[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by bm323

Does your F8X have better steering than the E9X?

In my personal opinion, I prefer the F8X's steering. I honestly don't understand the hype over the older car's steering.

I remember a distinct moment when I asked myself, "What is the hype all about?" I had a '14 AW F30 6MT for awhile. Prior to that I owned a '11.5 AW ZCP 6MT M3. My ex-gf still had the '11 AW 6MT 135i M-Sport we purchased for her when we were together. She asked me to take care of her car while she went back to Wisconsin to visit her mother. At the time, the steering feel threads were running rampant on the forums. I jumped into her 135i and found the steering cumbersome and far too heavy/poorly weighted for my tastes, especially during low speed maneuvers. I do realize that I had adjusted to the F30, but steering feel was never a point of praise as it pertained to my E9X nor her 135i.

[dmk08]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Well in terms of performance there's a night and day difference between the E9X and the F8X. I suspect that'll continue with the introduction of the G8X. As for the subtleties, that's an individual thing. I miss absolutely nothing about the three E9X M3's I owned. The F8X was better in every measurable and immeasurable way....for me. I do occasionally miss one of my E46 M3's: my '05 IB ZCP with Speed Cloth, TEIN coil overs and OEM CSL CF center console and door panels.......but it's merely emotional. I wouldn't give up my current F82 to have that car back in my possession again.

Every way man? Come on. You can say with a straight face that the F80 was better sounding to you than an e92?

[dmk08]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

In my personal opinion, I prefer the F8X's steering. I honestly don't understand the hype over the older car's steering.

I remember a distinct moment when I asked myself, "What is the hype all about?" I had a '14 AW F30 6MT for awhile. Prior to that I owned a '11.5 AW ZCP 6MT M3. My ex-gf still had the '11 AW 6MT 135i M-Sport we purchased for her when we were together. She asked me to take care of her car while she went back to Wisconsin to visit her mother. At the time, the steering feel threads were running rampant on the forums. I jumped into her 135i and found the steering cumbersome and far too heavy/poorly weighted for my tastes, especially during low speed maneuvers. I do realize that I had adjusted to the F30, but steering feel was never a point of praise as it pertained to my E9X nor her 135i.

The F8x is just numb steering. I heard the CS is better (heard that about the zcp too before I owned one) but I doubt it. For whatever reason that is how BMW tunes their EPS.

“Heavy and poorly weighted” so you mean “natural”?

[bm323]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

In my personal opinion, I prefer the F8X's steering. I honestly don't understand the hype over the older car's steering.

I remember a distinct moment when I asked myself, "What is the hype all about?" I had a '14 AW F30 6MT for awhile. Prior to that I owned a '11.5 AW ZCP 6MT M3. My ex-gf still had the '11 AW 6MT 135i M-Sport we purchased for her when we were together. She asked me to take care of her car while she went back to Wisconsin to visit her mother. At the time, the steering feel threads were running rampant on the forums. I jumped into her 135i and found the steering cumbersome and far too heavy/poorly weighted for my tastes, especially during low speed maneuvers. I do realize that I had adjusted to the F30, but steering feel was never a point of praise as it pertained to my E9X nor her 135i.

Are you comparing F3X's steering with your 11.5 M3's steering and found F3X's steering better? And 135i's?

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by dmk08

Every way man? Come on. You can say with a straight face that the F80 was better sounding to you than an e92?

Sound is not a component that heavily impacts my experience. I haven't had any issues with the sound(s) of any BMW I've owned (...14 so far). The E9X sounded good, but the F8X doesn't sound bad to me. In fact, it sounds similar to the E46, which I also liked when everybody on the forums expressed vitriol. The E9X is the most forgettable M3 in my opinion. I've owned three of them and I just couldn't emotionally attach to them in the same way I did with my E46 M3's and F8X M4's.

Originally Posted by dmk08

The F8x is just numb steering. I heard the CS is better (heard that about the zcp too before I owned one) but I doubt it. For whatever reason that is how BMW tunes their EPS.

"Heavy and poorly weighted" so you mean "natural"?

One could argue that, but it doesn't necessarily make driving more enjoyable. If that's the argument, we might as well go completely natural with unassisted racks. That would make driving absolutely entertaining, right?!?

Originally Posted by bm323

Are you comparing F3X's steering with your 11.5 M3's steering and found F3X's steering better? And 135i's?

I think I was pretty clear, no?!?! In a back-to-back comparison I preferred the steering in F3X over the 135i, especially as it pertained to low speed maneuvers. My point in mentioning my M3 is because I found no issues with the F3X's steering despite having come from the M3. I hope that clarified the gist of what I was attempting to convey.

[dmk08]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Sound is not a component that heavily impacts my experience. I haven't had any issues with the sound(s) of any BMW I've owned (...14 so far). The E9X sounded good, but the F8X doesn't sound bad to me. In fact, it sounds similar to the E46, which I also liked when everybody on the forums expressed vitriol. The E9X is the most forgettable M3 in my opinion. I've owned three of them and I just couldn't emotionally attach to them in the same way I did with my E46 M3's and F8X M4's.



One could argue that, but it doesn't necessarily make driving more enjoyable.



I think I was pretty clear, no?!?! In a back-to-back comparison I preferred the steering in F3X over the 135i, especially as it pertained to low speed maneuvers. My point in mentioning my M3 is because I found no issues with the F3X's steering despite having come from the M3. I hope that clarified the gist of what I was attempting to convey.

I agree not everyone cares about natural steering feel its very evident on here. Sound and natural feel are a lot of the experience to me. Obviously very subjective.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by dmk08

I agree not everyone cares about natural steering feel its very evident on here. Sound and natural feel are a lot of the experience to me. Obviously very subjective.

