03-22-2023, 02:38 PM | #111 |
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This was my initial thought too! All results from a performance standpoint and real dyno numbers points to the car making over 503hp. So technically they could increase the hp without touching anything but documentation and promotional material.
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03-22-2023, 05:09 PM | #112 | |
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If you follow the posts about the cs, some people have said, garage queen, a lot of others said daily driver. Almost none of them said it’ll be a track car. So is the setup really better to daily drive? Of course not. So basically they just want a CS, because the ego is real in the bmw world so they can say “yeah I have a CS, which is a better m3 than your normal competition or base.”
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03-22-2023, 06:03 PM | #113 | |
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You are right tho, people buy them because of the badge. I know I did for nearly the same as what ZCPs were going for at the time and have since proceeded to undo the primary thing that makes a CS what it is (suspension) Matt Farah said it best about M5CS (but this applies to CS models in general): "Who buys a M5, even a M5CS, to not use as their everyday car? This is an everyday car, like just admit it. It is. You're not buying a 4000lb sedan just to go to track days... maybe you'll do a track day... but it's not just for track days." Replace M5 above with M3 and it still holds very true.
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03-22-2023, 07:56 PM | #115 | |
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You're right you don't buy a 4000lbs sedan to go to the track. So why do people need a CS? Just the extra power? Minor weight reduction? Is the CS just an M3 version of the CSL? I do agree BMW hasn't made a true track car as their CSL ran only a 7:15 at the ring? No one who buys these cars will ever come close to reaching the limits on a track. Which would make an even worse argument when talking about daily driving. Is that price increase for the CS worthwhile in the opinion of those buying said CS if they were just daily driving it?
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03-22-2023, 08:15 PM | #116 | |
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They aren’t track cars and if that was your goal a base model car is the best option since you’ll end up replacing all the “CS” bits for more fit-for-purpose parts anyway.
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03-23-2023, 07:30 AM | #117 | |
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I don’t doubt the CS is a big improvement over a competition. I wouldn’t know first hand I never driven a CS new or previous generation. But if that’s the case, bmw made the cs for the street?
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03-23-2023, 07:32 AM | #118 | |
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If they did what you are saying, the German government would immediately reach out and ask where you falsifying engine numbers? I think with the VW fiasco of years past, these are not games any manufacturer would want to play at this point.
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03-23-2023, 10:49 AM | #119 | |
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HP and fast lap times don’t make two cars equal. (Not for me.) People like me chose a G80 6MT over a Comp AWD because I prioritize driver engagement over lap times. Plenty of slower Porsche’s out there as well, but people buy those cars for more than lap times. My 2016 F80 was made the year they were still using Carbon Fiber drive shafts. That’s not showing up on a performance stat sheet, but I can appreciate that material and engineering The new CS is more than HP increase even if someone builds a faster 335i. |
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03-23-2023, 11:33 AM | #120 | |
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Regarding the CS as a daily driver (I plan to make it my daily driver, right now I have a Z4 M40i and a Trackhawk for that purpose): It is a stealthy daily driver , very important here in Germany because I park the car in front of my business. I ran a few numbers and the real price difference between a M3 Competition xDrive and the M3 CS is around 25k EUR. For the extra 25k EUR, I get: 1. 40 hp more power without warranty issues 2. Gearbox "tune" without warranty issues 3. M GmbH developed/tested new chassis which is very very hard to beat (street legal) 4. Carbon bonnet 5. CS specific interior with CS insignia and carbon middle console 6. M GmbH developed Titanium exhaust 7. Bronze wheels 8. Yellow icon daytime running lights Everything with 100% warranty and TÜV and no issues with BMW, authorities or whatever. Now we can discuss if all these things are worth 25k EUR but in my opinion, they will make a difference in resale value at some point. Right now, the used car markets are overheated and people are paying crazy prices but only two years or so ago, things looked different, at least here in Germany. In the end, it makes a HUGE difference for ME if I have a tuned car or an ORIGINAL M developed car. I had a tuned 996 Turbo RS-Tuning, a 997 Turbo RUF 550 and a Shelby GT500 with over 765 hp, McLeod clutch/bigger intercooler/etc. but I never really liked tuned cars for various reasons. I don't know how much the real price difference between a M3 Comp xDrive and a M3 CS is in the US but for ME, 25k EUR more aren't really a lot in my opinion. Last edited by RTC3000; 03-23-2023 at 11:46 AM.. |
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03-23-2023, 12:33 PM | #121 | |
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03-23-2023, 12:54 PM | #122 | |
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Some have more skills than another. If you’re not a season track person or a professional, imho you fall under a novice track driver. Or to the very least they should post their own PB of a particular lap time on a certain track and compare it to a professional driver on the same track with the same car. That should tell some story about being a good driver or not. And I still fail to see how the above you mention makes it’s a better street car over a comp xdrive. I guess if you’re going to modify it then yeah a more powerful version with a warranty is better. But driving dynamics on the street will be experienced? If so, wouldn’t that type of driving be suited for the track?
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03-23-2023, 01:49 PM | #123 | |
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03-23-2023, 01:54 PM | #124 | |
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These are all street first cars, no matter how they market them. They went out of their way to emphasize that the G82 CSL was a street first machine more than likely because F82 GTS was a proper "track-ready" product that was skewered by a car & journalist community that didn't really want a factory track tool. The GTS was severely misunderstood at launch but was and still remains a serious track-day weapon. But I imagine BMW wants to avoid a fiasco like that at all costs.
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03-23-2023, 03:30 PM | #125 | |
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03-23-2023, 06:41 PM | #126 | |
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BMW fumbled when they positioned the M4GTS as a competitor to the 911GT3. At least they properly positioned the G8X CS/CSL.
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03-23-2023, 07:04 PM | #127 | |
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03-24-2023, 07:56 PM | #128 |
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Similar car history…I had a b7 RS4 and a b8 RS5, both NA V8s, so lots of mods, but not much benefit in tune. I had a flash tune on my GTR though and bolt-ons with flex-fuel created a very fun car. I’m absolutely in on a Carbahn tune. Hoping soon.
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