[solstice]

Originally Posted by PortImperialBMW

I see a lot of people choosing AWD for winter weather driving. I'm leaning towards AWD myself, but when you really think about it, does the winter weather driving really make a difference? I live and drive in NY/NJ. In the last few years I could think of maybe 3 days that I couldn't get by with RWD on winter tires. That said, those 3 days my X5 on winter tires struggled in certain places because there were 20+ inches of snow on the ground. Ground clearance and salt spreading were my biggest fear to my vehicle. So when we get those once every several year storms are you really needing to go anywhere anyway? And if so are you putting your AWD M3/4 out on the road?

The AWD reasoning is outdated when it comes to performance cars like the M3. It’s not for winter driving, it’s a performance upgrade pure and simple. Do you see people buying Aventadors, Bugattis, Porsche Turbos, GTRs, R8s etc mainly to use as winter vehicles...?

[Transfer]

Yes you can "get by" in nearly all conditions in RWD but you can't maintain road dominance in all conditions, including the wet. An AWD M3 will be similarly driveable and dominate in all conditions, not just dry roads.

[KevinGS]

Originally Posted by Transfer

Yes you can "get by" in nearly all conditions in RWD but you can't maintain road dominance in all conditions, including the wet. An AWD M3 will be similarly driveable and dominate in all conditions, not just dry roads.

RWD is certainly "driveable" in the rain, especially with proper tires like the Michelin 4S. And anyone forced to drive their M cars in the snow and ice, well, I feel for you.

Now as for "dominating" in all conditions, no, no RWD cars are going to dominate when the conditions aren't dry. But, are people really out their trying to prove how much faster their cars are than others in the rain, sleet and snow?

[CanuckM]

Originally Posted by KevinGS

RWD is certainly "driveable" in the rain, especially with proper tires like the Michelin 4S. And anyone forced to drive their M cars in the snow and ice, well, I feel for you.

Some of us do it out of choice.

I have a truck and a Macan that are much better suited for snowy and wet conditions but I'd much rather drive my RWD M2C. Aside from ground clearance on the worse of days, I get a kick out of driving it with MDM or DSC off and feeding the throttle. Might as well make the best out of shitty weather.

[Transfer]

Originally Posted by KevinGS

RWD is certainly "driveable" in the rain, especially with proper tires like the Michelin 4S. And anyone forced to drive their M cars in the snow and ice, well, I feel for you.

Now as for "dominating" in all conditions, no, no RWD cars are going to dominate when the conditions aren't dry. But, are people really out their trying to prove how much faster their cars are than others in the rain, sleet and snow?

I like to have the same traction in dry or wet and at least where I live it's 50/50 dry to wet days per year. If I need or want to be the faster car on the road, I'm not held back in AWD. This goes for snow too, with performance winter tires. Now that xDrive is so massively rear wheel biased I'm not going back to RWD for my uses.

[emix84]

RWD for me. Although I live in a temperate climate, I don't see the need to add xdrive, it does not increase my enjoyment of the car, quite the contrary and with proper winter tires it is driveable in all conditions. I'm not going for spirited drives in snow or sleet.

[Delmoney335]

Just curious as to the reason why many want the Awd in warm weather states like FL. I get the launch improvement/traction but other than that?

[KevinGS]

Originally Posted by Delmoney335

Just curious as to the reason why many want the Awd in warm weather states like FL. I get the launch improvement/traction but other than that?

I understand that some people not only want to be "safe" in inclement weather, some want to race around their highways and byways in inclement weather. I guess, even in the rain, they want to be "first" or in the lead.

So for them, nothing less than AWD will do, for improved traction in all circumstances and conditions.

For me, all I need is a good traction control with my RWD platform and I'm good. I don't plan on ever having to travel through ice and snow in my M. And in the rain, today's current traction control systems are exceptional in most performance cars, so much so that you can floor the throttle and they'll still maintain stability in the wet.

