[bm323]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

AM&S SA Road and Track test.

He tests and talks about many point of interests, such as brake by wire, 8AT, 10-level MDM, lag and boost threshold, sharpness of handling etc. Overall a positive review. Subtitles available.

Hi, what is the reviewer commenting regarding below? I'm not sure whether I fully understand

2:25 and 4:00 steering?
6:00 steering feedback?
6:50 lag and boost - some lag below 3000 rpm?

[frankiebones]

Originally Posted by ringo9

As someone who's waited a few years to be able to get in a M-car that could also serve as the family driver (partially) I'll have to disagree with some comments about how rounding off the edge and character of the previous car in order to be more easily driveable by the average driver is a positive thing. No, it's not positive at all, it's quite the opposite. After several years driving the safe and efficient VW/Audi performance offerings it was exactly the F80's distinctive and focused personality that has drawn me into looking for one lately. If I just wanted a car that would feel smooth and friendly all the time the RS4 would be an easy pick, while also looking so much better, confident and cohesive without shouting about it as the new M3.

Seems like the options for anyone after such a car featuring the old-school focus and dedication that requires respect and effort from its driver in order to reveal its rewards are staying very limited between the F80 M3 Comp and the Giulia QV. I test drove the last Comp and yes, in the most aggressive mode the DCT is ridiculously harsh but it stands out for that (among other things), in the end we only stick to and remember the special experiences rather than the common ones don't we?
I mean of-course I can understand the G80 being easier and more friendly should be much less intimidating to the inexperienced/not so capable driver and sales wise it makes absolute sense. It's just that the M3 was one of the last modern day cars to stick to that ethos and it's kinda disappointing to see they couldn't resist following the easy path: Throw more powa and stiffness to it to mask its (frankly silly) new weight, dial back the behaviour a bit, and the figures should do the rest. Even reading how much attention is being given to 0-60 and 1/4 mile times (couldn't care less when talking about a M3 really) is showing the direction things are taking.

As mentioned, there's already a great car for whoever is after that all-roundness and it;s the M340i, why make an improved but similar car of that? You should be allowed to go crazy with your range topper, especially when you carry such a legendary badge, at least that's how I see it and feel about it.

You don't know what you don't know. The base F80 in the early years was VERY temperamental and not in a good way (trust me, I put 60k miles on one). You have an F80 yet? I noticed you're going for the comp based on your profile? Then you are talking out of both sides of your mouth, as that's the more refined less temperamental of the F80s.

My CS is still insane to drive but it has yet to try and kill me.

[frankiebones]

Originally Posted by ringo9

Except if you watch both reviews, you can see that this time the M3 has lost for all the wrong reasons imo. Meaning whereas the F80 was deemed a bit too serious, a bit too firm and less able to entertain you without demanding your full attention (fine for many M-owners and in fact a part of its appeal), the G80 takes the opposite approach of being dialed back, less aggressive, less intimidating, ultimately less special and (I reckon) more easily forgettable. Despite not being perfect, the F80 was at least full of M-character and there weren't really any other cars to choose from if that's what you were after. The G80 has traded part of that to appeal to a broader, non-M audience, different things.

Besides, if it still can't beat the Giulia you might just as well stick with the better looking car than having to walk up to that thing every morning right?

I mean, sure, the G80 will be easier to drive. The F80 was difficult to drive for the wrong reasons though, to use your same logic. Front end was unpredictable, traction was hard to come by, etc. Got my heart going many times for the wrong reasons. I'm 38, been driving performance cars my entire adult life, and the F80 is my all time favorite car that I've ever owned. However, the things they changed about it are the things I would have asked them to change about it.

I gotta ask, are you a recently banned member coming back under a new account? You know your sh*t and you hate the G80 so...

[Scorp!on]

You people do realize that a performance car manufactor wants to do one thing: a good car.
Not a car like you people tell with the "temper" which you call M Character.
It was the tech at that time, tech improved, car improved.
Simple as that.

A performance car has to be controllable, fast, predictable.
Never heard a race car driver saying he wants an unpredictable car on the track...

I understand that people like that character. At this point get a Giulia, this car tries to kill you all the time (when switched off everything of course).

[scoale]

Originally Posted by JamesThrottle

I'm partial to it on a frozen portimao blue M3. But that's about it. Maybe another colour or two. But our license plates offset it horribly

The intro to the review was OMG funny...."why do we keep meeting in the dark"

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Scorp!on

You people do realize that a performance car manufactor wants to do one thing: a good car.
Not a car like you people tell with the "temper" which you call M Character.
It was the tech at that time, tech improved, car improved.
Simple as that.

A performance car has to be controllable, fast, predictable.
Never heard a race car driver saying he wants an unpredictable car on the track...

I understand that people like that character. At this point get a Giulia, this car tries to kill you all the time (when switched off everything of course).

Right?!? I've never once heard any car/bike racer desire a car or bike that isn't predictable and controllable at 9/10ths or 10/10ths.

