[BRAKE!]

Originally Posted by BMWRacer523

that was my experience running with some GT3s at the track. Not off the line but coming off a 65mph corner onto a long straight I could easily pass GT3s in my Xdrive. At first I was a bit shocked given the weight difference but the gearing makes sense, could have been the pcar drivers pussyfooting it too lol

This makes sense to me. If you kept the FI car in boost, it will deliver a ton more torque than a NA motor in the GT3. Also keeping in mind 4 wheel drive that will put all that power down and blast out of a corner at exit.

[BMWRacer523]

Originally Posted by BRAKE!

This makes sense to me. If you kept the FI car in boost, it will deliver a ton more torque than a NA motor in the GT3. Also keeping in mind 4 wheel drive that will put all that power down and blast out of a corner at exit.

yeah the awd pretty much slingshots the car out of the corner. having driven and raced rwd cars for years its pretty amazing. If I could get one, I would still prefer the GT3 though, just for the better handling and steering. BMW did a great job on the g8x suspension but in quick transitions you can definitely feel the weight of the car.

[Custom Install]

Originally Posted by FrozenGT

They did perform a rip from second gear.

just because something cost more and is prettier to the eye doesn't mean that it's better and this is what Porsche owners need to understand.

If you do research on BMW history and Porsche history, Bmw has been struggling because they do not have a big brother pouring tons of money into research and development like Porsche. Porsche, we're by themselves. They will be behind Bmw at this point.. This is not upset anyone I'm just sharing with you. I predict in the next 6 to 8 years Bmw will pass Porsche if Bmw gets her head back in the game start developing proper road cars and stop trying to cater to all the weirdos who buy $2000 sneakers and throw them in the trash..

I believe that they are seeing the effects of improper leadership in the M-Division and board division with the direction that they have taken. I think that there's going be a big turn around with Bmw and they're going get back to being the ultimate driving machine.


Remember, everything is happening right now at Bmw was voted on years and years ago before they went into production.

I agree regarding the money pot Porsche has access to, however I wish BMW would concentrate more on the M brand engineering. They could start by paying homage to all of us instead of directing money into these adverts that feature the young, hip generation that frankly I haven't seen behind the wheel of any M car, ever.
They could have (and should have) made a CSL that was a statement, something that without a doubt would stand its own ground and apart from the subjective aesthetics of it was M showing what 50 years of engineering delivers.
I have no doubt it's a great car, but it's not faster than my bog standard xdrive Gxx platform in the real world.
It should have delivered on both fronts, road and track.
And then some ….

[G30M]

got a 6 yr old to code launch control

[G30M]

and turbo > NA ?

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by FrozenGT

They did perform a rip from second gear.

Yes, but at a lower speed and the BMW was also in 2nd. At 40mph, the GT3 should have been in 1st. That being said, it would likely not change the outcome, but the CSL would not be that far ahead.

Originally Posted by FrozenGT

just because something cost more and is prettier to the eye doesn't mean that it's better and this is what Porsche owners need to understand.

If you do research on BMW history and Porsche history, Bmw has been struggling because they do not have a big brother pouring tons of money into research and development like Porsche. Porsche, we're by themselves. They will be behind Bmw at this point.. This is not upset anyone I'm just sharing with you. I predict in the next 6 to 8 years Bmw will pass Porsche if Bmw gets her head back in the game start developing proper road cars and stop trying to cater to all the weirdos who buy $2000 sneakers and throw them in the trash..

I believe that they are seeing the effects of improper leadership in the M-Division and board division with the direction that they have taken. I think that there's going be a big turn around with Bmw and they're going get back to being the ultimate driving machine.


Remember, everything is happening right now at Bmw was voted on years and years ago before they went into production.

You have your history wrong. Porsche was an independent company. They got out of a bad financial position by making SUVs, and it is that money that allowed them to "pour" cash into their sports cars. They were in fact so financially successful and sitting on so much cash that they almost bought the VW group. However, in a turn of events, it ended up the other way around in that infamous "battle of the cousins" (Porsche vs Piech). Porsche is now a cash cow for the VW group, not the other way around.

[Custom Install]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Yes, but at a lower speed and the BMW was also in 2nd. At 40mph, the GT3 should have been in 1st. That being said, it would likely not change the outcome, but the CSL would not be that far ahead.

