[StephenF92]

My 2022 M4 Competition xDrive came stock with the 19"/20" 825M wheels, as well as the 'Michelin Pilot Sport 4S' summer tires with the following dimensions:

Front: 19x9.5, 275/35 R19
Rear: 20x10.5, 285/30 R20

I do not want to change the wheels or rims, but I need to buy winter tires (or all-season tires). I have been doing research online and it looks like one of my only options for the 825M wheels is the 'Pirelli Winter Sottozero 3' tires.

What is confusing me is that some of the people who have gotten these 'Pirelli Winter Sottozero 3' tires for these 825M wheels chose widths that are 10 millimeters less than the stock 'Michelin Pilot Sport 4S' summer tires.

What is the benefit to getting a smaller width for the winter tires compared to the summer tires? Should I follow this guidance, or keep the winter tire dimensions the same as the summer tires? What about the aspect ratio?

[OF Hero]

If you're driving through a lot of packed snow on the ground, "thinner" tires help cut through the snow easier. Plus it's sometimes easier to find certain winter tires in certain sizes. If you're driving through mostly dry (but extremely cold) conditions, then the OEM sizes are fine IMO.

Where are you seeing the Pirelli's in stock? I don't see anything on TireRack.

[chris3g]

the primary reason right now is because the OEM sizes are not available anywhere.

[HorsePower]

Originally Posted by StephenF92

My 2022 M4 Competition xDrive came stock with the 19"/20" 825M wheels, as well as the 'Michelin Pilot Sport 4S' summer tires with the following dimensions:

Front: 19x19.5, 275/35 R19
Rear: 20x10.5, 285/30 R20

I do not want to change the wheels or rims, but I need to buy winter tires (or all-season tires). I have been doing research online and it looks like one of my only options for the 825M wheels is the 'Pirelli Winter Sottozero 3' tires.

What is confusing me is that some of the people who have gotten these 'Pirelli Winter Sottozero 3' tires for these 825M wheels chose widths that are 10 millimeters less than the stock 'Michelin Pilot Sport 4S' summer tires.

What is the benefit to getting a smaller width for the winter tires compared to the summer tires? Should I follow this guidance, or keep the winter tire dimensions the same as the summer tires? What about the aspect ratio?

Back in the day, when cars were simpler and there were less mechanical, and electrical, things to fail because of changing up tire sizes, the typical rule of thumb for winters was to go smaller and narrower wheel, with narrow (but much higher aspect ratio) winter tires. Basically, as long as they physically fit and didn't rub or cause other physical issues, a narrow tire cuts through the snow better (think powder skis - wide so that they float on top of fresh snow...not what you want for a winter tire) and more sidewall provided a softer ride and some degree of insurance for the inevitable winter potholes and such.

These days, especially with huge brakes, you can't really do a small winter wheel anymore, so you're effectively limited to oem sizes (or very close to it...I don't consider the difference of 10mm of width to be anything really significant).

On the G8x platform, many of us are running 275/35/19 snow tires on all 4 corners. The 10mm narrower width in back may make a small difference, but more importantly (to me) it allows them to be rotated (to try and get extra life out of the set). That also happens to be BMW's recommended winter set-up for tire sizing. Many of us are running them on 19x9.5 wheels all around too.

From what I'm hearing for this winter, everything is pretty much sold out until next spring/summer in terms of true winter tires, so you may need to compromise. Personally, if I was sticking with the oem rear 20x10.5 wheels for winter, I'd probably just do an oem-width rear tire too.

There are some write-ups on this forum (and links to professional write-ups) of how well some of the modern all season, hi performance tires can do in winter weather conditions. Even those all seasons should be MUCH better for winter than the stock summer tires, which will be unsafe and useless in cold, snow or ice (and will also damage themselves driving in those conditions, even if you're lucky enough to keep your car from getting damaged).

