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      04-13-2021, 06:10 AM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss330 View Post
If you read their lap time analysis in the OP, you will see that the G82 gains most over the F82 in Sector 4, which is the fast sector on this track. In this sector alone it's 1 sec quicker!

They cite the more calm behaviour due to the longer wheelbase as a major contributor to the G82's advantage on this part of the track.

On the twistier parts of the track the difference in lap times between G82 and F82 is much smaller, in sector 3 the G82 on PS4S is avtually a tad slower than the F82...

Tire development should not be underestimated, but on this track the largest chunk of time is gained on a sector where that is of less importance.

Also compared to the 911 Carrera lap in the post below with only 0,02 sec difference points to a very capable car.
OK, so if I read this right, the G82 gains most of its advantage over the F82 on the Sachsenring in the high speed sector where its significantly greater top end acceleration matters most, and gains little or nothing at all over the F82 in the sections where handling matters most despite being shod with the much better PS4S?

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      04-13-2021, 06:13 AM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scorp!on View Post
out of curiosity:
Are you guys all going to track that car?

If not:
Who the hell cares? It's faster anyway and you won't be able to use it anywhere unless you are on ze german autobahn.

It's impressive for me to see what this car is capable of. But i'm damn sure I will feel it not even 1% of the time I own this car as I will use it basically exclusively for daily stuff.
I will track it someday for sure, just for fun. And I bet my a** even if I had an F80 I would have the same amount of fun.
These cars are beasts anyway and i'm such a beginner tracker that I won't notice anything at all. And I think most of the buyers are like me, just few will use the car on the very limit.

Let's accept the fact the BMW made a great car.
Lack of DCT is the only thing I understand why people are upset.
And looks is subjective, always has been.
I could not have said this better... I have done some aggressive driving in my G80 and will be playing at some track days also. The G80 is a excellent Grand Touring Car four hours of road time and that is also a weapon on the track.
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      04-13-2021, 06:27 AM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fl1by View Post
I could not have said this better... I have done some aggressive driving in my G80 and will be playing at some track days also. The G80 is a excellent Grand Touring Car four hours of road time and that is also a weapon on the track.
totally ! Same goes for me.

There are just very few people like CanAutM3 who basically need all this information as they move their cars on the limit.
For someone like him the weight increase is an issue. For me not.
Just as an example..

But because of this I just don't understand all the hate.
The usual costumer of a car looks at this things when buying a car like this:
- Price
- Numbers (HP etc.) which just have to sound good
- Sound
- INTERIOR
- Daily ability
- Looks

oh course it sounds awesome when you hear the car is faster than XY or it does 0-100 in 3.9s. But this is just marketing for BMW to get costumer.

People who track the car look out for this reviews like here and try to evaluate the different cars to get the one best fitting their needs.

I for myself wanted a car with loads of power, rwd and MT.
Also reliable and good costumer service was important for me.
Everything offered very good from BMW, so my decision was pretty easy.
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      04-13-2021, 06:38 AM   #92
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Originally Posted by Boss330 View Post
I try to counterargue those portraying to post opinions as "facts" and show that sometimes (quite often) those "facts" might not be so black and white.

In trying to argue that, it might seem that I am biased the other way. When you play Devils advocate that is often how it's perceived.
So if you're playing the Devil's advocate to the Devil's advocate, does it mean you work for God?
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      04-13-2021, 10:10 AM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by canautm3 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by boss330 View Post
i try to counterargue those portraying to post opinions as "facts" and show that sometimes (quite often) those "facts" might not be so black and white.

In trying to argue that, it might seem that i am biased the other way. When you play devils advocate that is often how it's perceived.
so if you're playing the devil's advocate to the devil's advocate, does it mean you work for god? :d
😂😂😂😂✝️😇
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      04-13-2021, 10:16 AM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanAutM3 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss330 View Post
If you read their lap time analysis in the OP, you will see that the G82 gains most over the F82 in Sector 4, which is the fast sector on this track. In this sector alone it's 1 sec quicker!

They cite the more calm behaviour due to the longer wheelbase as a major contributor to the G82's advantage on this part of the track.

On the twistier parts of the track the difference in lap times between G82 and F82 is much smaller, in sector 3 the G82 on PS4S is avtually a tad slower than the F82...

Tire development should not be underestimated, but on this track the largest chunk of time is gained on a sector where that is of less importance.

Also compared to the 911 Carrera lap in the post below with only 0,02 sec difference points to a very capable car.
OK, so if I read this right, the G82 gains most of its advantage over the F82 on the Sachsenring in the high speed sector where its significantly greater top end acceleration matters most, and gains little or nothing at all over the F82 in the sections where handling matters most despite being shod with the much better PS4S?

Pretty much yes. It do gain one second in total over the other 4 sectors as well, but in the most twisty sector it's actually a tad slower than the F82 (weight disadvantage).

Nurburgring is also a power sensitive track with long high speed sectors and long uphill stretch. The S58 is a big part of a faster lap time there.
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      04-13-2021, 10:17 AM   #95
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It's clearly a very capable steed regardless of tire, no question there. On shorter tracks where there is less opportunity to stretch the 100-200 the F8x compares very well from what I can tell.

Of this cars listed though for generational comparison, I'd take an E92 M3 GTS everyday of the week 😬
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      04-13-2021, 10:18 AM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss330 View Post
I agree, he is generally a very well informed, knowledgeable and great asset to these forums.
But on this topic he shows a atypical partial and non objective behaviour.

I noticed this when coming back to these forums after having been more or less absent for many years. It struck me that he usually came into the discussions about the G8x with the perspective of talking down the car and it's achievements and comparing it unfavourably with the F8x (In the threads I read, so I could have missed other more positive posts from him in other threads to be fair).
I agree. He has already moved on and it is demonstrated in his attitude towards the G8x. His reasons for moving on are good ones, but it shines through on his posts (of which I was reading long before I joined these forums).