[Mar48]

RWD but only because I would only buy it with a manual... if both had a manual option, it would be a toss up but I'd probably go with AWD since I live in Minnesnowta

[xlover]

I look at it like this.... remembering first that Mxdrive isn't a bolt on get me home in the snow haldex system it is a sophisticated traction enhancement tool with electronic diffs center and rear that is so deeply integrated into the traction management system it essentially is the traction management system

Pros:
-awd will be faster off the line
-awd will be better in inclement weather
-awd will likely deliver faster laptimes on the majority of racetracks (maybe all tracks)
Cons:
-awd will not have the same traditional feel as rwd,
-awd will be slightly slower in a high speed rolling race due to more rotating mass

Considering that no ones paychecks are on line for laptimes in a stock M3, when purchasing it comes down to what factor drives personal enjoyment on the track or favorite backroad

Personally, rwd feel isn't high on my priority list,
I like the more "artificial" feel of an awd car shifting power forward to maximize traction. so I will easily take the faster car that has as a side benefit better all weather performance. That said, I don't think AWD is a "better" choice. For those who love rwd feel, nothing can replace it and rwd with proper tires is obviously capable of managing inclement conditions

[mirob]

Originally Posted by xlover

I look at it like this.... remembering first that Mxdrive isn't a bolt on get me home in the snow haldex system it is a sophisticated traction enhancement tool with electronic diffs center and rear that is so deeply integrated into the traction management system it essentially is the traction management system

Pros:
-awd will be faster off the line
-awd will be better in inclement weather
-awd will likely deliver faster laptimes on the majority of racetracks (maybe all tracks)
Cons:
-awd will not have the same traditional feel as rwd,
-awd will be slightly slower in a high speed rolling race due to more rotating mass

Considering that no ones paychecks are on line for laptimes in a stock M3, when purchasing it comes down to what factor drives personal enjoyment on the track or favorite backroad

Personally, rwd feel isn't high on my priority list,
I like the more "artificial" feel of an awd car shifting power forward to maximize traction. so I will easily take the faster car that has as a side benefit better all weather performance. That said, I don't think AWD is a "better" choice. For those who love rwd feel, nothing can replace it and rwd with proper tires is obviously capable of managing inclement conditions

Also, also, with AWD you can go to RWD when feeling frisky. To me, slight weight penalty and lack of MT option are the only cons AWD vs. RWD.

I know this isn't true for the F9X but the F9X also doesn't have the M Drive Professional option. Wondering if you go into RWD (having to turn DSC off) will the system allow you to use the 10-level TC in RWD mode if you tick that option.

[2011ninja]

M3 Pure

[kingmonkeyjr]

I'm here in San Diego where I never see snow and rain only 3 months of the year and it's just a couple inches of that when it does. Nothing like a RWD car. I had the F90 and dumped it for the G80. Faster than hell but so disconnected and numb to drive .. that's what I'm worried about the AWD M3. Plus I have the wife's X7 if we do go up to the snow.

As I was driving yesterday I thought to myself .. when the hell has a company ever thrown out a 450whp 6speed manual lol this thing is nuts and so fun to drive.

There's nothing like getting a little squirrelly with a RWD 🤪

[Bch53211]

Originally Posted by solstice

The AWD reasoning is outdated when it comes to performance cars like the M3. It’s not for winter driving, it’s a performance upgrade pure and simple. Do you see people buying Aventadors, Bugattis, Porsche Turbos, GTRs, R8s etc mainly to use as winter vehicles...?

Ha are you really comparing the m3/m4 to those cars?

[frankiebones]

From age 17 to 34 I had an Audi A4 (first car), S4, RS4, S4, and (you guessed it) an S4.

When Audi discontinued the 6MT I made the jump to an F80 at 34 years old....I only wished I had moved sooner.

I've been driving for 22 years. The first 17 years I drove quattro cars exclusively. RWD is infinitely more fun and with snow tires, I get from point A to point B safe and sound. I am an avid skiier and never consider the fact that my car is RWD when taking it to Maine in the winter.