[StephenF92]

Originally Posted by HorsePower

Back in the day, when cars were simpler and there were less mechanical, and electrical, things to fail because of changing up tire sizes, the typical rule of thumb for winters was to go smaller and narrower wheel, with narrow (but much higher aspect ratio) winter tires. Basically, as long as they physically fit and didn't rub or cause other physical issues, a narrow tire cuts through the snow better (think powder skis - wide so that they float on top of fresh snow...not what you want for a winter tire) and more sidewall provided a softer ride and some degree of insurance for the inevitable winter potholes and such.

These days, especially with huge brakes, you can't really do a small winter wheel anymore, so you're effectively limited to oem sizes (or very close to it...I don't consider the difference of 10mm of width to be anything really significant).

On the G8x platform, many of us are running 275/35/19 snow tires on all 4 corners. The 10mm narrower width in back may make a small difference, but more importantly (to me) it allows them to be rotated (to try and get extra life out of the set). That also happens to be BMW's recommended winter set-up for tire sizing. Many of us are running them on 19x9.5 wheels all around too.

From what I'm hearing for this winter, everything is pretty much sold out until next spring/summer in terms of true winter tires, so you may need to compromise. Personally, if I was sticking with the oem rear 20x10.5 wheels for winter, I'd probably just do an oem-width rear tire too.

There are some write-ups on this forum (and links to professional write-ups) of how well some of the modern all season, hi performance tires can do in winter weather conditions. Even those all seasons should be MUCH better for winter than the stock summer tires, which will be unsafe and useless in cold, snow or ice (and will also damage themselves driving in those conditions, even if you're lucky enough to keep your car from getting damaged).

Knowing that I am going to keep the stock 19" wheels in the front and the stock 20" wheels in the back, the 10mm decrease in tire width won't matter because I will be limited to rotating the two front tires with each other and seperately the two rear tires with each other (since the wheels are respectively 19" and 20"), correct?

I do not want to buy new wheels. I simply want to buy the proper winter tires for my current wheels. thanks

[OF Hero]

Originally Posted by StephenF92

Knowing that I am going to keep the stock 19" wheels in the front and the stock 20" wheels in the back, the 10mm decrease in tire width won't matter because I will be limited to rotating the two front tires with each other and seperately the two rear tires with each other (since the wheels are respectively 19" and 20"), correct?

I do not want to buy new wheels. I simply want to buy the proper winter tires for my current wheels. thanks

You and I are in the same boat. I suddenly shot up the wait list at my dealer and was able to get an allocation from a buyer who backed out, and my car actually went into production today, 2 weeks ahead of schedule. 5 days ago I was still #2 on a slow moving wait list so I didn't think I'd even have the car until spring/summer, but here we are.

If you're looking to just swap rubber and keep the OEM wheels, one option which I'm also looking it, is to run 275s in the rear vs 285. It will give it a bit of a stretch but it's such a minor difference that it shouldn't matter, either from a looks or functionality standpoint. Back on my F80 I ran 255s in the rear in the winter (stock wheel was 275) and it was fine.

And looking at TireRack right now, one option which I've seen another user mention, is using Michelin Alpin PA5 at 275/35/19 in the front, and the Alpin PA4 at 275/30/20 in the rear. Unfortunately, Michelin does not make the PA5 in 20s, but this user claimed TireRack said it was ok to mix/match the PA4 and PA5.

Not ideal, but these are unusual circumstances with all of the shortages. Might need to get creative.

[HorsePower]

Originally Posted by StephenF92

Knowing that I am going to keep the stock 19" wheels in the front and the stock 20" wheels in the back, the 10mm decrease in tire width won't matter because I will be limited to rotating the two front tires with each other and seperately the two rear tires with each other (since the wheels are respectively 19" and 20"), correct?

I do not want to buy new wheels. I simply want to buy the proper winter tires for my current wheels. thanks

Since you have an x-drive and are keeping the oem wheels, if it were my car, I would stick to the exact oem sizes for the tires. I would not want to mess with tire sizes on a warrantied all-wheel-drive car, and then have the dealer or manufacturer possibly try and blame your tire swap for any drivetrain-related issues.

Note, many (most?) true winter tires are directional these days, so in that case, you may not even be able to rotate side to side on the same axle. But at least being x-drive, the wear should hopefully be a bit more even front and rear.

