[griz31]

Hey all,

First - this is not a 8AT vs 6MT.

I tried searching and skimming through some threads and really didn’t see this topic discussed in much detail. If it’s repetitive, please feel free to delete or ignore.

One thing I am really curious about for those who have driven the 6MT G80/82 is do you feel the car is too heavy for the manual transmission?

I remember in 2014-2015 I was looking for a lease and was dead set on a manual. A dealer close by happened to have a 435i and a m235i on the lot in manual transmission. I drove the 435i first and it was just a terrible experience. It just felt like the car was too big and floaty to feel engaged in a manual. It really made me second guess my manual consideration. Then I jumped in the m235i and all was right. The 6MT suited that car much better and was what I ended up going with.

It’s hard to say that’s a fair or even close comparison which is the reason for the question. The only thing I could attribute the lack of enjoyment of the manual was due to the larger, heavier, and less engaging nature of the car. Do G80/82 manual owners feel that the manual suits the car, or is their some vagueness and lack of engagement due to the sheer weight of the vehicle?

[bri1042]

No more so than other larger (compared to a 2-series) cars. The Mustang isn't too big and heavy for a manual. The Camaro and the Challenger aren't, either. The M3 and M4 are big, but the E39 M5 wasn't too big for a manual, so neither are the current M3 and M4.

However, all of the above cars can be less floaty than a stock 435 (based on my experience with a 328i X-drive with base suspension and a 340i X-drive with Adaptive Suspension) depending on the suspension options fitted to them, even the ones that are larger than a 435. Even that statement could be wrong depending on the 435 you drove. The X-Drive-equipped F30/32's were quite floaty without the adaptive suspension, and only a bit less so with it. I didn't consistently drive an F30 with the static M Suspension, so I can't speak to it.

Overall it took me a few weeks to get used to the size of my M3 vs my M2C, but once I did I don't feel the size at all anymore. And that was never the case with my F30's or my SO's G30.

[LuvMyE92]

Well, my G82 is on the way, so I can't answer that yet, but as a former M2 owner I'll suggest that the M4 makes up for the additional weight with a lot more power.

I can't find exact numbers and am too lazy to look further, but I'm going to guess that the M4 is only two or three hundred pounds more than the 235i. 150 more horsepower can make up for most of that, I'd guess. Plus, the ///M car is going to be more engaging than the 435i.

There's a red M4 manual at Richmond/Midlothian BMW, why don't you go drive it and see?

[LuvMyE92]

Originally Posted by bri1042

... the E39 M5 wasn't too big for a manual, so neither are the current M3 and M4.

I'll add here that the E39 M5 (which is widely considered to be one of the best BMW cars ever made) was not only very heavy, but had less power than any of our contemporary M cars.

I've had three of them.

[bri1042]

The E39 M5 was the first M-car I ever drove. The experience is still solid in my memory, decades later. :-)

[av.7447]

One of the best manual cars I have ever owned was an E60 545i. That thing was a blast to drive! I am still dreaming about one day being able to find an E60 M5 in perfect condition and a 6 speed manual but since I live in Canada this is almost mission impossible. As for the new M3 being too heavy for a manual, I highly doubt... I mean, what is it even mean, too heavy? People drive manual trucks and SUV’s... are they too heavy? Also when I used to work in Shanghai, I bought a chinese made SUV “Chery Tiggo”... it was big and heavy with soft suspension... originally it came with a dual clutch transmission and the engine was a gutless 1.5 turbo. I manage to order it with a 5 speed manual and was surprised how much fun it was to drive that thing just because of the manual transmission... if I had to drive that thing with an automatic I would be bored out of my mind!

[moproblems]

It's an M car, if it feels too floaty to be engaging they have done something very, very wrong.

[heavyD^2]

Not picking on OP but it's kind of a weird question. I have driven full size pickup trucks with manual transmissions and never did I once think it was too big for a manual transmission. The engaging part of using a manual transmission is shifting gears yourself with your left foot and right hand (LHD vehicles) as you are interfacing with the vehicle in a more direct manner than with an automatic transmission that's using an ECU and TCU to select gears. The dimensions and handling capabilities of the car is a totally different dynamic. Also it's not like the car is that much heavier than the F8x or even F87 which is a porker for its size.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by griz31

The only thing I could attribute the lack of enjoyment of the manual was due to the larger, heavier, and less engaging nature of the car.

Your hypothesis is flawed because you did not test an F82 M4 with 6MT. Go drive one, or even better find someone with a G82 6MT and try that.

[dialogical]

Originally Posted by griz31

Hey all,

First - this is not a 8AT vs 6MT.

I tried searching and skimming through some threads and really didn’t see this topic discussed in much detail. If it’s repetitive, please feel free to delete or ignore.

One thing I am really curious about for those who have driven the 6MT G80/82 is do you feel the car is too heavy for the manual transmission?