Don't make the weather argument, it holds no water (pun intended).

[solstice]

Originally Posted by Bch53211

Ha are you really comparing the m3/m4 to those cars?

They are performance cars just as the M3 and they have AWD mainly as a performance upgrade. The same is true for the M3, it’s not getting AWD mainly to be a better winter car, it is getting it as a performance upgrade. To limit its appeal to areas with snow is missing out on the point with AWD in this type of car. The snow traction is just an added bonus.

[frankiebones]

Originally Posted by solstice

They are performance cars just as the M3 and they have AWD mainly as a performance upgrade. The same is true for the M3, it’s not getting AWD mainly to be a better winter car, it is getting it as a performance upgrade. To limit its appeal to areas with snow is missing out on the point with AWD in this type of car.

he doesnt get it....

[PVC]

Any leaks or additional details about AWD? I'm dying to find out how much quicker it is, how much weight it adds, and how much they're going to charge for it?

[Bch53211]

Originally Posted by PVC

Any leaks or additional details about AWD? I'm dying to find out how much quicker it is, how much weight it adds, and how much they're going to charge for it?

And when can I order one?

[NKGK20]

Originally Posted by xlover

I look at it like this.... remembering first that Mxdrive isn't a bolt on get me home in the snow haldex system it is a sophisticated traction enhancement tool with electronic diffs center and rear that is so deeply integrated into the traction management system it essentially is the traction management system

Pros:
-awd will be faster off the line
-awd will be better in inclement weather
-awd will likely deliver faster laptimes on the majority of racetracks (maybe all tracks)
Cons:
-awd will not have the same traditional feel as rwd,
-awd will be slightly slower in a high speed rolling race due to more rotating mass

Considering that no ones paychecks are on line for laptimes in a stock M3, when purchasing it comes down to what factor drives personal enjoyment on the track or favorite backroad

Personally, rwd feel isn't high on my priority list,
I like the more "artificial" feel of an awd car shifting power forward to maximize traction. so I will easily take the faster car that has as a side benefit better all weather performance. That said, I don't think AWD is a "better" choice. For those who love rwd feel, nothing can replace it and rwd with proper tires is obviously capable of managing inclement conditions

Honestly nobody can really sit here and say AWD will be slower on a roll race? Cars not out hasn't been tested, even though it's an AWD I don't think anyone can make a case to it being slower... if it is slower on a roll.. I wouldn't say by much maybe less then half a car .. but what do I know, it's not even out yet.. let's just wait and see
AWD will get you in and out of traffic quickly and it's going to be a monster when it comes out.. I'd wait . I have an X3MC and love it . I can basically launch on 90 percent of the cars on the rode and it's awesome. Can't wait to see the same engine in a lighter car..

[Jcali86]

Originally Posted by Bch53211

And when can I order one?

Dealer got back to me today and still no news. He'll notify my the second he knows as I'm first in line so I'll report back when he does - I've authorized calling me at literally any time day or night lol

[xlover]

Originally Posted by NKGK20

Honestly nobody can really sit here and say AWD will be slower on a roll race? Cars not out hasn't been tested, even though it's an AWD I don't think anyone can make a case to it being slower... if it is slower on a roll.. I wouldn't say by much maybe less then half a car .. but what do I know, it's not even out yet.. let's just wait and see
AWD will get you in and out of traffic quickly and it's going to be a monster when it comes out.. I'd wait . I have an X3MC and love it . I can basically launch on 90 percent of the cars on the rode and it's awesome. Can't wait to see the same engine in a lighter car..

That's true testing will tell the truth, but I think it's a reasonable assumption that: all other things being equal, in a rolling race at any speed where the rwd model suffers no traction loss, the rwd car should be able to pull away faster directly proportional to the weight difference and increase in driveline loss from awd model. How impactful those factors are obviously depends on real world testing and obviously describes a very specific circumstance.