[HorsePower]

Originally Posted by OF Hero

You and I are in the same boat. I suddenly shot up the wait list at my dealer and was able to get an allocation from a buyer who backed out, and my car actually went into production today, 2 weeks ahead of schedule. 5 days ago I was still #2 on a slow moving wait list so I didn't think I'd even have the car until spring/summer, but here we are.

If you're looking to just swap rubber and keep the OEM wheels, one option which I'm also looking it, is to run 275s in the rear vs 285. It will give it a bit of a stretch but it's such a minor difference that it shouldn't matter, either from a looks or functionality standpoint. Back on my F80 I ran 255s in the rear in the winter (stock wheel was 275) and it was fine.

And looking at TireRack right now, one option which I've seen another user mention, is using Michelin Alpin PA5 at 275/35/19 in the front, and the Alpin PA4 at 275/30/20 in the rear. Unfortunately, Michelin does not make the PA5 in 20s, but this user claimed TireRack said it was ok to mix/match the PA4 and PA5.

Not ideal, but these are unusual circumstances with all of the shortages. Might need to get creative.

F80 was rwd though, so as long as left and right on the same axle were the same size, the front-to-rear relationship shouldn't have mattered for street driving. Not sure whether the minimal decrease in diameter and circumference on the rear of an x-drive (going from 285 width 30 aspect ratio, to 275/30) would make any functional difference. Or perhaps more importantly, whether it could flag something in the system as pertains to drivetrain warranty.

[luckylingy]

Originally Posted by StephenF92

Knowing that I am going to keep the stock 19" wheels in the front and the stock 20" wheels in the back, the 10mm decrease in tire width won't matter because I will be limited to rotating the two front tires with each other and seperately the two rear tires with each other (since the wheels are respectively 19" and 20"), correct?

I do not want to buy new wheels. I simply want to buy the proper winter tires for my current wheels. thanks

Good luck, I'm afraid to say. Proper winter tires for our cars are hard to come by. When I secured my set back in August, Tire Rack had (9) 275/35R19 Micheline Pilot Alpin 5 tires in the country -- and I got four of them. I bought a second pair of front (19x9.5) 825M rims, so I could run a square tire set-up in winter. I finally took delivery of the car last Wednesday and had the winter tires mounted this morning.

[AhsanU]

There are two options left right now that'll fit your stock wheels:

Michelin Pilot Alpin PA4 265/35/19 and 275/30/20
Pirelli Sottozero 3 275/35/19 and 295/30/20

10mm won't mean much and your speedo will be slightly off because of the rolling diameter difference, as well as a few other possibilities, but at this point: these are it. The benefit to thinner tyres is cutting through the snow better, but again - you're going 10mm narrower/wider here because there are no other choices.

You could do all seasons if your roads are decently plowed, but that's a gamble. I'm leaning towards PA4's myself as they served me quite well in the past. I'm getting my car towards the end of the snow season so I'm trying to wait and see if it's worth it now or waiting until this upcoming summer to get the ideal tyres/wheels.

Ideal for me: set of 19's flow forged, with 275/35/19 square Michelin Alpin 5 or Nokian Hakkapeliita R3's.

[playswcars]

There is another option: Hankook Winter i*cept evo3 W330

Just ordered a set in the OEM sizes 275/35/19 and 285/30/20

[OF Hero]

Originally Posted by playswcars

There is another option: Hankook Winter i*cept evo3 W330

Just ordered a set in the OEM sizes 275/35/19 and 285/30/20

Where from? Still available?

I too will be likely taking delivery mid or late March, so I just need something passable for 4-6 weeks and then will worry about a legit winter setup for 2022.

I thought about a set of good all-seasons and just avoid driving in the snow those last few weeks. Luckily most of our snow is done by the time I'll be taking delivery, so hopefully just cold dry days to deal with.

[playswcars]

Originally Posted by OF Hero

Where from? Still available?

I too will be likely taking delivery mid or late March, so I just need something passable for 4-6 weeks and then will worry about a legit winter setup for 2022.

