s58, the sound is waaaayy better than the S58. My Macan GTS 0-60 and 1/4 mile pretty much match my 6MT G80 in a significantly heavier vehicle. What is better in the S58?

Apologies to BryanCO -- good job on the data!

Also, to add, the EA839 should be compared to the B58 rather than S58 for the category of vehicles it is used in...

[DFW_M]

Originally Posted by Habber

I had a few G80 and just got G87 all
Manuals and also have a 2021 911s manual and no BMW compares or even comes close to Porsche.

This forum likes to compare the 2 brands but for me, there are zero similarities between both brands. Porsche just makes an incredible product.

I liked the Manual in the G80, but I liked the wildness factor of the S55 in my M2C over the mature feel of the S58 in my G80.

I am really enjoying the Macan GTS, and after comparing it to the X3 M40i, I quickly made my decision which way to go...

[Needsdecaf]

I would agree Porsche is starting to skimp on quality. My 958 Cayenne is much more solid than our 9Y0 Cayenne, and the 9Y0 refresh has some absolutely horrid cost cutting measures.

[02M3ForMe]

Originally Posted by Habber

I had a few G80 and just got G87 all
Manuals and also have a 2021 911s manual and no BMW compares or even comes close to Porsche.

This forum likes to compare the 2 brands but for me, there are zero similarities between both brands. Porsche just makes an incredible product.

Disagree. You need at least a Turbo before a 992 feels meaningfully better than the G8x. Not terribly impressed by any Carrera.

[Habber]

Originally Posted by 02M3ForMe

Disagree. You need at least a Turbo before a 992 feels meaningfully better than the G8x. Not terribly impressed by any Carrera.

Outside of storage, there’s nothing the M8x does better than the Carrera but to each their own.
The 2 Carrera S I’ve owned, absolutely destroyed any of my previous 6x M cars.