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      12-10-2020, 12:07 PM   #1
whatnotsomuchf80
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Sub 3 sec 0-60 and 9's in 1/4 mile incoming

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I see a lot of posts with people disheartened by the G80's weight, power, looks, etc. Many saying they'd rather get an M5 or even a GTR. For those of you with modded F80's out there, you know how easy it is to add massive power w downpipes and an E85 tune, let alone turbos and PI. For most, traction was the issue.

I personally think a highly modded *AWD* G80 should hit insane numbers as in high 2's on a 0-60 and 9's in the 1/4 mile. An M5 shouldn't go past stage 2 without worrying about rods, and GTRs need upgraded transmissions among other things. The new ZAF should be able to handle high torque loads, and no crank hub worries with the S58 engine. When the new AWD G80's come out w massive power gains it will be a massive straight line acceleration beast. For reference, please see new X3M gains on the S58.

Who else thinks we will see such numbers?
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      12-10-2020, 02:21 PM   #2
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Have zero interest in 1/4 miles. Don't care how much hp it has over 500 really to be honest.

I do care how well-rounded the car is as a versatile, streetable daily driver that is very capable on road-courses and posts a competitive nurburgring time.


At some point in road racing, you need to balance power with what the chassis can handle aerodynamically and road-holding/traction at the physical limits....It doesn't make any logical sense to have a near 4000lb GT road car that does occasional road course track duty with 800hp that can't effectively put down power to the tarmac coming out of or going into turns, and can't road hold because it's too heavy at the limit. Adding more power to the tune of like 800-1000hp is just going to ruin the balance of the car. Are people really buying the M3 for drag racing or something?

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      12-10-2020, 08:37 PM   #3
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Same here, zero interest on heavily modded 1/4 mile times.

I am looking for a fully warrantied dual use car for the 4-season daily drive and weekend track hobby, which is what the M3(4) design intent has always been about.
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      12-10-2020, 09:35 PM   #4
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Yup, bring on the new M3s and M4s and every pound of metal with it ... here's what Throttle House said about BMWs Ms in general at minute 7:00, in particular 7:25
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      12-10-2020, 10:27 PM   #5
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The big weight more than the looks kinda ruins it for me. Awd will be north of 4000lbs and probably closer to 4100lbs

That defeats the purpose of what the M3/M4 are IMO. You have a M5 with less power basically
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      12-10-2020, 10:32 PM   #6
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I'm looking forward to 9 second M3's for sure. It's pretty incredible that a slightly modified 4 door family car will be able to beat basically anything on the street from a stop. With a turbo upgrade the S58 on an X3 M is around 800 awhp. Thats more than my M5 and they will be lighter by a good amount. I hit a 10.1 1/4 mile, 0-60 in 2.6. The M3/4 should be quite a bit faster even on the stock turbo. I think easily 9.8's with a tune.
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      12-10-2020, 10:34 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LSM View Post
The big weight more than the looks kinda ruins it for me. Awd will be north of 4000lbs and probably closer to 4100lbs

That defeats the purpose of what the M3/M4 are IMO. You have a M5 with less power basically
I thought the M340 was 3600lbs? Why would it weigh much more?

I think these cars will be more powerful than the M5 though. X3 M's are getting 800 awhp with a tune and turbo upgrade. M5's are limited to low 700's unless you want to spend 25k on an engine build, or bend your rods.
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      12-10-2020, 10:35 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacky Treehorn View Post
Have zero interest in 1/4 miles. Don't care how much hp it has over 500 really to be honest.

I do care how well-rounded the car is as a versatile, streetable daily driver that is very capable on road-courses and posts a competitive nurburgring time.