[m630]

These are not race cars, so why does so many compare it to what the extremes are? They are big street cars that are really fast. Very big difference. This is the true problem bmw has caused with the cars and the numbers.

People think cause its still called an M3 / (M4) that its the track darling of decades ago. No one that drives professionally is taking a G M3/4 to the track for fun or to make a living. Its a big coupe/saloon which ever you choose, near 4k lbs (not incl awd) and just big overall. Yeah peps may still autocross or track it because they are conditioned to being able to track an M3, but come on, these are not track toys, F8x was already big and now, forgettaboutit.

Id expect by now with this car moving so far up class and upmarket that those that can afford this can also afford a track toy for those events.

Maybe 1% will use frequently but why one would choose a car like this to track and worry about the performance at 9/10s or beyond when youre hauling 4k+ lbs is beyond my understanding.

Heck, now almost everyone talks about 0-60 for an M3, an M3!!!??? When did an M3 become a 1/4mile car? Just soo soo far from what M once stood for and some of us like myself still cant believe the direction the new cars have taken. I dont even care to discuss the looks anymore, its the whole package that is so un-M3 like.

But I luv the interior and the M5 is just too big for my needs so im still waiting on the next M2 to make my decision.

[bri1042]

The Car Magazine M4 vs. 911 video was a reminder regarding just how much these cars cost in the UK. Wow. UK M4 Comp is 100k US Dollars to START with.

The Porsche vs BMW equation is so different for our UK friends than it is for US folk.

Base M4 Comp in US Dollars:

UK - $105861.33
US - $74700.00

Base 911 Carrera in US Dollars:
UK - 115242.77
US - 99200.00

It's a lot easier to exceed a low-spec 911 with options on the M4 Comp in the UK than it is in the US, and the difference in cost between the cars US vs UK is much worse for the BMW.

[Jcali86]

Originally Posted by bri1042

The Car Magazine M4 vs. 911 video was a reminder regarding just how much these cars cost in the UK. Wow. UK M4 Comp is 100k US Dollars to START with.

The Porsche vs BMW equation is so different for our UK friends than it is for US folk.

Base M4 Comp in US Dollars:

UK - $105861.33
US - $74700.00

Base 911 Carrera in US Dollars:
UK - 115242.77
US - 99200.00

It's a lot easier to exceed a low-spec 911 with options on the M4 Comp in the UK than it is in the US, and the difference in cost between the cars US vs UK is much worse for the BMW.

The UK cars come hugely specced already, have to be converted to right hand drive and it's standard to get about 10-20% discounts, they are priced higher for that reason. Also it doesn't of course work like that, a pounds buying power is not the same as a dollars, you can't just do a straight conversion.

[bri1042]

Originally Posted by Jcali86

The UK cars come hugely specced already, have to be converted to right hand drive and it's standard to get about 10-20% discounts, they are priced higher for that reason. Also it doesn't of course work like that, a pounds buying power is not the same as a dollars, you can't just do a straight conversion.

True, but the UK BMW vs. Porsche reviews are always way off. You can't get a GT4 Cayman here for even close to an M2C price, and you can't get a 911 Carrera for the price of an M4, or even close most of the time.

The UK reviewers are accurate talking about their own buying experiences and US folk watching YouTube just run with it.

[mcjohnsonsg]

Originally Posted by bri1042

The Car Magazine M4 vs. 911 video was a reminder regarding just how much these cars cost in the UK. Wow. UK M4 Comp is 100k US Dollars to START with.

The Porsche vs BMW equation is so different for our UK friends than it is for US folk.

Base M4 Comp in US Dollars:

UK - $105861.33
US - $74700.00

Base 911 Carrera in US Dollars:
UK - 115242.77
US - 99200.00

It's a lot easier to exceed a low-spec 911 with options on the M4 Comp in the UK than it is in the US, and the difference in cost between the cars US vs UK is much worse for the BMW.

But the base MSRP of a UK M4C will be quoted with tax already included. Need to add that into the US number (which varies state to state) to do a fair comparison. Plus I think the UK car comes with some things that are options in US , such as CF interior trim.

[zamboni]

Originally Posted by mcjohnsonsg

But the base MSRP of a UK M4C will be quoted with tax already included. Need to add that into the US number (which varies state to state) to do a fair comparison. Plus I think the UK car comes with some things that are options in US , such as CF interior trim.

Regardless whether you're getting a BMW or Porsche US had the lowest prices on both cars due to demand.

[Pantagathus]

Originally Posted by bri1042

The Car Magazine M4 vs. 911 video was a reminder regarding just how much these cars cost in the UK. Wow. UK M4 Comp is 100k US Dollars to START with.

The Porsche vs BMW equation is so different for our UK friends than it is for US folk.

Base M4 Comp in US Dollars:

UK - $105861.33
US - $74700.00

Base 911 Carrera in US Dollars:
UK - 115242.77
US - 99200.00

It's a lot easier to exceed a low-spec 911 with options on the M4 Comp in the UK than it is in the US, and the difference in cost between the cars US vs UK is much worse for the BMW.