You have your history wrong. Porsche was in independent company. They got out of a bad financial position by making SUVs, and it is that money that allowed them to "pour" cash into their sports cars. They were in fact so financially successful and sitting on so much cash that they almost bought the VW group. However, in a turn of events, it ended up the other way around in that infamous "battle of the cousins" (Porsche vs Piech). Porsche is now a cash cow for the VW group, not the other way around.

Yes your 100% correct regarding the Porsche SUV situation.
Regarding Porsche being in control of a mother company that owns this:

Volkswagen, Volkswagen Commercial Vehicles, ŠKODA, SEAT, CUPRA, Audi, Lamborghini, Bentley, Porsche and Ducati.

Are you sure?

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by Custom Install

Yes your 100% correct regarding the Porsche SUV situation.
Regarding Porsche being in control of a mother company that owns this:

Volkswagen, Volkswagen Commercial Vehicles, ŠKODA, SEAT, CUPRA, Audi, Lamborghini, Bentley, Porsche and Ducati.

Are you sure?

Yes, it almost happened. But as I stated, it ended up the other way around. The Porsche / Piech family own ~53% of VW.

[Custom Install]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Yes, it almost happened. But as I stated, it ended up the other way around. The Porsche / Piech family own ~53% of VW.

Ok.
Porsche have imo concentrated on the development of engineering, they are masters of this.
BMW have fallen behind with their push for social media and marketing, they were close in the early years and now the difference is clear.
Porsche make an engineering statement then social media follows suit, BMW are the exact opposite.

[AlexFL]

Porsche’s sales revenue and operating profit is less than 10% of VW AG’s entire revenue and profit.

[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Yes, but at a lower speed and the BMW was also in 2nd. At 40mph, the GT3 should have been in 1st. That being said, it would likely not change the outcome, but the CSL would not be that far ahead.

You have your history wrong. Porsche was in independent company. They got out of a bad financial position by making SUVs, and it is that money that allowed them to "pour" cash into their sports cars. They were in fact so financially successful and sitting on so much cash that they almost bought the VW group. However, in a turn of events, it ended up the other way around in that infamous "battle of the cousins" (Porsche vs Piech). Porsche is now a cash cow for the VW group, not the other way around.

And how/where did the Cayenne/Macan come about? By taking a VW platform and VW/Audi engine. They might not be direct beneficiaries of a larger company, in this case VW, but like you said, their SUVs helped Porsche get to where they are today because they had VW lend them a platform and engine to brand a Cayenne/Macan. Who knows if it was even possible for Porsche to make their own platform and for it to be financially feasible for the Cayenne and Macan.

BMW on the other hand has to R&D everything and try achieve economies of scale by lending their resources to MINI and Rolls Royce.

You can see the difference in company structure. A truly independent company who's business is just cars vs subsidiaries and other Marques that have other businesses outside of passenger cars.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

And how/where did the Cayenne/Macan come about? By taking a VW platform and VW/Audi engine. They might not be direct beneficiaries of a larger company, in this case VW, but like you said, their SUVs helped Porsche get to where they are today because they had VW lend them a platform and engine to brand a Cayenne/Macan. Who knows if it was even possible for Porsche to make their own platform and for it to be financially feasible for the Cayenne and Macan.

BMW on the other hand has to R&D everything and try achieve economies of scale by lending their resources to MINI and Rolls Royce.

You can see the difference in company structure. A truly independent company who's business is just cars vs subsidiaries and other Marques that have other businesses outside of passenger cars.

The first Cayenne was the result of a joint venture between VW and Porsche (the Touareg on the VW side) well before the companies were fully fused in 2012. Porsche has very solid engineering expertise (engineering is the foundation of Porsche, not passenger car sales), which VW benefited from this joint venture. It is the Cayenne that brought Porsche out of its financial woes. The Macan came a decade later.

[IDKBRO]

Am I the only one who finds this to be extremely pathetic ? Lol
I obviously love GT3 and it's my dream
But it's not a 0-60 car , it's not a 1/2 mile car either

It's a 60-130mph hold on to your balls on the track car and yet still takes the CSL on the drag. I expected so much better honestly , at least our x drives will give it a run for its money

[2011ninja]

Originally Posted by BRAKE!

Idk if he can be sure about it, but I do think a X drive comp g8x should beat a GT3 off the line.

Regardless, if I had a choice between the 2 cars, I'd go for the gt3 hands down. It's just so much more than the speed, the experience in it can't be matched. Recently was in a 991.1 gt3 and blown away at the engine note, handling and the PDK. Can't imagine how amazing the 992 gt3 is

Yeah me too.


