[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

i definitely lean toward conservative ... just not buying all the "well so and so didn't dispute these ridiculous renderings based on blurry photos of the car in full camo" haha. we shall see! I don't claim to know the answer but am against people who "know for certain" what it'll look like.

Still hopeful it looks good, large or small.

For what it's worth, there are a few photos where you can pretty clearly see the grills, even underneath the mesh camouflage.

[evanescent03]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

For what it's worth, there are a few photos where you can pretty clearly see the grills, even underneath the mesh camouflage.

Still hard to say if that's final tho you know? It's a mule still and the heavier camo'd bumpers do seem to be different than the newer photos ... I hope the newer suggestions are accurate but I'm still not placing any bets

[bobloblaw]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

Still hard to say if that's final tho you know? It's a mule still and the heavier camo'd bumpers do seem to be different than the newer photos ... I hope the newer suggestions are accurate but I'm still not placing any bets

The final design was probably finalized like 2 years ago man, it's gonna happen lol. Got one or two insiders on the forum that have already seen and confirmed it. At least our questions will be mostly answered in 2 weeks or sooner.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by bobloblaw

The final design was probably finalized like 2 years ago man, it's gonna happen lol. Got one or two insiders on the forum that have already seen and confirmed it. At least our questions will be mostly answered in 2 weeks or sooner.

This is my perspective as well. The insiders that we have on this forum have credibility for a reason, and I really can't remember a time when SCOTT26, for example, has been wrong or way off base, and I've been on this forum about 13 years now. We've been warned by him multiple times, and even still we have non-believers.

[Pentium]

BMW M is trolling everyone (I hope )

[Poochie]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

This is my perspective as well. The insiders that we have on this forum have credibility for a reason, and I really can't remember a time when SCOTT26, for example, has been wrong or way off base, and I've been on this forum about 13 years now. We've been warned by him multiple times, and even still we have non-believers.

It's not that I'm completely doubting either of you guys but I know how BMW gets down; they don't divert much from their current, going design language and no current BMW has a "Predator" grill, so I sincerely doubt the M4 will be an outlier.

I'm pretty sure I'm right and they just completely covered the design of the new M3/M4 because it's the crown jewel of their enthusiast line-up.

But if I'm wrong, I prefer water-based lube; it's all about the viscosity.

[bobloblaw]

Originally Posted by Poochie

It's not that I'm completely doubting either of you guys but I know how BMW gets down; they don't divert much from their current, going design language and no current BMW has a "Predator" grill, so I sincerely doubt the M4 will be an outlier.

I'm pretty sure I'm right and they just completely covered the design of the new M3/M4 because it's the crown jewel of their enthusiast line-up.

But if I'm wrong, I prefer water-based lube; it's all about the viscosity.

You are right in that they are using tricky cover ups and camo for the upcoming M3/4, but all signs are pointing to the big ol honkin grille. Nearly zero chance they'd put it on the regular 4er and not the M4.

It could be super risky though. On one hand, if you ruin the M3/4 and no one buys it, that is disastrous. On the other hand, it has such a strong name and history that people might buy it regardless, or be willing to accept a radical design.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Poochie

It's not that I'm completely doubting either of you guys but I know how BMW gets down; they don't divert much from their current, going design language and no current BMW has a "Predator" grill, so I sincerely doubt the M4 will be an outlier.

I'm pretty sure I'm right and they just completely covered the design of the new M3/M4 because it's the crown jewel of their enthusiast line-up.

But if I'm wrong, I prefer water-based lube; it's all about the viscosity.

Water based lube it is then. Get ready for that pounding.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by bobloblaw

You are right in that they are using tricky cover ups and camo for the upcoming M3/4, but all signs are pointing to the big ol honkin grille. Nearly zero chance they'd put it on the regular 4er and not the M4.

It could be super risky though. On one hand, if you ruin the M3/4 and no one buys it, that is disastrous. On the other hand, it has such a strong name and history that people might buy it regardless, or be willing to accept a radical design.

SCOTT26 answered that very question/concern when I asked if BMW would go back to a traditional design if the large grilled cars don't sell well. It's understandable that BMW is trying to spearhead design and is responding to their own market analysis, but it is a risky endeavor to us. It's too late to go back now though. The big grilled 4/M3/M4 is already upon us.

[clee1982]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

thing is ... the power is basically a tune so why lower it? That's annoying to me.

I think a stripper version (RWD, manual trans, manual seats!?, nice cloth seats, etc) should def be an option. I had a stripper '16 M3 I loved but if I had a little extra weight low down for option of AWD to have better all weather use (street or track), better launches (my 5 & 6yo love when I do "launch mode") etc I'd be all over it.