At some point in road racing, you need to balance power with what the chassis can handle aerodynamically and road-holding/traction at the physical limits....It doesn't make any logical sense to have a near 4000lb GT road car that does occasional road course track duty with 800hp that can't effectively put down power to the tarmac coming out of or going into turns, and can't road hold because it's too heavy at the limit. Adding more power to the tune of like 800-1000hp is just going to ruin the balance of the car. Are people really buying the M3 for drag racing or something?
I don't understand how more power ruins the balance of the car. Especially with AWD and modern tires, it's fine. My M5 is around 800+hp and feels incredible coming out of low speed corners in second gear. I raced shifter karts for years and that's the only thing that gives me a similar feeling. Just doing a slight slide out of a corner with all 4 wheels slipping/while accelerating HARD is a lot of fun. On a 2wd car it would be a lot to control, but you can always give it less throttle.
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      12-10-2020, 10:48 PM   #9
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Quote:
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I thought the M340 was 3600lbs?
From where did you get this info?
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      12-10-2020, 11:13 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gpdriver17 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by LSM View Post
The big weight more than the looks kinda ruins it for me. Awd will be north of 4000lbs and probably closer to 4100lbs

That defeats the purpose of what the M3/M4 are IMO. You have a M5 with less power basically
I thought the M340 was 3600lbs? Why would it weigh much more?

I think these cars will be more powerful than the M5 though. X3 M's are getting 800 awhp with a tune and turbo upgrade. M5's are limited to low 700's unless you want to spend 25k on an engine build, or bend your rods.
RWD M3 is 3890 lbs AWD has to add 150-200lbs

The days of tuning are numbered anyway

1) the ECU's on new BMW's are locked
2) BMW now checks parameters and knows when you flash or have a piggy even if back to stock and love voiding warranties on tuned cars
3) The weight is a problem for me.....
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      12-10-2020, 11:18 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanAutM3 View Post
Same here, zero interest on heavily modded 1/4 mile times.

I am looking for a fully warrantied dual use car for the 4-season daily drive and weekend track hobby, which is what the M3(4) design intent has always been about.
Pretty fair to say most people aren’t buying M cars for the same reason they used to a few generations back.

It’s strange how most performance enthusiasts these days just rave about quarter mile times and horsepower figures. I drove past a random mechanics shop the other day in my 991 GT3 (with loads of aftermarket aero that ultimately make it slower in a straight line, funny enough) when a dude screamed out “I’ll smoke you in the quarter mile in my Civic”, I politely grinned and said “that’s great!” But I don’t understand the obsession with horsepower and quarter mile times. More power is awesome, but it’s not the be all and all of things. I’m aware everyone owns their cars for different reasons, but horsepower numbers and quarter mile times ultimately boil down to how deep your wallet is, not how skilled you are at anything other than reacting to lights.

Whatever makes you happy, I guess
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      12-11-2020, 11:34 AM   #12
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what if I told you... the point of fast cars.... is to go fast? and also, if you love track cars get a GT3 or GT4
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      12-11-2020, 12:03 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AhsanU View Post
Pretty fair to say most people aren’t buying M cars for the same reason they used to a few generations back.

It’s strange how most performance enthusiasts these days just rave about quarter mile times and horsepower figures. I drove past a random mechanics shop the other day in my 991 GT3 (with loads of aftermarket aero that ultimately make it slower in a straight line, funny enough) when a dude screamed out “I’ll smoke you in the quarter mile in my Civic”, I politely grinned and said “that’s great!” But I don’t understand the obsession with horsepower and quarter mile times. More power is awesome, but it’s not the be all and all of things. I’m aware everyone owns their cars for different reasons, but horsepower numbers and quarter mile times ultimately boil down to how deep your wallet is, not how skilled you are at anything other than reacting to lights.

Whatever makes you happy, I guess
Yeah, they have changed a lot. I used to love light cars I could blast down twisty roads on or take to the track. A Mazda Miata was actually my favorite car, over the E36 and E46 M3. But I moved to a city where I'm not close to any good roads or race tracks. The best I can do is go fast when traffic opens up. So these days 0-60 and 1/4 mile make a car fun to me. I think a lot of people feel the same with traffic these days. It's not about proving I'm better than anyone else, it's just fun.
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      12-11-2020, 12:10 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gpdriver17 View Post
Yeah, they have changed a lot. I used to love light cars I could blast down twisty roads on or take to the track. A Mazda Miata was actually my favorite car, over the E36 and E46 M3. But I moved to a city where I'm not close to any good roads or race tracks. The best I can do is go fast when traffic opens up. So these days 0-60 and 1/4 mile make a car fun to me. I think a lot of people feel the same with traffic these days. It's not about proving I'm better than anyone else, it's just fun.
Look at videos of reviewers or ordinary folks, even seasoned track aces when they launch a car like the GTR or Tesla. What do they all have in common? A big smile, chuckle sometimes uncontrolled giggles. We might have different priorities for a car or care less about it but no car person is immune to this level of acceleration
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      12-11-2020, 12:18 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacky Treehorn View Post
Have zero interest in 1/4 miles. Don't care how much hp it has over 500 really to be honest.

