[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by HudsonHornett

Of course it can’t keep up with them. It has no aero. The GT3 RS was pulling 800Kg at some point.

That’s the point, it doesn’t keep up. I am not sure why it was pitted against those two to start with, it’s not even in the same league. Already, comparing the CSL to the GT3 is a stretch, to a GT3RS is a bit ridiculous.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by HudsonHornett

Actually, no. I had a puncture and wanted to replace my Cup 2R, there was not a single tyre available in the entire UK market. These tyres are in very short supply at the moment, it's not just some massive BMW conspiracy.

That’s interesting, because there is no short supply in PSC2R in other specs. My tire dealer just offered me a set in N-spec (I declined, I rather stick (pun intended) with the regular PSC2).

[HudsonHornett]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

That’s interesting, because there is no short supply in PSC2R in other specs. My tire dealer just offered me a set in N-spec (I declined, I rather stick (pun intended) with the regular PSC2).

Maybe the situation is different in North America? But I have a Michelin Brand ambassador looking into getting a Cup2R for me and I’m not expecting it to arrive any time soon.

[HudsonHornett]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

That’s the point, it doesn’t keep up. I am not sure why it was pitted against those two to start with, it’s not even in the same league. Already, comparing the CSL to the GT3 is a stretch, to a GT3RS is a bit ridiculous.

I think it was an interesting comparison and a great watch. Nothing wrong with showing the difference between these 3 cars. But I wouldn’t expect the CSL to get anywhere near a GT3RS, in fact I wouldn’t expect anything to be close to a GT3 RS.

[G30M]

for proper compare you need to compare M4 GT3 to the GT3 i would have thought? sorry a noob at GTx cars ...

all i know is i want a Ferrari 296 GT3

[MDM]

Originally Posted by MadBimmeRad

Feast your eyes on this from our friendly Hagerty, Jason Cammisa

By far, the most exciting and entertaining review in my book

Hell no! I said this in another thread....Why isn't BMW building us a car that is on par with the competition? These almost, close, if only... type of descriptions is getting on my nerves! Build a FUCKING CAR that challenges the competition!!! Stop building these one trick ponies! BMW continues to build cash cow models....competition, CS, CSL and so on! And these are the roots of the "M" division? The only models BMW is making these days are BS!

[M4ord]

Originally Posted by MDM

Hell no! I said this in another thread....Why isn't BMW building us a car that is on par with the competition? These almost, close, if only... type of descriptions is getting on my nerves! Build a FUCKING CAR that challenges the competition!!! Stop building these one trick ponies! BMW continues to build cash cow models....competition, CS, CSL and so on! And these are the roots of the "M" division? The only models BMW is making these days are BS!

The short answer is they don’t need to. The long answer is $$$ in development. BMW Group sells 2 million more cars a year than Porsche does, but doesn’t feel the need to compete with cars that are only made in limited quantity. Porsche on the other hands makes sports cars all in limited quantity and recently moved in the SUV market. And if not mistaken, make more money in SUVs now. In my opinion I think we are lucky to have a M division at all.

[TractionControlDelete]

I love Jason but he lost me at PS4S for the CSL lol

[NotSharocks]

LOL a Cadillac land barge is faster around a racetrack then the purpose built M car.

Love it.

[DS_BMW]

Originally Posted by FC4

More impressive is the Plaid, faster than both...

I would like to see what it does with the new track pack released.

[02M3ForMe]

Great video.

Re-run this with Cup 2R on a normal-temp day. The CSL will for sure turn a quicker time than CT5 BW, Plaid, etc.

[eman4517]

Originally Posted by KevinGS

Indeed

Soon we'll have semi-affordable sports cars with Plaid power, less weight, better brakes, and lower placement of the batteries for better COG...imagine how fast they will be around a track??? Available soon by Porsche and Chevrolet at a dealer near you.

The only thing missing will be the sound, but you know manufacturers (and audio engineers) are working on that.

If you love speed and performance, the future is bright for car enthusiasts (and hec, the future is now, people are already placing orders). We got over not having a V8 or V12 soundtrack when many manufacturers went to turbos, we adjusted. My hunch is we'll adjust again. And they'll probably find a way to pump your favorite V8, V12, or turbo V6 soundtrack right into the cabin, right behind your head. It will be a new form of ASD that many will complain about (but some will enjoy it).

Yep...saw this on Motor Trend channel at Sema

https://www.roadandtrack.com/news/a4...-v8-sound-kit/


https://youtu.be/rp2Q0uHWBFM

https://youtu.be/kzrGdL6W2xs

[cbertels]

Originally Posted by Hit_Apex

Yeah, bashing the CSL with the Camaro has some weight not the Blackwong.

“Blackwong”. 🤣😂🤣

[SexyRoger]

Originally Posted by MadBimmeRad

Feast your eyes on this from our friendly Hagerty, Jason Cammisa

By far, the most exciting and entertaining review in my book

Not fair for the BMW, it should be compared against the Z06 and the GTS. Which is a fair compare. A GT3 RS is just not fair. Y

ou need more tricks up your sleeve than a big grill and some tires. Maybe Tom Schimer tricks and 100K on top of the 160K car to make it come close to the GT3 RS.