I think you should just be able to order the car a la carte. Pick your trans, pick M-AWD or RWD and then all the other stuff. All cars should be full 510hp or whatever they go with. Why is this so hard?

1. They don't think they should spend the resource to develop a manual that can handle it

2. You don't have enough traction without AWD already, why give you more power anyway...

[Uli_HH]

I beleave that Scott is right with his predictions! But the only thing, I don‘t understand is why also the M3 gets this design, if the only reason is to better distinguish the 4 series from the 3 series ... just because they have always done so, that the M3 share the front with the M3!?

[SCOTT26]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

This is my perspective as well. The insiders that we have on this forum have credibility for a reason, and I really can't remember a time when SCOTT26, for example, has been wrong or way off base, and I've been on this forum about 13 years now. We've been warned by him multiple times, and even still we have non-believers.

You are too kind.
But I have been wrong on some things. The industry is a complex system. You can decide something on a Friday only to come in on Monday to have it all undone.
The landscape is forever changing especially with the shifting change to Electric which will define design and engineering into the future.

[Miko M]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

You are too kind.
But I have been wrong on some things. The industry is a complex system. You can decide something on a Friday only to come in on Monday to have it all undone.
The landscape is forever changing especially with the shifting change to Electric which will define design and engineering into the future.

True, I see it many times when I do prototype for car industry.

I am surprised they didn't add 48V system

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by Uli_HH

But the only thing, I don‘t understand is why also the M3 gets this design... just because they have always done so, that the M3 share the front with the M4!?

My guess is that the reason they’ve always done this is so that they only have to design and test the M engine cooling (and handle other frontal packaging considerations affected by the engine) once for all of the products that use it. Of course now with the X3/X4 M in the mix, there is another family using the engine, but you get my idea - and those two share their front clip too.

By contrast, in the 5/6/7/8 family of M products where margins are much greater, they feature more front end distinction.

if the only reason is to better distinguish the 4 series from the 3 series

It would not only allow for that, but without those links to the M4, it would also mean that the M3 could hit the market as soon as right now. That would be big for both M Division and enthusiasts alike.

I definitely agree with you though, I wish they were treated more independently. This would also provide further motivation for an M4 GC - those who want the M4 look, front end and all, with four doors would be able to get it.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

You are too kind.
But I have been wrong on some things. The industry is a complex system. You can decide something on a Friday only to come in on Monday to have it all undone.
The landscape is forever changing especially with the shifting change to Electric which will define design and engineering into the future.

That is true, but I haven't personally seen it. Maybe you were wrong about something I didn't care about (..or something much less of a hot topic), so I didn't follow or pay much attention to it. Lol!

[Powerslide]

In the side profile of the grill area - the bottom grill sticking out farther forward relative to the top grill makes it look like a British Bulldog underbite.

[Wills2]

Originally Posted by Uli_HH

I beleave that Scott is right with his predictions! But the only thing, I don‘t understand is why also the M3 gets this design, if the only reason is to better distinguish the 4 series from the 3 series ... just because they have always done so, that the M3 share the front with the M3!?

E90 M3 got the E92 M3 coupe front treatment and the F80 M3 got the F82 M4 coupe front treatment, why would the new M3 be different and not get the coupe front end treatment?

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Powerslide

In the side profile of the grill area - the bottom grill sticking out farther forward relative to the top grill makes it look like a British Bulldog underbite.

Yeah, that's some funky camo concealment. It's like they merged two bumpers together.

[evanescent03]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Yeah, that's some funky camo concealment. It's like they merged two bumpers together.

this is what made me think it might be smaller grilles tho ...looks like separate elements and is a newer mule from what I can tell, right? seems weird they would be going away from the final design but I also don't know how they decide what parts to bolt onto the mules ... maybe some old bumpers that were reject designs and just being used to collect bugs and stir up the forums? lol.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

this is what made me think it might be smaller grilles tho ...looks like separate elements and is a newer mule from what I can tell, right? seems weird they would be going away from the final design but I also don't know how they decide what parts to bolt onto the mules ... maybe some old bumpers that were reject designs and just being used to collect bugs and stir up the forums? lol.

That, or probably cooling/heating, clearance testing, etc.....but probably to stir us up. Lol! J/K! All the mules seem to be in various states of tune or designed for different purposes. Like the Ring mules. They seem to all have G20 bumpers.

[F85MTuNED]

Hmmmm... interesting... leaning more and more towards the G80 Each day 🤔

[Mintsopoulos]

Cant wait to actually see this thing revealed. Something about a sports sedan just gives me the feels.