I do care how well-rounded the car is as a versatile, streetable daily driver that is very capable on road-courses and posts a competitive nurburgring time.
This is an intellectually dishonest statement. There can not be a discussion of a performance vehicle without taking speed or acceleration into account or we would all be driving BRZ's or Mitata's. A competitive nurburgring time cannot be accomplished by a vehicle that does not perform well in the 1/4 therefore it matters to you. It's one thing to say you have zero interest in drag racing but another to say that 1/4 mile time doesn't matter because it absoultely factors in with we well-rounded performance car which is apparently important to you.
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      12-11-2020, 12:27 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whatnotsomuchf80 View Post
I see a lot of posts with people disheartened by the G80's weight, power, looks, etc. Many saying they'd rather get an M5 or even a GTR. For those of you with modded F80's out there, you know how easy it is to add massive power w downpipes and an E85 tune, let alone turbos and PI. For most, traction was the issue.

I personally think a highly modded *AWD* G80 should hit insane numbers as in high 2's on a 0-60 and 9's in the 1/4 mile. An M5 shouldn't go past stage 2 without worrying about rods, and GTRs need upgraded transmissions among other things. The new ZAF should be able to handle high torque loads, and no crank hub worries with the S58 engine. When the new AWD G80's come out w massive power gains it will be a massive straight line acceleration beast. For reference, please see new X3M gains on the S58.

Who else thinks we will see such numbers?
I hope your right!! Can't wait to add them to my KILL list Hopefully the tuning will happen fast, along with Turbos and Tranny upgrades. Then axles and so on and on and on
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      12-11-2020, 12:34 PM   #17
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It matters but is only part of the equation to a fast lap time. Finding cars with excellent chassis dynamics, that are quick and have some luxury features under 2 tons is getting harder to find. Specially in the sub 100k price point. That actually matters to some people.

It’s easier to be quick in quarter then a road course, and many AWD even RWD cars are absolute monsters in the 1/4 so noting new IMHO. To that point an M5 would destroy the G80, but the weight is ridiculous. These cars just keep getting larger and larger the AMG sedans look like SUVs.

Last edited by irunalot; 12-11-2020 at 12:40 PM..
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      12-11-2020, 12:46 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gpdriver17 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by AhsanU View Post
Pretty fair to say most people aren’t buying M cars for the same reason they used to a few generations back.

It’s strange how most performance enthusiasts these days just rave about quarter mile times and horsepower figures. I drove past a random mechanics shop the other day in my 991 GT3 (with loads of aftermarket aero that ultimately make it slower in a straight line, funny enough) when a dude screamed out “I’ll smoke you in the quarter mile in my Civic”, I politely grinned and said “that’s great!” But I don’t understand the obsession with horsepower and quarter mile times. More power is awesome, but it’s not the be all and all of things. I’m aware everyone owns their cars for different reasons, but horsepower numbers and quarter mile times ultimately boil down to how deep your wallet is, not how skilled you are at anything other than reacting to lights.

Whatever makes you happy, I guess
Yeah, they have changed a lot. I used to love light cars I could blast down twisty roads on or take to the track. A Mazda Miata was actually my favorite car, over the E36 and E46 M3. But I moved to a city where I'm not close to any good roads or race tracks. The best I can do is go fast when traffic opens up. So these days 0-60 and 1/4 mile make a car fun to me. I think a lot of people feel the same with traffic these days. It's not about proving I'm better than anyone else, it's just fun.
trust me everyone gets enjoyment today out of street acceleration from stop to stop. For all the big talk I bet hardly many people here track their cars that often. And on the street I prefer AWD for better traction and honestly safety
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      12-11-2020, 12:49 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irunalot View Post
It matters but is only part of the equation to a fast lap time. Finding cars with excellent chassis dynamics, that are quick and have some luxury features under 2 tons is getting harder to find. Specially in the sub 100k price point. That actually matters to some people.