Still, watching you and CanAutM3 go at it on this thread was very informative.
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      04-13-2021, 10:54 AM   #97
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At least on these mules there’s no relief with the CSL for those who are agonizing over the rear sliding caliper brakes.
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      04-13-2021, 11:00 AM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Montaver View Post
It's clearly a very capable steed regardless of tire, no question there. On shorter tracks where there is less opportunity to stretch the 100-200 the F8x compares very well from what I can tell.

Of this cars listed though for generational comparison, I'd take an E92 M3 GTS everyday of the week ��
On the Vairano circuit, a short and slow track without a straight, the G82 with PS4S was slightly faster than the F82 GTS with PSC2 (and coilers...) and more than 3 seconds faster than the F82 M4 with PSS and more than 2 faster than the F80 M3 Competition with PSS.
On this circuit power is useless (indeed, it can be a disadvantage), good front end grip and great traction is more important, and the F82 was destroyed by the new G82.
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      04-13-2021, 11:08 AM   #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VIERsr View Post
On the Vairano circuit, a short and slow track without a straight, the G82 with PS4S was slightly faster than the F82 GTS with PSC2 (and coilers...) and more than 3 seconds faster than the F82 M4 with PSS and more than 2 faster than the F80 M3 Competition with PSS.
On this circuit power is useless (indeed, it can be a disadvantage), good front end grip and great traction is more important, and the F82 was destroyed by the new G82.
The new car is faster everywhere, the only place to hide for those who decided it was a failure before it could show what it can do is in technical numbers as weight and transmission delay. Real world performance shrugs off those details and continue to set new benchmarks. A stonking engine, great chassis, updated tech. and new tire sizing is doing its thing once again.
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      04-13-2021, 11:16 AM   #100
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All wheel drive version M3/M4 comp. could be a lot faster maybe?
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      04-13-2021, 11:17 AM   #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FC05 View Post
All wheel drive version M3/M4 comp. could be a lot faster maybe?
Count on it.
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      04-13-2021, 11:23 AM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
The new car is faster everywhere, the only place to hide for those who decided it was a failure before it could show what it can do is in technical numbers as weight and transmission delay. Real world performance shrugs off those details and continue to set new benchmarks. A stonking engine, great chassis, updated tech. and new tire sizing is doing its thing once again.
You forgot the small rear calipers!
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      04-13-2021, 11:48 AM   #103
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Would be cool if BMW had all these legacy M3's laying around but put them on the same modern tire / brake pads/fluid and ran them again at the 'ring to see how close or far apart they actually are.
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      04-13-2021, 11:53 AM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frankiebones View Post
I agree. He has already moved on and it is demonstrated in his attitude towards the G8x. His reasons for moving on are good ones, but it shines through on his posts (of which I was reading long before I joined these forums).

Still, watching you and CanAutM3 go at it on this thread was very informative.
As posted previously, I try to look at things as objectively as possible. I was also quite critical on many aspects of the F8X when it was launched, same for the M4cs when it was launched. But in the end, the pros outweighed the cons for me and I went ahead and purchased. In the case of the G8X, I find the cons outweigh the pros for my particular interests (that latter part of the sentence is key, because everyone will have varying degree of particular interests). Hence why my view on the G8X will naturally be seen as a bit more critical.
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      04-13-2021, 11:56 AM   #105
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Wow! Impressive!!!! I expected nothing less given all of the N'Ring videos we saw last year.
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      04-13-2021, 12:05 PM   #106
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impressive no doubt
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      04-13-2021, 12:22 PM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solstice View Post
The new car is faster everywhere, the only place to hide for those who decided it was a failure before it could show what it can do is in technical numbers as weight and transmission delay. Real world performance shrugs off those details and continue to set new benchmarks. A stonking engine, great chassis, updated tech. and new tire sizing is doing its thing once again.
For sure it is faster. That was never up for debate. How much faster is the point of contention for some of us. For example, sticking to the Autobild test in the OP (on street tires to keep things equal):

E9XC 1:41 --> F82C 1:36 = ~5 sec
F82C 1:36 --> G82C 1:34 = ~2 sec

With every generation changeover, tire tech (not only sizing) is an important contributor to the performance gains. Taking tires out of the equation, the gains of the G8X as demonstrated in the OP are not significant enough for me to keep me interested, especially coming out of a CS. Hence why I am moving on. For others, coming out of 2015, it can be a different story. And it is not only about lap times for me, you might dismiss some characteristics that not important to you, but these might be more important to others. In the end, I may very well come back to ///M if they make a compelling proposition with the CS or CSL .
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      04-13-2021, 12:38 PM   #108
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Actually the gap between PS2 (E92) and PSS (F82) was really HUGE, I'd say bigger than PSS and PS4S.
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      04-13-2021, 12:40 PM   #109
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Typo or no typo, 53% front axle distribution is a little on the higher side of my tastes. Guess the engineers are really struggling to reach that golden 50/50 weight balance....

Maybe they'll surprise us with the CS/CSL
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      04-13-2021, 12:44 PM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanAutM3 View Post
As posted previously, I try to look at things as objectively as possible. I was also quite critical on many aspects of the F8X when it was launched, same for the M4cs when it was launched. But in the end, the pros outweighed the cons for me and I went ahead and purchased. In the case of the G8X, I find the cons outweigh the pros for my particular interests (that latter part of the sentence is key, because everyone will have varying degree of particular interests). Hence why my view on the G8X will naturally be seen as a bit more critical.
No arguments there. How much of the cons are related to looks?
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