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      09-07-2017, 09:34 AM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Railgun View Post
Fair enough, but with respect to R&D, the system already exists. While I appreciate it being potentially introduced onto a new platform is technically different, the fact that it exists already, and that R&D for the successor of the F8X will be done regardless, it seems it's a bit of a wash. It's not as though they're developing a drivetrain from scratch per se. Are there cost savings from a supply, and to a certain extent logistics perspective by sharing parts across platforms? Of course there are.

I appreciate your experience, but if using the same parts in the same capacity, how significant are the expenses you're referring to?

Is there a significant difference for the worker on the line bolting up a manual trans vs a DCT? Is there a significant difference between bolting a motor into a 435 vs an M4?

When the changeover occurs, there's going to be training regardless on the lines to adjust for the new parts. All the changes would be accounted for during the introduction of the new platform. Is there any significant difference between the difference of three parts as opposed to four? Welt already makes five different variants of vehicles. Of which, those variants have variants.

Again, I appreciate what you're trying to say, but having two drive train options on one platform added to the mix doesn't seem like a huge logistical challenge to me in an operation that makes nearly 1000 cars a day.

And due respect back to you of course.
On the development side, of course they leverage components and subsystems. But again, these are not Lego sets. Just because it fits doesn't mean it works. You need to do a bunch of analyses (FEA for stress & deflection, fatigue, thermal, corrosion, etc). Once you are happy, you prototype, build and test them (which takes a while just to get parts). You may need need to design new adapters, couplings, etc. Then there is the shit load of meetings with different groups. Marketing weighs in on cost and argues with engineering about not making the part beefier or whatever. Then you feed back all your findings and re-prototype (god forbid you didn't find a deal breaker along the way). Maybe the best way for it to work on the M3/4 without making a new change is to also make the change for the M5 system so you that can keep a common component. If so, then they have to deal with those guys and possibly impact production components. Can they be gently phased in? Do they have to scrap production and WIP inventory?)Are there tooling changes? What about training manuals? How much retesting on the M5 is needed? There is MUCH, MUCH more to worry about.

Then when all of that is done, they probably do road testing and performance. Marketing invariably weighs in heavily. What will be the market implications? Will one be noticeably better than the other and kill sales? What about cost? Then comes spec'ing tires and winter/dry/wet testing.

After all that, maybe everyone is in agreement. Now you have to establish supply chain negotiate costs with suppliers. You now reduced the volume of both, so both will get more expensive. In the line, you have to have make room to stock both, develop fixtures, program robots, develop work instructions for assembly of both, more testing to make sure both are put in properly. Especial tooling as needed. Marketing material needs to be created. How do you launch and promote the car with all these variants? How many demo cars do you make and which ones do you give to the press? Dealer service needs to be trained, manuals created, parts need to be stocked.

And all of this needs to be done so well that both an idiot with a lot of money or a track god can both beat the hell out of the car and car forums won't bitch.

Yeah, it's complicated.

Sure they offer variants. And all those variants incur the process I mentioned (which is probably a ignorant, low guess on my part). But at least they sell tens of thousands of those variants.

Why do you think they want to kill the 6MT?

Recall how BMW reacted to the E60 M5 and put in a 6MT. That was a total failure. And that was just a simpler 6MT instead of a DCT with no impact to the which wheels are driven. It was probably a ton of effort to that. That is why they killed it for the F10 M5. Not worth it.

Last edited by FC; 09-07-2017 at 03:03 PM..
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