It's easier to be quick in quarter then a road course, and many AWD even RWD cars are absolute monsters in the 1/4 so noting new IMHO. To that point an M5 would destroy the G80, but the weight is ridiculous. These cars just keep getting larger and larger the AMG sedans look like SUVs.
how would an M5 destroy a highly tuned AWD G80? The M5 can't go past 700's hp without bending a rod (unless you do a $60k engine build) v the S58 engine can probably handle a lot more. And the weight argument is wrong- figures are exaggerated for the G80 bc those are fully loaded with options. I plan on ordering no extra tech options, adding CF bucket seats, ceramic brakes, lightweight wheels etc
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      12-11-2020, 12:51 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whatnotsomuchf80 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by irunalot View Post
It matters but is only part of the equation to a fast lap time. Finding cars with excellent chassis dynamics, that are quick and have some luxury features under 2 tons is getting harder to find. Specially in the sub 100k price point. That actually matters to some people.

It's easier to be quick in quarter then a road course, and many AWD even RWD cars are absolute monsters in the 1/4 so noting new IMHO. To that point an M5 would destroy the G80, but the weight is ridiculous. These cars just keep getting larger and larger the AMG sedans look like SUVs.
how would an M5 destroy a highly tuned AWD G80? The M5 can't go past 700's hp without bending a rod (unless you do a $60k engine build) v the S58 engine can probably handle a lot more. And the weight argument is wrong- figures are exaggerated for the G80 bc those are fully loaded with options. I plan on ordering no extra tech options, adding CF bucket seats, ceramic brakes, lightweight wheels etc
Best of luck to you, as you seem to know what you are doing.
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      12-11-2020, 01:14 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irunalot View Post
It matters but is only part of the equation to a fast lap time. Finding cars with excellent chassis dynamics, that are quick and have some luxury features under 2 tons is getting harder to find. Specially in the sub 100k price point. That actually matters to some people.

It’s easier to be quick in quarter then a road course, and many AWD even RWD cars are absolute monsters in the 1/4 so noting new IMHO. To that point an M5 would destroy the G80, but the weight is ridiculous. These cars just keep getting larger and larger the AMG sedans look like SUVs.
I think weight isn't such a big issue with tires these days, or maybe I've just slowly gotten used to it. Even an X3M with r compound tires could probably pull over 1g on a skid pad. I have no complains with my M5s ability to change direction, stop, accelerate, or hold a corner.
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      12-11-2020, 02:28 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by heavyD^2 View Post
This is an intellectually dishonest statement. There can not be a discussion of a performance vehicle without taking speed or acceleration into account or we would all be driving BRZ's or Mitata's. A competitive nurburgring time cannot be accomplished by a vehicle that does not perform well in the 1/4 therefore it matters to you. It's one thing to say you have zero interest in drag racing but another to say that 1/4 mile time doesn't matter because it absoultely factors in with we well-rounded performance car which is apparently important to you.
Take your new M3 and add your tunes, downpipes, bigger turbos. Get yourself 900hp. 3900lb car. It's my personal opinion that a 900hp M3 will not be the most versatile, well rounded vehicle anymore. It takes on a different character....it may be faster in the 1/4 mile than the original car, but it's no longer a balanced and well rounded vehicle in my opinion. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but I've been down this road before....and just because you have more horsepower and run faster 1/4 miles does not mean you run faster road-course times. It doesn't necessarily work that way. You do reach a point where the car can no longer effectively use that power unless you are using it in a straight line. Now if drag racing is your thing, have at it.

I also come from a motorcycle background. The guys with lower powered bikes often times would be turning better laps than dudes with these insane liter bikes. The liter bike has more power, more straight line speed....but they couldn't even tap into that power or use it. We use to make fun of those guys because their tires would have a giant flat spot in the center because all they do it go fast in a straight line....some of us don't view that as well rounded and prefer to use the full extent of the motor as it was intended.
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