[TargaM2]

The Alfa is awesome. Just a shame about the price.

[adc]

Originally Posted by Sunnystone

Tbh, if a proper driver had been in both we'd have a better idea of the difference. Plus same tyres.

Matt did what? 48.1 round there in M3? Steve Sutcliffe had the G80 RWD complete it in 43.9 and Guila road car with same driver 44.4 on same track.

Very good point. Driver makes a huge difference.

Could be that it takes a very good driver to fully extract the performance out of the gtam. And testing cars like these on different tires is meaningless.



I’ll take my modified F8x over both anyway.

[NSX2M4]

They're both ugly mid life crisis cars but if I had to choose one, it'd be the GTAm due to looks alone.

[Forzanerazzurri]

What an odd comparison

[Ikester19]

The Alfa is awesome, looks better than the G80, looked more composed on track. But I'd still take the G80 any day of the week!

[Hawkdog]

Looks like he’s trying to win a drift competition going around that track, not run a fast lap. He needs to stick to drag racing. The more I see of carwow, the less impressed I am.

[FC05]

Nearly pointless comparison.
GTAm is track focused limited edition that's BMW CSL category, and that M3c isn't the fastest M3 available either, the AWD M3c is.
Also testing a small track like this one ain't tell anything in terms of performance for these midsize sedans.

[Limegrntaln]

I take these videos with a grain of salt. I dont know what settings the Giulia needs to be in to run a fast lap. And he said hes in MDM mode with the M3. Is he in sport, sport plus, comfort, is the transmission cheeseburger all the way on 3, where it keeps the car in the gear while youre in the corners? Are the shocks in sport, or sport plus? Are the brakes in sport? Too many variables for me. And the car would definitely be quicker with all of the settings turned up. Im saying quicker, in general, not quicker than he was able to achieve, himself.

[TheStanman]

Originally Posted by Hawkdog

Looks like he’s trying to win a drift competition going around that track, not run a fast lap. He needs to stick to drag racing. The more I see of carwow, the less impressed I am.

If you're watching CarWow for definitive comparisons of lap times by a pro driver under ideal conditions, you're watching the wrong channel.

It's a show for entertainment that gives a sense of cars from a normal car enthusiast in real world conditions. His lap times are pretty representative of an average forum member jumping in these cars and doing a few laps.

The reality is there are many YouTube channels that appeal to different audiences. You should watch based on what you're looking for.

Pro Lap Times Comparisons: SportAuto, Randy Pobst, C&D Lightning Laps
Deep Technical Info: SavageGeese
Entertainment from Car Enthusiasts: CarWow, Throttle House, Joe Achilles

In regards to the video, a great showing for the M3. As noted, Gulia is more special and almost universally considered a much more fun and emotional car to drive. But the M3 crushes it in build quality, tech, reliability, price, and performance #s (for a non-GTAm version)

[TheStanman]

Originally Posted by TruthOne

Has reliability improved with the Alfa?

Hard to say definitively as there's no good data, but its reliability has definitely improved over it's horrific launch that left an insane amount of journalists and early adopters stranded.

I doubt it's great but there are quite a few anecdotal stories like Gfit's good experience.

[TruthOne]

That's good to hear , my other concern would be lack of dealers and I've heard horror stories about how long it takes to repair certain issues because of the limited dealers and parts.

[EDWYER]

[QUOTE=AlexFL;28322204]

Originally Posted by Germanauto

This rabbit hole of numbers is very toxic. Some Tesla fanboy could easily trash on the M3 with the same price + objective performance argument. In reality car enthusiasts love certain cars because of they way they feel to drive.

In every M3 vs Giulia QV test the cars have essentially put up the same numbers, but the Giulia still wins the comparison test at the end of the day despite having a last-gen interior/tech and reliability quabbles. There's a reason why.

No surprise here and good review-M3 wins. I wouldn't consider the alpha. lol

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...bility-update/

[Sunnystone]

Originally Posted by NSX2M4

They're both ugly mid life crisis cars but if I had to choose one, it'd be the GTAm due to looks alone.

Midlife crisis cars??! Huh?

Theyre really not. A family car with a bit of poke is hardly a midlife crisis car. Nor is a track focus'd 2 seat Alfa costing over twice as much.

A brightly coloured 2 seater coupe perhaps but not these 2. IMO of course!