I'll take a 2023 Porsche 992 GT3

[Sedan_Clan]

For everybody claiming they'd take the Porsche, why are you not driving 991 GT3's, 992 Carrera S' or GTS', etc.? Those are all attainable. It's always interesting how many people are quick to bring up the P-Car but are largely unwilling to actually buy the P-Car.

[Custom Install]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

The first Cayenne was the result of a joint venture between VW and Porsche (the Touareg on the VW side) well before the companies were fully fused in 2012. Porsche has very solid engineering expertise (engineering is the foundation of Porsche, not passenger car sales), which VW benefited from this joint venture. It is the Cayenne that brought Porsche out of its financial woes. The Macan came a decade later.

With this understood, it makes no difference to the CSL outcome. We're not talking about the birth of an entirely new 'one off performance car' and all the inherent costs attached.
The stock Gxx already went through the process, it's an incredible platform to build on.
What hit me today when I watched the Car wow video was exactly what I felt back in the Fxx days.
It's got to perform in the real world first, surely, before you move on and make a statement about it.
The GT3 has weight and engine placement dialled in, so how can BMW think that a RWD, front engine heavier car makes sense enough to put itself in that position. Remember the F82 GTS with the water tank in the boot that didn't work at all, surely they should have learned that it's got to be either AWD or a car with weight (engine) at the rear?

[Custom Install]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

For everybody claiming they'd take the Porsche, why are you not driving 991 GT3's, 992 Carrera S' or GTS', etc.? Those are all attainable. It's always interesting how many people are quick to bring up the P-Car but are largely unwilling to actually buy the P-Car.

After watching that video, I ask myself the same question.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by Custom Install

With this understood, it makes no difference to the CSL outcome. We're not talking about the birth of an entirely new 'one off performance car' and all the inherent costs attached.
The stock Gxx already went through the process, it's an incredible platform to build on.
What hit me today when I watched the Car wow video was exactly what I felt back in the Fxx days.
It's got to perform in the real world first, surely, before you move on and make a statement about it.
The GT3 has weight and engine placement dialled in, so how can BMW think that a RWD, front engine heavier car makes sense enough to put itself in that position. Remember the F82 GTS with the water tank in the boot that didn't work at all, surely they should have learned that it's got to be either AWD or a car with weight (engine) at the rear?

As I have stated previously, I don't even see the G82 CSL and 992 GT3 as direct competitors, as was the case with the F8X GTS and 991.1 GT3. The 992 GTS with lightweight package is the better matched rival to the G8X CSL.

[Custom Install]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

I am not the one that brought it up...

But as I have stated previously, I don't even see the G82 CSL and 992 GT3 as direct competitors, as was the case with the F8X GTS and 991.1 GT3. The 992 GTS with lightweight package is the better matched rival to the G8X CSL.

Sorry I was just replying in general, ignore the quote.

[TargaM2]

These results are no surprise when you replace a DCT with a torque converter slush box.

[SocalBM]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

For everybody claiming they'd take the Porsche, why are you not driving 991 GT3's, 992 Carrera S' or GTS', etc.? Those are all attainable. It's always interesting how many people are quick to bring up the P-Car but are largely unwilling to actually buy the P-Car.

Because this is the internet and people don't usually have as much money as they claim (nor knowledge, experience, etc).

[Arcades]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

For everybody claiming they'd take the Porsche, why are you not driving 991 GT3's, 992 Carrera S' or GTS', etc.? Those are all attainable. It's always interesting how many people are quick to bring up the P-Car but are largely unwilling to actually buy the P-Car.

Well, they will find out after seeing the market and the markup lol I don't know the situation in the EU and how the market is there but the markup will push it out for a lot of people. Average markup for the 992.1 GT3 right now is 80k, it used to be 100k.

As for the video... yeah it is fairly pointless. The entire situation was said during the F8x generation vs the .1/.2 GT3 and it is still the same here. AWD is there to offset the fact that the G8x cars are heavier and it shows at certain points but when push comes to shove, a lighter car will have better balance.

All of the whole VW and Porsche thing btw it is a complete and utter mess. Porsche-Piech family has majority voting and technically owns VW Group that owns Porsche (the car company). It is the Porsche family that pushed for F1 entry (they pulled out) and I believe recently the Porsche family has also bought (back?) into the Porsche (car company) and pushed Porsche IPO public.