+1

911/M4 aren't in the same ball park price-wise in the US, even without having fun with your options you're going to be $40k more for the Porsche. That's a lot of money.

[KillerExcessive]

Originally Posted by Pantagathus

+1

911/M4 aren't in the same ball park price-wise in the US, even without having fun with your options you're going to be $40k more for the Porsche. That's a lot of money.

In other words, 50% more expensive than the BMW. That's what puts the Porsche ownership in a different bracket for me.

I'm sure they are amazing, but that puts Porsche out of the "normal cars" category and puts them into the "too much money to burn" category for me, aka even if I can afford it, I need to have nothing better to do with my money than throwing it at Porsche in order to buy one. *Disclaimer: I never buy used cars.

[frankiebones]

Originally Posted by KillerExcessive

In other words, 50% more expensive than the BMW. That's what puts the Porsche ownership in a different bracket for me.

I'm sure they are amazing, but that puts Porsche out of the "normal cars" category and puts them into the "too much money to burn" category for me, aka even if I can afford it, I need to have nothing better to do with my money than throwing it at Porsche in order to buy one. *Disclaimer: I never buy used cars.

As I have previously said, my last 4 car purchases could have been Porsche's. It's been in my price range. But I really love the aesthetics of the M3 versus a 911 carrera S (different story versus turbos or GT cars). I appreciate value. I appreciate that I can put 20k miles a year on an M3 and not be signing my financial death warrant when I lease one.

[KillerExcessive]

Originally Posted by frankiebones

I appreciate that I can put 20k miles a year on an M3 and not be signing my financial death warrant when I lease one.

Yep. M cars have always been a highly usable product.

[Pantagathus]

Originally Posted by KillerExcessive

In other words, 50% more expensive than the BMW. That's what puts the Porsche ownership in a different bracket for me.

I'm sure they are amazing, but that puts Porsche out of the "normal cars" category and puts them into the "too much money to burn" category for me, aka even if I can afford it, I need to have nothing better to do with my money than throwing it at Porsche in order to buy one. *Disclaimer: I never buy used cars.

I would love to get a 718, I think they look like really fun cars, still have a 6MT etc. That would have to be a weekend car/kids left home thing though, and throwing that sort of money at a car I'd use once a week makes me queasy

[frankiebones]

Originally Posted by KillerExcessive

Yep. M cars have always been a highly usable product.

Bro people baby P-cars and put them on the used market with 12k miles. I'm gonna, what, try and sell one that's 3 years old with 65k miles on it?

[mcjohnsonsg]

Originally Posted by zamboni

Regardless whether you're getting a BMW or Porsche US had the lowest prices on both cars due to demand.

Agreed

[KillerExcessive]

Originally Posted by Pantagathus

I would love to get a 718, I think they look like really fun cars, still have a 6MT etc. That would have to be a weekend car/kids left home thing though, and throwing that sort of money at a car I'd use once a week makes me queasy

100%. I personally think the 992 4S looks REALLY good as sort of a "perfect sports car", but optioned out the way I like it's just pissing away money on a toy. Like I said, it's in the "too much money burning a hole in my pocket" type of purchase.

[MadBimmeRad]

Originally Posted by bri1042

The Car Magazine M4 vs. 911 video was a reminder regarding just how much these cars cost in the UK. Wow. UK M4 Comp is 100k US Dollars to START with.

The Porsche vs BMW equation is so different for our UK friends than it is for US folk.

Base M4 Comp in US Dollars:

UK - $105861.33
US - $74700.00

Base 911 Carrera in US Dollars:
UK - 115242.77
US - 99200.00

It's a lot easier to exceed a low-spec 911 with options on the M4 Comp in the UK than it is in the US, and the difference in cost between the cars US vs UK is much worse for the BMW.

Originally Posted by bri1042

The Porsche vs BMW equation is so different for our UK friends than it is for US folk. [COLOR="DarkRed"] Try Australia my friend:[/COLOR]

Base M4 Comp in US Dollars:

UK - $105861.33
US - $74700.00

[COLOR="DarkRed"] Aust = USD$128K[/COLOR]

Base 911 Carrera in US Dollars:
UK - 115242.77
US - 99200.00

[COLOR="DarkRed"] Aust = USD$212K[/COLOR]

Our taxes are simply unbelievable, which makes the Delta between the two cars four times greater than what it is in UK or US

[jkap27]

Originally Posted by bm323

Thanks JamesThrottle ... please excuse ... as usual forummers who have ordered the G8X or are planning to order one are butt-hurt with anything negative (even if true and accurate) on the G8X ... using the AWD as the pain-killer relief for their butts

i would say just the same that people hoping the reviews were negative because they didnt like the looks of the car...want their f80s to be the most special etc etc...are butthurt about hearing all the positives about the car only one side is psychoanalyzing the way the muscles of Chris Harris' face move the way he says things after all hahaha i mean this in fun i think forums literally exist to debate these kinds of things loll