[Sunnystone]

Originally Posted by Hawkdog

Looks like he’s trying to win a drift competition going around that track, not run a fast lap. He needs to stick to drag racing. The more I see of carwow, the less impressed I am.

Must agree. Carwow is starting lose it appeal.

[Sunnystone]

Originally Posted by FC05

Nearly pointless comparison.
GTAm is track focused limited edition that's BMW CSL category, and that M3c isn't the fastest M3 available either, the AWD M3c is.
Also testing a small track like this one ain't tell anything in terms of performance for these midsize sedans.

Youre right regarding the small track. EVO mag on their own leaderboard of their chosen track have the GTAm 3secs quicker per lap.

https://www.evo.co.uk/leaderboard/16...ested-on-track

[KevinGS]

Originally Posted by Germanauto

The Alfa is RWD so naturally they picked a RWD M3.

But very impressive showing for the Bimmer given how it actually competes with the regular Giulia QV, not the QV GTAm. I'd imagine a G80 CS will come eventually. That will be the super sedan to end all super sedans.

Uh, the M5 CS and the Caddy CT5V Blackwing may be the sport sedans to end all sport sedans. The G80CS would have to be something really special to usurp it's bigger brother.

[troska]

Originally Posted by Sunnystone

Youre right regarding the small track. EVO mag on their own leaderboard of their chosen track have the GTAm 3secs quicker per lap.

https://www.evo.co.uk/leaderboard/16...ested-on-track

It is F82.
The link is up-to-date, but the test model is not. You can find the same problem on other links.

[jkap27]

Originally Posted by AlexFL

Relax, no one is hating Alfa. I merely posted a link. I just don't understand the irrational hate for BMW here on Bimmerpost . I would also ignore the American car magazines - they are generally extremely simplistic, yet highly subjective and opinionated. C&D is especially bad in that regards. Same applies to German car magazines where German cars can't lose a comparison (get a "Blackwing treatment"). Disclaimer: I'm German living in US.

I don’t think it’s an Alfa specific thing…seems like the bmw fan expects a certain level of quality in the interior and alfa just doesn’t prioritize that. I see a lot of American cars viewed negatively for a similar reason

[Germanauto]

[QUOTE=EDWYER;28327391]

Originally Posted by AlexFL

No surprise here and good review-M3 wins. I wouldn't consider the alpha. lol

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...bility-update/

There's no defending how poor the reliability was on these cars, notably prior to the 2020 refresh.

On a side note, I noticed you have an M2. That's a car I really love. I'm debating between the next-gen M2 or Giulia QV as my next car in a couple years. May consider the Boxster as well.

[mgokev]

Originally Posted by Sunnystone

Midlife crisis cars??! Huh?

Theyre really not. A family car with a bit of poke is hardly a midlife crisis car. Nor is a track focus'd 2 seat Alfa costing over twice as much.

A brightly coloured 2 seater coupe perhaps but not these 2. IMO of course!

Haha no kidding.

I guess being in my young 30s and wanting a fun car that can accommodate a car seat for a baby is mid life crisis. 🤷🏼

[jkap27]

Originally Posted by Germanauto

This rabbit hole of numbers is very toxic. Some Tesla fanboy could easily trash on the M3 with the same price + objective performance argument. In reality car enthusiasts love certain cars because of they way they feel to drive.

In every M3 vs Giulia QV test the cars have essentially put up the same numbers, but the Giulia still wins the comparison test at the end of the day despite having a last-gen interior/tech and reliability quabbles. There's a reason why.

Still not sure how the giulia skates by with its reliability issues though. Most people wouldnt even consider buying one. Im sure 80% of people never have serious issues in 3 years but that is still a huge gamble on a $75k+ car. Not to mention i think the M3 xdrive takes the quarter mile vs the model 3 performance easily which is pretty wild to think about. I think tesla fanboy would need a model s p100d or plaid to hang with/beat the g80 awd which are much more expensive cars

[SickGTR]

Originally Posted by jkap27

Still not sure how the giulia skates by with its reliability issues though. Most people wouldnt even consider buying one. Im sure 80% of people never have serious issues in 3 years but that is still a huge gamble on a $75k+ car. Not to mention i think the M3 xdrive takes the quarter mile vs the model 3 performance easily which is pretty wild to think about. I think tesla fanboy would need a model s p100d or plaid to hang with/beat the g80 awd which are much more expensive cars

Don't mention the Plaid. Different league my friend. You better get your Gx to about double factory HP and probably still won't win that one.