View Poll Results: DCT or traditional AT? | |||
I prefer a DCT. | 235 | 60.57% | |
I prefer a traditional AT. | 32 | 8.25% | |
Either is fine with me. | 53 | 13.66% | |
I don't care. No manual, no purchase. | 68 | 17.53% | |
Voters: 388. You may not vote on this poll |
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11-25-2019, 08:16 PM | #177 |
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That works easiest for M4 owners. Many need 4 doors and, for me, the M3 is the only car that ticks all the right boxes. Maybe a used RS6 Avant if the G80 doesn't pan out, I'm keeping the F80 for a while anyway. We'll see I suppose, I'm hopeful it will be a great car.
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11-27-2019, 03:00 PM | #178 | |
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BMW was chosen not because of price but because it ticked more boxes. The DCT is one big box that will now go unticked. |
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11-28-2019, 12:33 PM | #179 |
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Not the big grill, not the lack of interesting (to me) launch colors...not the lack of AWD + manual....none of those things have disappointed me.
But the lack of DCT is personally my biggest disappointment. Not enough to not get it, mind you, but a disappointment none the same. Seems like BMW is trying to make this car a GT in the near future. |
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11-28-2019, 10:39 PM | #180 |
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Jason Cammisa (great automotive journalist) on Instagram commented that he felt the powertrain in the X3M felt laggy. Other journalists are saying that it's easy to catch it off guard if it's in manual mode at a lower RPM. The turbo lag is very apparent if that's done. Don't quote me on this, but I heard it's because they upped the boost in the turbochargers and reduced the compression ratio. It might be tuned differently in the M3, though. I personally think that this engine sounds fantastic in comparison to the S55. Sounds much more natural. I'm greatly anticipating this new M3!
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11-29-2019, 12:06 AM | #181 | |
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Sorry but there are zero positives that come with a ZF box on the iconic M3 - except to BMWs bottom line. |
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11-29-2019, 01:08 AM | #182 | ||
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Dct leads zfat in "because racecar" feel and swagger for sure. Which in all fairness does matter to some but I doubt bmw felt that the case was compelling especially with the manual available for the traditionalist. |
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11-29-2019, 01:15 AM | #183 | |||
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I've never driven a ZF gearbox I liked. They always lag on the paddles. There is a very good reason almost all Supercars have a DCT. There is also a very good reason AMG has stuck with a DCT in the A45. The gearbox has to match the character of the car. While it makes sense in an M5 it detracts from the whole dynamic package that an M3 should be. |
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11-29-2019, 03:10 AM | #184 | |
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Is the latest ZF8 a step to far right on the scale? Hard to argue when an MT is available in the M3 and the M2 still offer the DCT. If BMW replace the DCT in the M2 with a ZF8 I can without reservations join the outrage. A ZF8 has no place in an M2, ever. Last edited by solstice; 11-29-2019 at 03:19 AM.. |
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11-29-2019, 03:12 AM | #185 | ||
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11-29-2019, 03:22 AM | #186 |
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11-29-2019, 07:54 PM | #187 |
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I've driven the M2C and X3M back to back. While the size between the two is different comparing just the shift characteristics, the DCT in the M2 is far superior. It is definitely quicker and more definitive with the way it shifts. I always prefer a manual but I'd choose DCT everyday over the ZF if I had to chose. Those who say it's the "same" speed either haven't driven them back to back or don't know what they're talking about. Some may be able to live with the slower ZF due to "comfort" but this always amuses me. Go get a M340i or M240i, etc. if you're concerned about comfort.
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11-29-2019, 08:10 PM | #188 | ||
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11-30-2019, 01:10 AM | #189 |
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11-30-2019, 01:19 AM | #190 | |
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The entire line will have the same automatic gearbox eventually. Except perhaps if the develop a halo car - out the reach of almost all of us. As far as stupid goes - have you seen the new grill designs? BMW is capable of being very stupid. If they put a slush box in the M3 it's game over for me and many others. |
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11-30-2019, 02:29 AM | #191 | |
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11-30-2019, 02:31 AM | #192 |
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If BMW built a lighter car with modest power improvements, people still wouldn't be happy. The company is in a lose/lose situation when it comes to the smaller, forum-based enthusiast group. If the car was lighter with a modest increase in power, people would complain about how the Mercedes or [insert other manufacturer here] is producing a car with a serious horsepower advantage despite being heavier. People will always find something to complain about.
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11-30-2019, 04:13 AM | #193 | |
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If Mercedes can manage to put a DCT in an A class AMG hatch surely BMW can put DCT into its most iconic M car? They won't primarily for cost reasons and It's a shame. This new car Will Definitely suit those that chase drag strip quarter mile times. That doesn't interest me though. |
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11-30-2019, 06:49 AM | #194 | ||
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11-30-2019, 08:35 AM | #195 | |
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BMW had perfect transmission called M-DCT and if they are phasing out on the purest M variants just for cost cutting, there is no future for this company. At least not for M division.
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11-30-2019, 09:43 AM | #196 | ||
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I would like to say I will leave BMW when the G80 comes out with no DCT but the truth is, where would I go? It's either going to be phased out by competitors (Mercedes) or already has been (Audi & Alfa). |
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11-30-2019, 10:54 AM | #197 | |
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The M cars were supposed to have rough edges ("mummy, my DCT is not smooth enough!") and compromised comfort in exchange for superior handling and performance that enthusiasts appreciated. They cost more because the potential market was smaller. If BMW isn't going to do that any more, then they should be honest about it and, cancel the M3 and tell everybody that the mass market "M350ixs+" is the car they should want. That's the logical conclusion of the "forum enthusiasts are only a tiny part of the market" argument (that inevitably follows every post like this). Personally, I'm shopping for extended warranties right now, hoping that something better will eventually appear. Last edited by pbar; 11-30-2019 at 11:00 AM.. |
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11-30-2019, 01:01 PM | #198 | |
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It’s a similar difference between buying an M performance car and a true M as it is between buying an Audi and a Porsche. The price difference between a real M and a non does not nearly reflect the superior products the M cars are vs. MXXXi cars. And at the current size and practicality of the M3 I believe there is a sizable market who want all of that with a smoother gearbox. If you look at the lineup of M these days it’s not a lineup of track cars with compromised comfort, it’s a high end sub brand of BMW building better cars with sporty ambitions. The smallest cars retain some of the original M car’s track ambitions while the larger cars do not. The M3 is now having one foot on each side. An MT and a ZF make at least some sense. Last edited by solstice; 11-30-2019 at 01:28 PM.. |
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