I remember in 2014-2015 I was looking for a lease and was dead set on a manual. A dealer close by happened to have a 435i and a m235i on the lot in manual transmission. I drove the 435i first and it was just a terrible experience. It just felt like the car was too big and floaty to feel engaged in a manual. It really made me second guess my manual consideration. Then I jumped in the m235i and all was right. The 6MT suited that car much better and was what I ended up going with.

It’s hard to say that’s a fair or even close comparison which is the reason for the question. The only thing I could attribute the lack of enjoyment of the manual was due to the larger, heavier, and less engaging nature of the car. Do G80/82 manual owners feel that the manual suits the car, or is their some vagueness and lack of engagement due to the sheer weight of the vehicle?

The G8x does not feel too big for a manual. It may be too big for some people, but the manual isn't at issue.

If you haven't driven a true M car in the past then you don't have a basis for comparison.

[Penguino]

I'm not sure I see the relationship between weight and transmission as long as gearing is adequate.

[mmckenzie]

Originally Posted by Penguino

I'm not sure I see the relationship between weight and transmission as long as gearing is adequate.

Agree. I'm guessing the original question was asking whether the manual still goes well with G8X given its larger size and hence more "GT" car like characteristic i.e. a fast and comfortable long distance cruiser. As an owner of G80 6MT, I don't think this car is that, at all, especially with its planted, balanced, and tossable handling characteristic and the best steering I ever felt in any car. My definition of GT cars would be cars like M8, AMG GT, Panamera, but I've never driven these cars either so I could be wrong.

Brian Makse in his recent review of the manual M4 seems to think that M4 is in fact a GT car and therefore the auto is a better choice.

https://g80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1822814

I've never driven the M4, but can't really imagine it'd be too different than the M3, which again, perfectly suits the 6MT.

[spacecowboy85]

I don’t understand the question tbh, not to self promote or anything but look at my post on here about me driving it at Road America. The weight is not an issue, the car has not gained a lot of weight( this is my opinion) case in point a 911 is anywhere from 3400-3700 lbs based on specs. The new M3 is what 3800 at most I’m not sure.

Point is it’s not that far off from a coupe sports car when you factor the extra doors and everything else I am actually surprised it’s still under 4000 lbs.

I don’t understand the “it’s big and too heavy argument” for a manual transmission.

[griz31]

I can see how the question is a bit vague, but do think some captured the essence of what I was getting at based on the responses.

I've owned and driven an E90 M3 (manual) and an E82 1M (only offered manual), so do have experience with manual transmissions in "real" M cars.

I think mmckenzie may have captured what I was getting after more succinctly by describing the G8x as a "GT" car because of it's weight (and what I would consider the 435i to be).

It sounds like, to most, that the M engineering that went into the car masks a lot of the weight concerns and the tuning of chassis/suspension allows for a more connected experience with the 6MT.

My love for 6MT comes from the connection I feel with the car. Driving the 435i felt so disconnecting and poorly suited for the 6MT which I could only associate to it's "GT" nature. I mentioned I didn't think this was a fair comparison, and was just curious if those who are driving the current manual M cars felt that same connection given the ever growing size of the vehicles.

[FAM3LYCAR]

I will say I totally understand what you’re getting at. It’s personal preference obviously but somewhere between a Miata and a full size truck there’s a line where a vehicle becomes less engaging and the experience of shifting your own gears is more of a job than a rewarding experience. For me, there isn’t an M car I can think of that offers a MT that crosses that line. They have become heavier but the chassis still maintains the right balance and it still puts a smile on my face to shift my own gears and I’m incredibly happy they still offer it.

[filostrato]

I have really enjoyed driving the new G80 so far. I may have had low expectations coming from a smaller car (also MT) and expecting the M3 would feel slow and less agile. But man, the manual suits this car so well.

It’s actually pretty smooth at low speeds/ stop and go. And for me, the enjoyment of anticipating gear changes adds to the experience tremendously. The gear ratios and power band of the S58 really encourage you to wind it all the way out

The G80 is a big and heavy car no doubt. But the big power, quick steering and planted suspension have kept it true to the driver’s ethos

[saphire240]

I've seen a couple of reviews online(from guys who will always say yes to a manual) saying the engine and car itself are better suited with the zf. Especially for everyday driving, the power of the engine, and the fact the car is bigger giving out a sporty gt car vibe. I will be transitioning into an m3 comp coming from an m2 comp(manual)
Now when the new m2's come out with the s58 and updated power, carbon roof, and smaller form factor. That will be the car to look at in manual.

[TrentMeister]

Originally Posted by saphire240

I've seen a couple of reviews online(from guys who will always say yes to a manual) saying the engine and car itself are better suited with the zf. Especially for everyday driving, the power of the engine, and the fact the car is bigger giving out a sporty gt car vibe. I will be transitioning into an m3 comp coming from an m2 comp(manual)
Now when the new m2's come out with the s58 and updated power, carbon roof, and smaller form factor. That will be the car to look at in manual.

Yeah I'll 100% be trading my m4c in for the final year of the g87 with a stick