[Poochie]

Originally Posted by ScullyD

I'm just quoting the item weight here:

https://www.bmwpartsdeal.com/parts/b...309378011.html

I'll find out from a dealer part dept what the actual weight is for 62309378011.

That's obviously a typo; the manual transmission weights 88lbs and that's a hunk of metal. I sincerely doubt a screen projector, which it's mostly made out of plastic bits weights anymore than 5lbs, if that..

[solstice]

Originally Posted by ScullyD

I'm just quoting the item weight here:

https://www.bmwpartsdeal.com/parts/b...309378011.html

I'll find out from a dealer part dept what the actual weight is for 62309378011.

A 60” rear projection Sony TV is 112 lbs, so yes this HUD weight seems a bit excessive

[Higgs Boson]

Originally Posted by ScullyD

I'm just quoting the item weight here:

https://www.bmwpartsdeal.com/parts/b...309378011.html

I'll find out from a dealer part dept what the actual weight is for 62309378011.

more like 1.33 pounds lol

[Hotflare]

Great car, but i feel they did "too much" in all the wrong areas and gave us a factory modded m4 thats a bit "ricey" in some aspects. Good attempt, but for the price alot would rather shoot for a p gt car...

Lets see what the future holds

[PLF69]

Originally Posted by Hotflare

Great car, but i feel they did "too much" in all the wrong areas and gave us a factory modded m4 thats a bit "ricey" in some aspects. Good attempt, but for the price alot would rather shoot for a p gt car...

Lets see what the future holds

I'm curious to know what you find ricey except the red stripping and maybe the frozen pain option ?

[nemex12]

I don´t like it at all. I can see the m3 e46 csl prices skyrocketing

[solstice]

Originally Posted by nemex12

I don´t like it at all. I can see the m3 e46 csl prices skyrocketing

The E46 CSL and E9 CSL we’re indeed light cars, absolutely and relatively (the E46 was as an example significantly lighter than the E36 M3). They were also properly fast on the track relative to all competition in the same segment and price bracket.

This new one is confusing. It’s said to not be a track focused car as the GTS but the aim is instead a lightweight street car. Is it though, in absolute or relative weight? It’s heavier than the F82 and 3650 lbs is substantial. The removal of the rear seats leave even more confusing, that’s a track car first move in my books.

So is it a failure? As a CSL I think yes but not as a top dog M car. The performance numbers are now so staggering that no one needs more on the street and on the track it’s a lot of speed to handle for likely 90% of the buyers. I see it as BMW’s 911 turbo but without rear seats. I think it’s likely fantastic but it ain’t the CSL cult car the shocks Porsche and the likes that some of us wanted it to be.

[Custom Install]

Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow

They are indeed Laser, you can read it clearly when it shows the rear lights in the video - that's just a goof by Chris

Exactly my point.
Come on, you'd have to be fully briefed before going into that recording.
These small thing are big things to Gxx owners as it's the subtle differences that'll count IMO.

[jpdchicago]

Originally Posted by solstice

I didn't say it was, I was commenting on the notion that more power wouldn't make the CSL faster around the ring because it's too heavy.

Yes, on that aspect you do have a point. You do need a lot more power to counteract weight.
Best is to loose as much bulk as you can.

[mbanck]

Originally Posted by solstice

The E46 CSL and E9 CSL we’re indeed light cars, absolutely and relatively (the E46 was as an example significantly lighter than the E36 M3). They were also properly fast on the track relative to all competition in the same segment and price bracket.

This new one is confusing. It’s said to not be a track focused car as the GTS but the aim is instead a lightweight street car. Is it though, in absolute or relative weight? It’s heavier than the F82 and 3650 lbs is substantial. The removal of the rear seats leave even more confusing, that’s a track car first move in my books.

So is it a failure? As a CSL I think yes but not as a top dog M car. The performance numbers are now so staggering that no one needs more on the street and on the track it’s a lot of speed to handle for likely 90% of the buyers. I see it as BMW’s 911 turbo but without rear seats. I think it’s likely fantastic but it ain’t the CSL cult car the shocks Porsche and the likes that some of us wanted it to be.

I think at this point they go with ~50 kg weight reduction == CS and ~100 kg weight reduction/rear seat delete == CSL without thinking too much about it. Everybody else can get the upcoming M3 CS, and the 2-3 people who could afford the M4 CSL, but need the rear seats - well sorry.

And after all, the 1000 are probably all taken already so further discussion about whether this care makes sense or not is somewhat moot.

[ScullyD]

Originally Posted by mbanck

I think at this point they go with ~50 kg weight reduction == CS and ~100 kg weight reduction/rear seat delete == CSL without thinking too much about it. Everybody else can get the upcoming M3 CS, and the 2-3 people who could afford the M4 CSL, but need the rear seats - well sorry.

And after all, the 1000 are probably all taken already so further discussion about whether this care makes sense or not is somewhat moot.

Cars are not getting lighter due to safety regulation. Comparing car weights and weight reduction to things in the 1970s or 20 years ago is no longer realistic.