I thought about a set of good all-seasons and just avoid driving in the snow those last few weeks. Luckily most of our snow is done by the time I'll be taking delivery, so hopefully just cold dry days to deal with.

I'm in Europe, so I have no idea where you'd have to order from.

[JosipZ]

Well we are fu*cked here aren't we bois? Trying to take my Xdrive skiing and seems it's not happening. I already did one too many unintentional drifts in this car to trust anything but a proper winter tire.

[luckylingy]

FWIW, the stance with matching 9.5 x 19" 825Ms on Michelin Pilot Alpin 5s. Rears have 12mm spacers to restore OEM outer clearance to fender. Come summer, 15mm spacers will go on the fronts and 12mm spacers will stay on (with the 10.5 x 20" rims).

[rgeorge33]

I wanted to stay with stock sizes, also. I was able to get the Pilot Alpin 5 for the fronts and PA4 for the rear. Tire Rack and Michelin claimed it's ok to mismatch. I ordered them the beginning of November and got them mounted on a spare set of 826 wheels last week. Car will arrive to the dealer later this, so I'm ready. That's assuming winter weather ever hits the Kansas City area. It's been very mild this year, so far.

[OF Hero]

Originally Posted by AhsanU

There are two options left right now that'll fit your stock wheels:

Michelin Pilot Alpin PA4 265/35/19 and 275/30/20
Pirelli Sottozero 3 275/35/19 and 295/30/20

10mm won't mean much and your speedo will be slightly off because of the rolling diameter difference, as well as a few other possibilities, but at this point: these are it. The benefit to thinner tyres is cutting through the snow better, but again - you're going 10mm narrower/wider here because there are no other choices.

You could do all seasons if your roads are decently plowed, but that's a gamble. I'm leaning towards PA4's myself as they served me quite well in the past. I'm getting my car towards the end of the snow season so I'm trying to wait and see if it's worth it now or waiting until this upcoming summer to get the ideal tyres/wheels.

Ideal for me: set of 19's flow forged, with 275/35/19 square Michelin Alpin 5 or Nokian Hakkapeliita R3's.

Thanks for pointing out that the PA4s are still available in a slightly smaller size.

I might go for that, but at this point I am actually hoping my car is delayed a little so that I can take delivery in April LOL.

[AhsanU]

Originally Posted by OF Hero

Thanks for pointing out that the PA4s are still available in a slightly smaller size.

I might go for that, but at this point I am actually hoping my car is delayed a little so that I can take delivery in April LOL.

Haha, yeah I was expecting the same honestly.

I got stupidly lucky with an allocation that was set for week 47, then opted for an individual paint that should've set me back at least a month.. looks like it only set me back 3 weeks as the allocation got pushed to week 50. Now the car is complete, is out of the factory, and is on its way to the port to get to me.. I wasn't expecting a car until March/April but now a late January delivery is looking very possible, so I'm hunting for winter tyres Definitely first world problems and I am eternally grateful to be getting the car sooner, but I 100% wasn't planning on it and spent a vast sum of money on other car parts already, so I might be screwed.

[OF Hero]

Originally Posted by AhsanU

Haha, yeah I was expecting the same honestly.

I got stupidly lucky with an allocation that was set for week 47, then opted for an individual paint that should've set me back at least a month.. looks like it only set me back 3 weeks as the allocation got pushed to week 50. Now the car is complete, is out of the factory, and is on its way to the port to get to me.. I wasn't expecting a car until March/April but now a late January delivery is looking very possible, so I'm hunting for winter tyres Definitely first world problems and I am eternally grateful to be getting the car sooner, but I 100% wasn't planning on it and spent a vast sum of money on other car parts already, so I might be screwed.

Yeah something similar happened to me...jumped up the waiting list and snagged an allocation that a buyer had backed out of...and went into production a couple of weeks early.

I'm debating between the smaller PA4s or just going with a "good" all-season for the last few weeks of winter and just avoiding the snow. The PA4s are probably a better bet as I can just remount next winter on a set of dedicated winter wheels.

[BMWRacer523]

Check Costco. I was able to order PA5s from there a few weeks ago based on a tip from amzbimmer