If natural is the goal, then you'd prefer a completely unassisted rack then?!?!

[dmk08]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

If natural is the goal, then you'd prefer a completely unassisted rack then?!?!

I used to drive an F200 custom without power steering back in my early years. Great for jacked forearms.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by dmk08

I used to drive an F200 custom without power steering back in my early years. Great for jacked forearms.

Haha! I mean, yeah, I get that. I'm in my 40's, so I remember completely unassisted racks too. I'll pass on that natural feel. Lol! With that said, I don't want an over-boosted rack either.

[DCG]

Originally Posted by Donolotti

Coming from an F82 M4 I still don't like the grills and the hood looks like a dodge charger hood. Maybe mods one day will help but I feel like they missed the mark on this. I like progression of design based on function but to keep the design staples like the power dome hood, quad exhaust, wide fenders, rear window kink and the side profile of the car having one shoulder line. Not to mention the car is 400 lbs heavier than the last M3/M4. And last you can't get a comp with a manual... My M4 was comp and manual. BMW talks about giving options and they do but they are forgetting the true enthusiasts. I have been into BMW since my dad had a m coupe with the s54 and manual. Also I am 27 years old and if it was meant to target me they did a poor job. Would rather seen a modern take on traditional design features.

Absolutely, why is there a Dodge Charger hood on the new M3 and M4? It makes NO sense, nor does it look right! The Power Dome hood is so cool looking especially with the functional air outlet. Function over form, if it's not functional it has no need to be there, meaning the fake side vents!

I feel the new M3 an M4 are going to be beasts, and I advocated and requested M xDrive. But why are these cars increasingly getting bigger and bigger to the 5 Series size, bigger is not always better. And the additional 400 pounds - is that correct, that cannot be all of the xDrives weight distribution.

[DCG]

As a fellow Designer it's hard to listen to design advice from a guy who has useless fake zippers on his shoulders and goofy glasses on, but anything to fix this hideous front bumper issue. I had to call-out the fake shoulder zippers because they remind me of the M3 & M4 fake side air vents 😤 totally useless.

You have to think of everything when designing! Functionality and Style!!! Or should I say functionality with style, Or style with functionality?

He didn't think of U.S. license plates are global license plates. Some States you have to have them on, some States you can take them off. Or if you like me, you do whatever the hell you want.

[Fishbuddy]

Serious question... what year would the LCI M3 potentially occur?

[Flamingi]

Originally Posted by fishfinder333

Serious question... what year would the LCI M3 potentially occur?

LCI is after 3.5 years, new model after 7 years.

But of course there are exceptions (e.g. F15 was 5 years until a new model and skipping an LCI).

[DCG]

I have to admit I used to like Adrian van Hooydonk's design concepts when he worked under Chris Bangle, but now as BMW Group's Design Director I think he is failing unfortunately.

Something has happened within the Design Team or it is the suits ok'ing and choosing lame designs. They're going in too many different directions, not consistent. It's time for BMW start looking for a new Design Director.

[speedmaster20d]

Originally Posted by Karmic Man

May be what the M4 should looks like...now the whole legacy of BMW M GmbH rests on the upcoming G87 M2

this works reminds me of the CSL, this captures the soul in a modern shell

why? why can't you make this instead of that hideous thing ?

[Bimmr7]

Originally Posted by antzcrashing

so bmw decided to do a modern-retro throwback with the grill for 2021-2026 bread and butter 3 and 4 series? Bc heritage and old school is what the people want? Not buying it. Seems more like a me-too copy of the industry: Audi, Mercedes, Toyota and many other brands. Bmw like Porsche were hold-outs and made attractive cars in the recent gen, now bmw are just following.

If by people you mean the people of China then the answer is yes.

[dmk08]

Originally Posted by Flamingi

LCI is after 3.5 years, new model after 7 years.

But of course there are exceptions (e.g. F15 was 5 years until a new model and skipping an LCI).

F80 went through 16 LCI of the tail lights and 18 LCI of the headlights. Remember the M is coming out after the normal 3 series has already been out.

If the sales are low enough BMW will make a change sooner than later.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by fishfinder333

Serious question... what year would the LCI M3 potentially occur?

The G20/G21/G80 LCI is tentatively July 2022, roughly three and half years after the G20 SOP. The G81 should arrive at this time as well.

The G22/G23/G26/G82/G83 LCI is tentatively March 2024, roughly three and half years after the G22 SOP.

[DCG]

Is it BMW Group's Design Director Adrian van Hooydonk's flawed design direction, is it solely his fault? Or is it the suits and bean-counters okaying these poor design decisions??? Or is it all of the above?

Something has happened within BMW's Design Team and their philosophy and most importantly their design direction. Something has to give!

[Fishbuddy]

Originally Posted by dmk08

F80 went through 16 LCI of the tail lights and 18 LCI of the headlights. Remember the M is coming out after the normal 3 series has already been out.

If the sales are low enough BMW will make a change sooner than later.

I hoping for poor sales after the initial demand and they change that grill on the G80 asap. Fingers crossed!

[jkap27]

Originally Posted by fishfinder333

I hoping for poor sales after the initial demand and they change that grill on the G80 asap. Fingers crossed!

I dont see what they could change the grille to without changing the hood so I just can't see this happening. Theyre kind of all in on that look as the electric vehicles which don't even need grilles have a similar front end lol

[seis-speed]

Designer Frank Stephenson is not a fan.

At the ~ 21min mark.
https://www.bmwblog.com/2020/11/14/b...nk-stephenson/