04-10-2023, 09:18 AM | #1 |
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CCB brakes on track
Anyone with extensive tracking experience with CCBs?
First 3 days of Nürburgring and I realize the disadvantages. Mainly because this car is too heavy. The brakes get too hot and the pads smear. After 15 minutes fast laps the brakes started to groan. Braking performance is still great but don't think it's sustainable. Wondering if anyone tried Pagid RSC1 pads? |
04-10-2023, 06:18 PM | #2 | |
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Unfortunately I am guessing the Nurburgring with its very long configuration is bound to be a CCBS killer.
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04-11-2023, 01:29 AM | #3 | |
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However, I would still feel more comfortable with higher heat resistant pads, so hope someone has tried those out. I would still not track the car extensively, of course. |
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04-11-2023, 06:05 AM | #5 | |
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04-11-2023, 06:36 AM | #6 | |
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Everyone knows what happens with iron stock brakes after first 10-15 minutes, you have to continuously adjust your braking points because they start to behave differently. The main point is financially unsustainable, so yes - a few laps on Nordschleife per month is maximum I will do with this car. And I will avoid any GP circuits, especially Zandvoort with a lot of braking and next to none cooling. |
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04-14-2023, 02:49 AM | #7 | |
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I used 16 set of carbon ceramic brakes on my 675lt When there is no iron brake option available with pagid RSC1. let alone other cars that I drove intensively on the track. the only point you might argue and get away with it is the weight. with proper brake compound and cooling. iron rotor last way longer. and the brake feeling is consistent. often time, brake failure cased by brake fluid boil, without proper cooling, CCB or iron rotor brake will over heat no matter what. |
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04-16-2023, 04:57 AM | #8 | |
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Secondly you can get https://www.speedengineering.de/prod...2-komplettset/ which will provide more direct cooling. Like others have said CCBs are cost prohibited for track work. Better to use steels Any brakes on track can be killed in a days work... |
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PLF693767.50 Jackie Chiles999.50 |
04-16-2023, 05:23 AM | #9 | |
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It's a nice looking kit by the way. Could be very well worth getting, regardless. |
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04-16-2023, 06:35 AM | #10 | |
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04-29-2023, 11:33 AM | #11 | |
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I might have some tips for you as I experienced something similar. This is my first post so bear with me.. On my first trackday CCBs worked great just like you mentioned, but I completely destroyed/smeared front OEM brake pads and had to clean the rotor from the inside + holes etc.. (those pads certainly cannot take a lot of heat, the pad might even be burning at some point if you drive real hard on short tracks, my mechanic said he saw burned paint inside the caliper) Before my second trackday which happened today, I installed: - the cooling kit from speed engineering that is mentioned above. It does not fit perfectly to Xdrive car with ceramics, as it had been created for RWD with steel. My mechanic had to cut a bit of plastic etc. but managed to fit it. Other option is to get it custom made, but this is doable for now. - Endless CCD attack brake pads for front. It is a bit of pain to get them, as many dealers of Endless dont even know that Endless manufacture this ceramic compound for G82 M4, but they do. Just one of 3 dealers managed to secure them, so dont get discouraged.. Code for the pads is: EIP328CCDA if you are interested. They might make even more aggresive compound called EIP328CCDR but I am not sure. - steel brake lines And the result is very good. They run a lot cooler. After cooldown lap brakes are not hot at all. Braking is extremely good, no fade. This pad works very well and does not smear, rotor looks a lot better after trackday than with OEM pad. I still have majority of pad in place, which is pleasant to see after the OEM dissapeared .. I am convinced that with this combination, the life of rotors will be longer, and we can enjoy the benefits of CCBs and decrease their drawbacks a bit. FYI, One EU/UK website also offers replacement rotors for about 2700 per piece (here) |
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04-29-2023, 05:43 PM | #12 | |
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Sounds like that is what I need. Basically, for moderate track use, I should be find with just the pads. I second the fact that the stock pads are the ultimate culprit and run very hot. |
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04-29-2023, 08:58 PM | #13 | |
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04-30-2023, 01:15 PM | #14 | |
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I read here that bleeding is a pain, but I am not going to replace braking liquid. I feel that better pads are going to be plenty for my purposes. |
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04-30-2023, 04:21 PM | #15 |
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Nope, not there yet. But there should be some clips of way better drivers with g80 on Nordschleife on youtube. Mischa Charoudin drove a g80 on Nürburgring, for example.
I don't think my laps would be meaningful as I am far from a Nürburgring expert and still learning at a bit over 100 laps. |
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04-30-2023, 06:12 PM | #16 | |
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05-01-2023, 06:07 AM | #17 | |
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You absolutely need to flush the brake fluid at a minimum of every 6 months if you are going to track your car monthly. If you only do one or two events a year, then you're probably OK with an annual brake bleed, preferably right before an event so that it's fresh. If you can afford to buy this car and can afford to run it on the track, then you can afford to have the brakes bled by a shop with the proper equipment. Don't get cheap when it comes to tires and brakes.
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05-01-2023, 07:31 AM | #18 | |
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I track my m2c for years with brake fluid change every 2 years which works fine. Don't forget we're talking about Nürburgring Nordschleife and not a GP track. If you generally know what you're doing, brakes don't overheat here as much as on short tracks and you can safely do a couple of days per month without much wear, and you definitely don't get as much water condensation. As long as you have proper pads. For this regime, heat resistant pads is normally all people need and that's the majority of folks who do tourist drives on NS. |
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05-01-2023, 08:24 PM | #19 |
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I track my car approx once a month from march to sep and I do flush the brake fluid every 6 months. I have so far had the dealer do it and it is not cost prohibitive. Approx $250 per flush. Cheap insurance to make sure your brakes work IMO. Never driven the ring but not sure what about it makes brake fluid less hygroscopic?
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05-02-2023, 01:43 AM | #20 | |
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I also upgraded the brake fluid for a better one as others have mentioned, no issues with that either. |
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05-02-2023, 03:16 AM | #21 | |
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On the NS you don't normally overheat the brake fluid if you do single laps with subsequent cooldown. Unless you are completely clueless, but then no amount of fresh brake fluid is going to help you. This is a very special track and it doesn't forgive incompetent driving style. |
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05-02-2023, 03:17 AM | #22 | |
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