Porsche is the best value for money.

[KevinGS]

Originally Posted by eman4517

Yep...saw this on Motor Trend channel at Sema

https://www.roadandtrack.com/news/a4...-v8-sound-kit/


https://youtu.be/rp2Q0uHWBFM

https://youtu.be/kzrGdL6W2xs

Nope, but thanks for sharing. I was unaware of these vids or the article. But we all knew something like this was coming since one of the most common complaints from enthusiasts is a lack of sound.

Speakers for the inside and outside. The future is now.

[deneed4spd]

Originally Posted by wtwo3

Track conditions have a lot to do with it. They mentioned these 3 cars were run in freezing temps. I'm sure in normalized track conditions the CSL would easily surpass the CT5V BW.

I hope so because the BW is also running street tires and it has extra two seats, 4 doors and is a manual.

[Asymmetrick]

Originally Posted by MDM

Why isn't BMW building us a car that is on par with the competition

But it does! Think about it:

BMW did build a ~145K car (the M4 CSL) that outperforms other ~145K$ cars (i.e., Porsche 911C2S or 718GT4, comparably equipped with PCCB, Carbon roof, Carbon bucket seats, etc).

Even the 911GT3RS get beat by more expensive cars. It is unfair to compare it to the Rimac Nevera or Mercedes AMG One (i.e., the current Nurburgring champ). By the same token, why would anyone feel the need to compare the M4 CSL with the 911 GT3RS, a car almost twice its price?

For the money, the M4 CSL is delivering awesome performance IMO. You are getting 911 GTS performance with the M4 CSL for the price of a comparably equipped Carrera 2S. That is not "on par" with the competition, this IS BMW beating the competition.

---
PS. The overall winner of this comparison is the Z06. Its performance is nearly that of the GT3RS, but for much less $$$.

[FCX5]

Originally Posted by 02M3ForMe

Great video.

Re-run this with Cup 2R on a normal-temp day. The CSL will for sure turn a quicker time than CT5 BW, Plaid, etc.

Likely not if you put the track pack on the Plaid. This completion was based on what the cars ship with from what I can tell. The BMW is good value for money.

[wtwo3]

Originally Posted by deneed4spd

I hope so because the BW is also running street tires and it has extra two seats, 4 doors and is a manual.

The BW is also producing 120 more horsepower than the CSL. So again - this track favors high horsepower, which is the reason the Z06 was even able to keep up with the much more nimble GT3rs.

The fact that the CSL achieved a similar time to a car with 120 more horsepower (on a track which favors cars with more power), in freezing temps, I think speaks to how capable the CSL is.

[deneed4spd]

Originally Posted by wtwo3

The BW is also producing 120 more horsepower than the CSL. So again - this track favors high horsepower, which is the reason the Z06 was even able to keep up with the much more nimble GT3rs.

The fact that the CSL achieved a similar time to a car with 120 more horsepower (on a track which favors cars with more power), in freezing temps, I think speaks to how capable the CSL is.

M4 CSL is 500 lbs lighter than the BW. I think 500 lbs easily neutralizes the 120 extra ponies.

[eman4517]

Originally Posted by KevinGS

Nope, but thanks for sharing. I was unaware of these vids or the article. But we all knew something like this was coming since one of the most common complaints from enthusiasts is a lack of sound.

Speakers for the inside and outside. The future is now.

I'm still not jumping on the EV train even with the sound enhancements. The sound just shrinks the size of the large pill making it easier to swallow. (Even a hybrid would be a real stretch for me). I can only see ICE cars for me in the near future unless something drastically changes to the scale of Mad Max/Road Warrior.

[KevinGS]

Originally Posted by eman4517

I'm still not jumping on the EV train even with the sound enhancements. The sound just shrinks the size of the large pill making it easier to swallow. (Even a hybrid would be a real stretch for me). I can only see ICE cars for me in the near future unless something drastically changes to the scale of Mad Max/Road Warrior.

Me and you both, I'll be one of the last holdouts. I'll likely be that guy in 20-year-old ICE vehicles.

But in the meantime, we'll soon have a bunch of 2-second EVs all around us pumping out fake sounds. Kids are going to love it. They'll "tune" their EVs to be crazy fast, even if the range is only 50 miles.

Crazy acceleration with fake engine noises blaring out through external speakers will be the craze.

The youth will go from burble tunes to audio hack "tunes". Running through your neighborhood soon will be EVs with artificial soundtracks...first with Stang, Chevy and Vette V8 soundtracks, and then they'll graduate to Lambo, Ferrari, and AMG sound enhancements. You'll see a Kia EV leaving you for dead when the light turns green, complete with a GT3 engine pouring out from it. We'll miss the simplicity of ASD only affecting the interior.

We better enjoy these days, don't take them for granted. Many of us are going to struggle to remain as excited as car enthusiasts in the future, and the future is right around the corner.

Many of us will remain "stuck in the past". We're going to look just like those old guys at today's meets with their 60's muscle cars, meets filled today with Porsches, M cars, AMGs, C8s, and Hemis. Kids will simply ignore us and our "fast" 3-second ICE cars, as they jump in their escape-velocity, less-than-2-second EVs (with the V10 soundtrack pouring out).