The only weight they could have removed from this CSL model that they didn't remove was Comfort Access receivers, HUD screen (which we'll figure out the weight on). Additional carbon fiber body panels probably wouldn't have saved much more weight (a few pounds) but added significant cost. Lightweight interior door panels would have leaned more toward track day use. I recall them saving about 10 pounds on the e46, but who knows if it would have been the same here?

This car is very close to as light as they possibly could have gotten it and still had it be a street car first, track car second. Its still a CSLing of the base M4, which is a 4 series. M can't change the weight of these base cars.

[Chicane_]

^ well said. I expect the law of diminishing returns would really start kicking in beyond what BMW has already done to reduce weight.

Besides, nothing is stopping owners from ripping out the door panels, carpet and installing plexiglass side/rear windows etc if they're weight obsessed and really want that race car vibe.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by solstice

The E46 CSL and E9 CSL we’re indeed light cars, absolutely and relatively (the E46 was as an example significantly lighter than the E36 M3). They were also properly fast on the track relative to all competition in the same segment and price bracket.

This new one is confusing. It’s said to not be a track focused car as the GTS but the aim is instead a lightweight street car. Is it though, in absolute or relative weight? It’s heavier than the F82 and 3650 lbs is substantial. The removal of the rear seats leave even more confusing, that’s a track car first move in my books.

So is it a failure? As a CSL I think yes but not as a top dog M car. The performance numbers are now so staggering that no one needs more on the street and on the track it’s a lot of speed to handle for likely 90% of the buyers. I see it as BMW’s 911 turbo but without rear seats. I think it’s likely fantastic but it ain’t the CSL cult car the shocks Porsche and the likes that some of us wanted it to be.

I'll say it here again. I see the M4CSL as BMW's version of the 911 GTS with the lightweight package: Similar price point and performance; exact same market segment and intended use.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by ScullyD

I'm just quoting the item weight here:

https://www.bmwpartsdeal.com/parts/b...309378011.html

I'll find out from a dealer part dept what the actual weight is for 62309378011.

Definitely a typo or glitch. I went on Realoem.com to check, and they have the HUD unit you posted listed at 2,112.4kg and the F8X one at 1,451.48kg

[Chicane_]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

I'll say it here again. I see the M4CSL as BMW's version of the 911 GTS with the lightweight package: Similar price point and performance; exact same market segment and intended use.

I doubt many are cross shopping those cars. Rather, those who missed a CSL allocation are probably getting themselves in line for an M3 or M4 CS, not the Porsche.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by Chicane_

I doubt many are cross shopping those cars. Rather, those who missed a CSL allocation are probably getting themselves in line for an M3 or M4 CS, not the Porsche.

My point is that for the F82 GTS BMW was aiming for the 991.1 911-GT3 and AMG GT-S bracket (as stated in BMW launch material). With the G82CSL, they seem to be aiming for the 911 GTS bracket (particularly when specced with the lightweight package) and clearly not at the 911 turbo.

And you'd be surprised how many cross shop ///M and 911 .

[solstice]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

I'll say it here again. I see the M4CSL as BMW's version of the 911 GTS with the lightweight package: Similar price point and performance; exact same market segment and intended use.

Agreed, that’s even better as a P-car equivalent of this new CSL.

[Chicane_]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

My point is that for the F82 GTS BMW was aiming for the 991.1 911-GT3 and AMG GT-S bracket. With the G82CSL, they seem to be aiming for the 911 GTS bracket (particularly when specced with the lightweight package) and clearly not at the 911 turbo.

I don't think they were really 'aiming' at a Porsche model. Rather, they set their own weight, usability and performance targets and set out to achieve them. The result is the best of what their engineers could deliver within their prescribed cost constraints.

[solstice]

Originally Posted by Chicane_

I don't think they were really 'aiming' at a Porsche model. Rather, they set their own weight, usability and performance targets and set out to achieve them. The result is the best of what their engineers could deliver within their prescribed cost constraints.

Not what I heard from the grapevine. The initial target was the GT3. Take if for what it is.

[Chicane_]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

My point is that for the F82 GTS BMW was aiming for the 991.1 911-GT3 and AMG GT-S bracket (as stated in BMW launch material). With the G82CSL, they seem to be aiming for the 911 GTS bracket (particularly when specced with the lightweight package) and clearly not at the 911 turbo.

And you'd be surprised how many cross shop ///M and 911 .

Cross shopping between an M3 and a 911 Carrera is understandable. I think CSL buyers want a BMW so plan B won't be 911 GTS. My opinion anyhow

[Chicane_]

Originally Posted by solstice

Not what I heard from the grapevine. The initial target was the GT3. Take if for what it is.

Shocking it true. Seems amazing to me that their simulations would have shown a theoretical sub 7-min lap time with a -100kg +40hp G82.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by Chicane_

I don't think they were really 'aiming' at a Porsche model. Rather, they set their own weight, usability and performance targets and set out to achieve them. The result is the best of what their engineers could deliver within their prescribed cost constraints.

The "cost constraints" are defined by the desired sales price (and profit margin). The sales price is established to position it in a given market segment.